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December 28, 2016 at 9:54 am #123802
AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
Regarding your father: if you need to assert the truth to him, do so, but again, know he will not get it. You wrote that you will send him an email “so he does not misinterpret what I am saying”- but he will misinterpret what you will say no matter in what form you say it. If you send him an email, as clear as can be, he will still misinterpret it. Any hope you have for him understanding you… is, unfortunately, your misinterpretation of reality.
Same if you have hope regarding your mother, that THIS time, of all the hundreds of times you already told her, that this time she will change- that will be, again, your misinterpretation.
Regarding dating women- sure, why not. Do the hiking/ no to low cost activities with a woman/ women okay with it. If a woman has the means and willing to pay for higher cost activities- that will be okay too. As long as you are honest with women, upfront (not in an apologizing way as not having financial means is not a badness or wrongness requiring an apology or any kind of putting yourself down!)
If any particular woman is distressing you- let her go. Potentially, you can meet a supportive woman, a good friend.
anita
December 29, 2016 at 8:34 am #123892
JohnParticipantHi Anita,
This has been a pretty hectic three weeks, with all the holidays and dealing with my parents by having these talks. I must say, I feel drained, a little sad, excited, and not really grounded…Like I need a major cleanse or something, so I can start fresh.
Well, I’m always up for a personal challenge when it comes to personal growth, so I had to have a conversation with my dad and step-mom as soon as possible. So I had them on speaker phone yesterday and had a talk that went really well, (for a first dialogue about me). My dad and step mom will have conversations with everyone but me in regards to me, and that makes me upset. I told them that I am starting (meaning the past ten years) to resent them as they never ask how I am, I never feel supported by them and they talk behind my back. I explained that I want a real relationship with them where we talk much more about our feelings and not this surface crap. They have been very worried about me for a while and they are deeply concerned with me. I told them that I would appreciate it and need them to stop making assumptions about me and just ask…Have a dialogue with me.
My dad was silent…My step mom talked. They both don’t know what is going on with me and didn’t understand why my childhood was so bad when they had it much tougher than me. She said, “We thought you were the one child who was going to hold the earth by the strings” or something like that. So, they can’t understand why I am in the place that I am. They thought I should get over my childhood and deal with whatever I’m dealing with, (since that’s what they did). They were finally getting the picture. I explained, well first off if you want to understand what I’m going through, read about C-PTSD…But most importantly, I want us to communicate on a deeper level. I want you both to be compassionate about what I’m going through and be supportive, not undermining me. I want us to be on the same side and have us be a team. They both agreed that they haven’t been very open with me and they were scared to talk to me as it would rehash the past and it might make me more upset. I told them that I personally need to have deeper communication with them and they agreed to the best they can. I didn’t go into detail about my ex-wife or when I was child, but I will do that when I see them in Feb. and they are very excited to see me and talk more about this.
So, I think it went well. And yes Anita, I will go deeper with them about my childhood and my father as well. It’s been really interesting, all the children feel it’s us against our parents (dad and step-mom), and I was the first person to really have a come to jesus talk with them. Lets see what happens from here.On another note…Dating…:) One of the most important things I’m looking for in a partner is someone who is very sweet, feminine, and who really loves me, (along with other traits of course). I’m wondering if that’s because my mother was always yelling at me that I’m looking for someone more compassionate and calm? Just tossing that out there. 🙂
And I’m feeling a little insecure about the fact that I’m not currently working a full time job. I know that women want someone who is gainfully employed, successful, and has their shit together, and I’m not really any of those…yet ;). And I don’t blame them in a way. How can I expect to date an amazing woman if I’m not amazing myself, (meaning the above statement).Anyway, thank you so much Anita for all your support and really pushing me to confront my parents about this. A dialogue has started, and what I need has been issued…:) . And
December 29, 2016 at 9:12 am #123895AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
You are welcome.
Regarding dating, you wrote: “How can I expect to date an amazing woman if I’m not amazing myself”-
if only amazing people (as in perfectly or adequately fitting certain criteria) were the ones dating, there would be hardly any dating going on. Women who intend to date only employed men will not, or should not date you. But there are women who will be okay with it. There are women that like to take care of men. There are different dating motivations for different women. Find a fit. Make it work for you, and be it a Win-Win for both.
Regarding your father and his wife: you expressed yourself to them very, very well. Excellent. I read your account once, and now I will read it again and comment on it:
“….had a talk that went really well (for a first dialogue about me)”- good, you talked about YOU and not about trivia, excellent!
“…I told them that I am starting (meaning the past ten years) to resent them as they never ask how I am, I never feel supported by them and they talk behind my back.”- Excellent assertion, honest and assertive.
“I explained that I want a real relationship with them where we talk much more about our feelings and not this surface crap…I told them that I would appreciate it and need them to stop making assumptions about me and just ask…Have a dialogue with me”- honest and assertive, excellent. My hat is off to you.
“My dad was silent…My step mom talked. They both don’t know what is going on with me and didn’t understand why my childhood was so bad when they had it much tougher than me.”- remember I wrote to you that if I had a dollar for every time I heard or read parents saying they did their best, or adult children saying that about their parents, that I could buy a house in the fancy part of Beverly Hills? Add a dollar for every time I heard and read this line: We (parents) had it tougher than you- and I can buy two houses there.
The only part of this statement (we had it tougher) that is true in most cases, is that parents had it physically tougher as in working harder for money, having less food and material things, and having less technological advances available to them, such as an automatic washing machine and a chicken available in the supermarket that is already cleaned, plucked, skinned and cut.
Back to your account: “She said, ‘We thought you were the one child who was going to hold the earth by the strings’ or something like that. So, they can’t understand why I am in the place that I am. They thought I should get over my childhood and deal with whatever I’m dealing with, (since that’s what they did).”
This kind of misunderstanding on their part is huge, a huge misunderstanding. “since that’s what the did- get over their childhood, that is- they know nothing about your childhood, nothing at all. So their statement that “that is what they did” is incorrect, as they know nothing about the “that”- your childhood.
“They were finally getting the picture. I explained, well first off if you want to understand what I’m going through, read about C-PTSD… They both agreed that they haven’t been very open with me… they agreed to the best they can.”- here it is, the “best they can”- another dollar going to my imagined Beverly Hills real estate venture. Your mother also recently said she will do her best not yelling at you and not acting anxiously around you.
“…I was the first person to really have a come to jesus talk with them. Lets see what happens from here.”-
Summary: good job on your part expressing yourself honestly and assertively. I am impressed. This is a good step in your healing, I believe. I have very little faith in your future relationship with the two of them (as well as with your mother). As you go deeper into things in February, for your father to communicate honestly with you, he will have to confront the fact that he has been an inadequate father for all these years. I doubt he will do that. Possible- so many things, although possible, are very unlikely. From my experience, this would be very unlikely.
To thine own self be true, surfingwig. Good job!
anita
December 31, 2016 at 9:57 am #124071AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
Thinking about you! Have a better-than-ever year ahead, one of healing. Happy New Year!
anitaJanuary 3, 2017 at 5:24 pm #124449JohnParticipantHi Anita,
I hope you’re doing well and had a wonderful and most likely relaxing New Year’s Eve.
I’m sorry I’ve been out of touch, but the holidays and I just started house sitting in Manhattan Beach yesterday. Staring at the Sunset as we speak.
I had to go home today to meet with AT&T for my internet and my mother took me to the grocery store. Everytime there was a homeless person she saw, she get bummed. It’s like she’s the victim that has nothing to do with her. I did my best to relax and be under control and it was really tough, but I did it. House sitting as been wonderful so far. It’s quiet and I don’t have to deal with anxiousness (which still triggers me, big time).
On another note, I have a first date tonight with a woman. I’m cooking her fish outside and it should be fun. Not sure if I’m physically attracted to her yet. We’ve talked on the phone about three times for about an hour each. She is the same age as me (44) and was married for 20 years. Her ex sounded familiar to me…He was really creative, would quit a lot of jobs, start businesses and then fail…She thought he might be bi-polar, (which he might have been). This woman has to be the wisest woman I’ve ever met. She is whip smart, down to earth, loves nature, and has been through her own shit. We talk a lot about relationships and what we are looking for, and then she would talk about her ex. I totally didn’t mind about that, actually it was really nice to sit back and just listen to her, (which she said she really needed…Someone that she can talk to). She is way more advanced in relationships then I am. Way more. She’s had so many responsibilities that she’s had to deal with (now two full grown girls and her ex husband), that she doesn’t take the time to pamper herself.
We do laugh on the phone, but mostly it’s just talking. I totally feel that there is no judgement on her end, like she’s seen it all and knows how to navigate these waters. Something came up for me though…What if she finds out who I really am and doesn’t like me? I know that might sound wild, but it comes up for me. I feel flawed because of my C-PTSD and that I have a hard time working and that nobody will like me. The thing is, I feel that she will like me though, (through all my wildness). I haven’t told her my story yet and maybe I’ll wait till the next time we meet. I really want to be attracted to her because she is so cool, smart, and down to earth. She is a serious introvert and I’m obviously an extrovert which works out great in a lot of ways. And for some wild reason, I am always attracted to introverts.
We were talking about dinner and asking her what she likes and we decided on salmon. She said, “I just sent you a grocery list of the things you might want to get”. She then realized that I like to do cook and she said, “make anything you want. I want you to take control and not ask me any questions, I want you to handle it”. She did that on a conscious level. I loved it and appreciated it! She knows that I really want to be masculine, and I appreciate that.
It’s interesting. In the past I have been attracted to very feminine women and ones that we laugh together a lot! This woman, we just dive in and talk about our feelings, so it’s not humorous and minimal laughing, but very deep talks. She’s actually someone like me (and she’s a fellow pisces) in regards opening up. My family says, “Don’t open up to soon, you’ll scare women off” and I can see their point. But maybe it’s the right person who digs it and is the same, so it works out.
Please don’t take this comment as shallow, but I’ve had a vision of my next girlfriend. She would be feminine, sweet, funny, enjoys my friends, etc. And this woman doesn’t have a lot of friends, is quiet, and I’m not sure if I’m totally attracted to her (she seems more a tomboy). Now, I know I’m getting way ahead of myself, (which is my M.O) by over analysing everything, AND worrying what people will think if she’s not that attractive. forgive me know, but I’m going to be honest since I’m on here.
She’ll be here in 20 minutes and looking forward to seeing what happens.
The thing is (and excuse me if I’m being redundant) is that there is something deep and beautiful about this woman. She has never had the opportunity to be feminine and pamper herself because she’s too busy taking care of others. Now, I don’t want to change her and don’t know if I can, but that is my forte…Pampering women. Which leads me into a whole nother topic. A number one priority for a man is to have a purpose in life and not focus on a woman as being your number one priority. Is my current purpose in life to heal first before I get a job/career? I feel a pressure around work, and really want to sooth myself around it…Just don’t know how yet.
Anita (and anyone else reading this), thank you for reading this long one!…:)
January 3, 2017 at 6:06 pm #124452AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
Manhattan Beach, memories of the South Bay, Manhattan, Hermosa, Redondo Beach, beautiful places, although very crowded. But beautiful. Salmon is my favorite fish (isn’t it everyone’s?)
I think it is wonderful that you are having this date. Don’t rush to conclude you are not attracted to her, her being like a tomboy, you wrote. She may have a feminine spark in her and you will ignite it.
Regarding telling her more about yourself, good idea, only not in a sort of a confession to a higher power; that is not in this way: oh, forgive me for being your inferior and let me tell you all about my inferiorities. No, whatever you share with her (and anyone) about yourself, do it with dignity, with self respect. This is very important- express self empathy and self respect, not self judgment. And not too much at one time, just some, then she may have questions, answer some, then stop when you had enough, tell her that the two of you can continue next time.
Healing is through relationships- through minimizing or terminating relationships with people who drag you down and harm you, and developing relationships with people who promote your well being.
Let me know how the date went.
anita
January 4, 2017 at 10:10 am #124512JohnParticipantHi Anita,
Wow, great advice..Again..;)
The date went well, but not a match. I don’t want to put things on her, but it was obvious that she isn’t over her ex yet. At one point in the evening she looked at me while we sat at a table and said, “So, what’s happening here?”. I told her that I wasn’t quite feeling a connection and said, “phew, I don’t feel it either”. We totally laughed and went on with our night and it even got more fun. She mentioned that she isn’t ready for a relationship, but wants a connection. I can relate, that sounds like me.
There is actually a Feng Shui consultant that I called and we had a good conversation. She’s beautiful, cool, and spiritual. I’m house sitting here and think I’ll call her up and see if she wants to go for a walk…:)And when I’m in this “woman zone”, I tend to forget about the other things that are important things, such as looking for some type of work, or looking for a support group. See, I still have this thing hanging over my head about “finding a job” that makes me feel anxious, kinda angry, and hopeless. The hopelessness comes from me always quitting. God I would love to take this pressure off myself and really focusing on helping myself heal! So that I can move forward and get a job or at least be at peace with who I am.
My mom called me this morning to see if I was going to come home today, and I said “No, I’ll be here the rest of the week”. She just wanted to check on me. Fuck, it’s like I have these strings attached to me that I can’t get rid of. I wish I could move out…But once again, I don’t have the funds/means to do so. I think I just need to focus on me being good to myself. Which is hard when I feel I should be working. A vicious cycle…:)
And yes, it’s beautiful here in MB…I have great views, 1.5 blocks to the beach and it’s quiet. BUT…crowded and parking is a bitch!…:)
January 4, 2017 at 11:03 am #124516AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
No F word/ profanity, surfingwig, this is one of the Guidelines posted by the owner of this site and I like it.
Maybe a connection with the woman you saw last evening, if it is a healthy connection-to-be, is good enough. You need all the healthy connections, the Win-Win interactions and relationships that you can get! Friend zone is a good place, doesn’t have to be woman zone.
You wrote: “I still have this thing hanging over my head about ‘finding a job’ that makes me feel anxious, kinda angry, and hopeless. The hopelessness comes from me always quitting. God I would love to take this pressure off myself and really focusing on helping myself heal!”
Let’s look at what you wrote. Something is causing you to be anxious, angry, hopeless and it pressures you in a counter direction to healing. This something, clearly, is not a good thing for you. Better remove it.
Looking at it further: the societal pressure to have a job and to keep a job, especially for a man, is an intense pressure, definitely. The societal message is: if you don’t have a job and keep it, you are (like you wrote before) less than a man, a failure, etc.
Reality is, yes, this is the societal message. But is it necessary to take it personally?
I say: no, it is not necessary. You can hold it in your mind that this is indeed the societal message, and at the same time, you are not less than a man etc. for not having a job.
I have neighbors, the man is a retired military colonel. His wife was a home maker all through their marriage. They live in a palace of a home, overlooking incredible view. No money problems expected, ever. He had a job and kept it and now is benefiting financially.
I will tell you more about my neighbors, if you’d like. But from what I told you so far, do you think he is more of a man than you are?
anita
January 4, 2017 at 12:50 pm #124522JohnParticipantAnita,
I apologize to you and everyone on this post for using profanity. I absolutely agree that it a wonderful thing to keep “the board clean”…:)Thank you again Anita…For remembering that I should be around positive and uplifting “people” not necessarily just a woman. I have lots of positive friends, but must be conscious about surrounding myself at all times with amazing people!..:) It’s funny, I’m feeling really good staying at my friends house here in MB, (who wouldn’t). Wait…You know my situation with my mother, so here is the question Anita: How do I heal? How do I heal while living on my mothers property? I want to permanently heal, not just move away and take this pain/anger with me somewhere else. Yes, I do realize that this is a process and I need to start somewhere. I will, but you know what just hit me, I think that this week while down at the beach, I’m going to take the heaviness of having to find a solution/heal and have fun. Walk, surf, talk to people, etc. Because when I think about having to heal or get better so I can work, it follows me like a dark cloud.
Maybe I never do get a solid career Anita…And yes, societal pressures are a very hard thing for a man not to have a job or a path for a job. Maybe I need to totally rewire my head and do something else with my time instead, like helping people decorate or people who need something like that in their life. The one thing about that is, I think about the future. Like, going out to dinner, traveling, anything money related, (especially moving out of my mothers house). How do I disconnect from what society says I should be? And you’re really going to have find that needle in a hay stack the size of California to want to be with a man with no career. Maybe…:)
But yes, I have always focused on me “having to get a job” which never stops the pressure on myself. My total dream (seriously), would be to find that space where I’m OK about where I am and that I might be here forever. That I find something that has nothing to do with societal pressures while still knowing this is my purpose.
It is funny…I have a best friend who got a surprise separation in Aug. He came to me for help. To help him find a place and furnish it because we have similar taste, (my dream job, which I would love to do and started doing). He is so appreciative and says I saved his life during this hard time for him. So, when I’m around SM, I’ll stock his fridge, buy and fix his flowers, and tinker with anything that he needs. (by the way, he leaves me his CC, so I’m not paying for anything). While putting away his groceries, I asked myself, “could I be a stay at home husband?” It felt a little empty. But, this thinking is with the mind set that I need to find a career. Or possibly that I’m looking to live my purpose and putting groceries away isn’t my purpose…:) . Anyway, I believe this is a process and it will take time. And when I go back home, it’s going to suck!…:)
Now, I got a touch confused with your previous email. Were you talking about yourself in regards to not working and all that came with it? I would love to learn more if you’re open to it. And I would also love to learn more about your neighbors.
Thank you again Anita, you are a source of huge light for me!
January 4, 2017 at 1:39 pm #124529AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
I am not working. Not making any money. As far as some people are concerned, I am wasting my time here, since this is not making me any money, posting on this website day in and day out. Some people will think or do think very unkindly about me. And so… what?
Society thinks you are less than a man for not working, so … what? Examine the other thoughts society thinks, from religion to politics to so, so much more, are they ever wrong? How about … often-wrong?
Everyone is looking for everyone’s approval yet who is that approved-of-person in the midst?
When I think of you, and my understanding of you is based on your shares here, of course, what would I consider success for you? One thing: your well being, win-win interactions with others- that is all.
If this can be without you working- fine, working- fine, living wherever- fine. Doesn’t matter.
Can you heal living with your mother? Partially. If you healed enough, you would see her the way she really is, and you wouldn’t be able to live with her. You wouldn’t be able to look at her. As long as you feel the need to live on her property, you are therefore, not motivated to see her the way she is.
anita
January 4, 2017 at 2:05 pm #124534JohnParticipantAnita,
For my own selfish reasons, I do not think you are wasting your time on here. You are truly helping me (and I’m sure others you are writing to) and it’s sooooooo appreciated. I don’t even look at other boards in regards to what I’m going through as I don’t hear/feel them as loud as yours. I have no idea if you are OK not working, but you are helping others!…:)In regards to my mother. I have to tell you, I am looking at her different. A part of me in disgust (which I feel a little bad about), I feel a little compassion for her, and I feel disgust. It is hard for me to look at her and even harder to be around. Yesterday when I was with her, all I wanted to do was get out of the room!
But where do I go from here?
And how do I move out into a better living situation for me? I would hate to stay on someone’s couch as that isn’t the long term answer. I’ll need money to live somewhere else that is a positive environment for me. Just something for me to ponder without getting anxious or depressed. I want to improve my well-being while being OK during this process of not working. That is a very very hard thing for me.Anita, do you have C-PTSD?
January 4, 2017 at 5:28 pm #124548AnonymousGuestDear surfingwig:
I am okay not working. And as I shared many times, tiny Buddha is my school; I learn here and always hope to make it a win-win. Do I have C-PTSD? Of course. My mother traumatized me repeatedly, over many years.
When you don’t work, as you do not, there are understandable and undeniable consequence: you can’t afford living comfortably elsewhere. Let’s look at the twisted consequences: feeling like less of a man, feeling inferior to others:
Many people who are employed but make less money than others feel inferior to those who make more.
Many people who drive nice cars feel inferior to those who drive fancy cars.
Many people who live in a certain house feel inferior to those who live in a fancier house in a fancier neighborhood.And it goes on and on and on. So there is no end to it. Marketing is based on this and promotes it.
It is not necessary for you to feel inferior, less than, because you are not working. It is not true. What is true, is that there is the practical consequence of not being able to live elsewhere, to rent a place elsewhere.
I suggested yesterday that as you share about yourself to others, do it with self respect and empathy. I suggest that when you talk to yourself (self talk) also, incorporate self respect and empathy.
anita
January 4, 2017 at 8:12 pm #124576
BJParticipantsurfingwig,
Just curious, but do you think the main reason you didn’t click with your date was the physical thing (tomboy, when you want a feminine woman) or her not getting over her ex?
I find that when I’m extremely attracted to a woman, I’ll foolishly look over some of the personality flaws because I’m so into her physically. Conversely, when I’m not as attracted, the slightest personality red-flag, I’m totally uninterested.
What do you think?
January 6, 2017 at 9:10 am #124676JohnParticipantSummerBreeze,
hahaha..I feel the same way…I actually wish to work on this a little bit. I am a very visual man, (which I think a lot of men are), so it’s important that you are physically attracted to them, (just one component in the larger picture).I truly think it was because of me not really being attracted to her that led me to not wanting to move forward. We actually talk on the phone now as friends and have already been discussing dates or people that we are talking to online (we are both internet dating). As I talk with her, I see that she for sure hasn’t gotten over her ex…
I have a lot to learn in the romance dept. still. I’m 44 and not sure if I pick the right women. It’s almost like I pick women who I know I won’t like. It’s something I really need to look at. I’m going out for a first date with a woman tonight (just a nice walk on the beach) who is very feminine and fun. But…She has two kids who are preteens and is a little older. She’s not looking for anyone to take care of her and her children. What I’m curious to find out is that if I find her attractive in person, will I overlook the fact that she has kids.
good luck with everything SummerBreeze!
January 6, 2017 at 9:24 am #124679JohnParticipantHi Anita,
Oh, the layers of my life that just get peeled back…:)
I’ve been having an amazing time here in MB, surfing, BBQ’ing, walking, napping, and it’s gone by too fast.I have more and many relationship questions for you. For starters, I seriously think I’m addicted to love or the beginning stages of it. I love courting, talking to women, and romancing them. I don’t know if that’s a good thing or a bad thing.
So…I’ve met a woman online (a dating app) and we are meeting up tonight for a nice walk before sunset at the beach. We have talked many times on the phone and she is full of energy and is super funny. She looks very prime and proper (which I like), but has a truck drivers mouth. What happens with me is that I always think, “I totally like this woman” before we even meet. I build her up and then feel let down when we meet and I don’t feel anything. Maybe I shouldn’t talk so much on the phone before we meet…:)
Here is what’s also happening in my head…She comes from a wealthy family who lives in LA. She is divorced with two preteen children. We have had a blast talking on the phone and I’m really looking forward to meeting her. My insecurities are coming up though. Meaning, I am not making any money currently and she is well off, (she is a physical therapist). I’m nervous that she won’t like me because of the fact that I’m not making money at the moment. I also get way ahead of myself in liking someone before we meet. And on top of that, if they don’t call back right away I’m afraid they don’t like me. Super sappy insecure behavior on my end…I know that I should be taking these slow and just seeing if we get along and have fun. I know that. I want to enjoy this process and see what happens without overthinking it too much.
More things to work on…:)
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