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  • #107266
    Rayna
    Participant

    I’d like to start off by saying I’m a woman in my mid-30s who has been divorced for 13 years and has two teenaged children. I’ve spent 12 of those 13 years single, with only one long-distance relationship that lasted about a year, and that ended about 7 years ago. I’m a very introverted person mixed with some shyness that makes it very difficult for me to form deep, meaningful connections with people but almost impossible with men in particular. Sharing and opening up is a painful process for me so I don’t go through the stress of it unless the person is very special. It takes a lot of effort on the part of the other person to draw me out of my shell by making me feel safe enough and cared for enough to be vulnerable. Quite frankly, I’ve found that most people aren’t willing to put in that much work because it’s hard and I completely understand that.

    I grew up in a small town where everyone knows everyone else. I also grew up with crippling shyness. This made me a social outcast at school where I didn’t have any close friends until I was in 5th grade. In a town like this though, you get branded early when you’re different. I was teased and picked on constantly and consequently, I was always on guard. Hallways that were mostly empty were the worst. I would peer around corners to see who was there and I would decide which way to go based on who was in the hall. I think back and there were a handful of people, mostly girls, that were always safe but there was one guy that I remember that had been around since we were in first grade that was safe too. He never teased me or picked on me, he didn’t trip me or push the books out of my hand; he didn’t close the locker door on me when I was standing there. In fact, if I was lucky, he might even say hello to me and ask me how I was doing. There was never any condescension in his voice, never a sly smile that meant he was going to laugh about it with his friends later. I always thought of him as a good person and because of that, I always felt drawn to him.

    Fast forward to adulthood, and I’m back living in this small town again. I remember the first time I saw him at the grocery store back in 2005. I thought he was another classmate, one that wasn’t so safe, and I was plotting how I could avoid detection. When he turned around and saw me, his face lit up with a huge smile and mine did too. We talked for about 10 minutes about our families and jobs, and when we parted ways I was happy like I hadn’t been for years. He was married and happy, and I was single and happy but I couldn’t help but think about him and wonder what he was like as a person. Since then every year or two, we bumped into each other at the store. We’d spend the same 10 minutes recapping our lives since we last spoke and then go on about our business, but that same feeling of being connected and interested persisted for me. He has long since divorced and has been in two relationships since but I still wondered.

    About nine months ago, he and I bumped into each other twice in a month which has never happened before. The second time, he asked me for my number and said we should get together for a drink and catch up. While the meeting never happened, we ended up communicating with each other almost daily. As it turned out, he was in a relationship with a girl 15 years our junior. He was struggling because he didn’t feel like they were on the same page in life and that they weren’t heading in the same direction. He just wasn’t feeling like the relationship was going to make it. He said that she depended on him so he couldn’t leave her but he didn’t know what to do because he didn’t want to hurt her. We talked about that and everything else under the sun over the next six months.

    He has a difficult job that takes him away from home for months at a time and even when he went back to work we continued to text and talk daily. We have so much in common it is frightening, and we get along so well. I’ve never felt as connected to someone as I do him. No one has ever been as interested in my life, what has happened to me, how I felt or thought or what my dreams are and I’ve never been so emotionally invested in any man ever. The way he shared himself with me and the way he made me feel safe and cared for was unparalleled. I’ve never felt that another person and I were so well matched, and that our emotions were so similar for each other. It was the most amazing feeling I’ve ever had. He led me to believe there was a possibility for more by some of the things he said but I never pursued the issue because I know his situation.

    When he got back to town from work, we continued to talk for a couple of weeks but something was different. He was distant and somewhat cold. He didn’t contact me as much and was uninterested in the conversations when he did get in touch. I knew it would be difficult because he was still in his relationship so I gave him space and time. It was hard and lonely but I hoped that we would still be able to be friends. Now, he’s back to work again and still he’s cold and distant. When I asked him if things were okay, he responded that he realized that he did love his girlfriend after all and didn’t want to ruin what they had but that we could still talk and be friends. Quite honestly, my heart is broken. My gut tells me to run for the hills, to shut him out and walk away while I still have at least some of myself still intact but my heart says be patient. I feel in my heart of hearts that he really cares for me and that we do have a wonderful connection, but that he doesn’t want to hurt his girlfriend so he’s pushing me away. After all of the time we spent getting to know each other so deeply, he’s one of my closest friends and I don’t want to lose that. At the same time, I understand his reasons and sympathize with him.

    I am a firm believer in that if this was meant to be, it will be but at this point I don’t know what my next step should be. I don’t want to affect his relationship if I can help it. I want whatever happens to happen without me as a catalyst and I would never ask him to choose. I really want to keep him in my life and if all I can be is a friend I’m open to that. I’m hoping someone here can weigh in on the entire situation and help me find the right path to take. Thanks in advance for taking the time to read all this and respond.

    #107298
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear dixie02:

    Your history, the fact that you are back living in the same small town, made this man a very attractive prospect. In the emptiness, or darkness of your social/ romantic life, he is a shining light. On the other hand, his social/ romantic life is fuller and so, for him, you are probably less of a .. shining light in the darkness.

    I wish he was single and that you and him would have the most wonderful love story that can be. This is not to be for now because he has a… 20 or so year old girlfriend. This very fact is meaningful by itself.

    Back to the beginning of your story: your shyness, I am thinking started at home and then expressed at school, brought you additional bullying and that is a great shame. But you were not born with a shyness gene and it is not a life sentence. This shyness is fear, fear of being hurt because you were already hurt, at home, then in school and then more. In your mid thirties now, you still have the opportunity to heal from the hurts that still need to be healed.

    I don’t know the future you have with this man, neither do you, of course, much of it is out of your control, 50% of it at least. But your future is more in your control, this healing I refer to. You can find yourself extroverted, confident and authentically so.

    anita

    #107307
    Rayna
    Participant

    Hi Anita,

    Thank you so much for your thoughtful response. I appreciate the time you took to read and reply.

    What you say about him being the shining light in my romantic darkness is spot on. I just had hoped that I could provide for him whatever he was lacking emotionally in the relationship with his girlfriend so that I could hopefully be his light too. At least at this point it’s not to be but would you think I should keep in touch with him as friends? Even though romantically he isn’t a prospect, I value his company and opinion. I just don’t want to cause problems for him. He doesn’t think it will be so my inclination is to continue being friendly but I wonder what you think.

    As for the shyness, it actually originated at school. The large groups of loud kids was intimidating and frightening so I was very withdrawn at school at a young age. The other kids were so outgoing and gregarious I was afraid I wouldn’t be good enough. My immediate family (parents and brother) were always supportive and loving. I had several friends in the neighborhood that I played with daily but theyou attended different schools or were in different grades than I was so I didn’t see them until after school. Consequently I was happy with those few friends and so didn’t really try too hard to fit in at school. They moved the summer before 5th grade and that was when I started making friends at school. The reason I hid from my extended family was that they were all so outgoing I was afraid and intimidated by their big personalities.

    You said that you thought the fact that he had a 20-something year old girlfriend was meaningful. Can you get into that a bit? I thought it was interesting too but that’s because I have a difficult time relating to people so much younger. I struggle to understand what keeps them together, except that he’s someone who enjoys being the provider and she depends on him heavily. What does having such a younger partner suggest in your mind?

    I do have some healing I need to do, as so many of us do, but I struggle with where to begin. I enjoy my quiet life with my kids, family, and a few close friends. I’m happy with my job and my home, and I know I’m a good catch for the right personow but I’m shaken to the core in situations like this. I really find myself challenged to keep my feet underneath me and not get swept up in the negative undercurrents of my own mind.

    #107309
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear dixie02:

    Well, I am thinking the idea of being his friend, his light, while he is in a relationship is a way to feel closeness with him without the danger of a romantic, physical involvement. You can feel the excitement of his company, the pleasure of his attentiveness and appreciation without risking getting hurt. I think I can see a draw there…?

    After a while though, I wonder how that will go, if part of you that want to be involved with him the whole way, if that part rebels, gets frustrated, angry for investing so much of your time and energy without the payoff of (feared but) hoped for romantic relationship.

    I wonder what that hope will do to you over time. Part of you will not be satisfied with this surface contact with him, hearing about the other woman. Part of you will want the real thing: all of him and all to yourself. No?

    As far as his relationship with a 20 year old, two years out of her childhood, that is something to look into, to get to his motivation. What are his possible motivations? A young body/ youth, feeling powerful over a girl who looks up to him as the strong, resourceful older man, feeling he is not going to be detected by a needy young woman as the less-than man he believes he is..? These are just guesses. If I talked to him I would have asked him. Didn’t you…?

    In contact with him so far, did you try to be all supportive without asking any question that he may not like, like this very one?

    anita

    #107320
    Rayna
    Participant

    Hi Anita,

    You’re exactly right in that I feel that maintaining a friendship with him is a way to stay close to him and continue to reap the benefits of his company. He already deeply hurt me when he told me that he all of a sudden realized that he loved his girlfriend after leading me to believe that we had a future together at some point. I’m not afraid of the danger or the risk of getting hurt by him and would welcome the chance to have an actual relationship but we somehow have backslid and I know that isn’t the offer at this point. Eventually I will want to be involved in a relationship and I will get frustrated when/if it doesn’t happen. In the past, in a similar situation, I recognized that feeling and was able to walk away for a while to get my wits about me. I think that would be what I’d do in this situation as well, when it came to that point. He’s very special to me and I would be willing to take that chance to keep him around.

    When we talk, he doesn’t talk about her much. The most he has said was that she depended on him, that they weren’t on the same page in life, that she was pretty and sweet but they didn’t really have anything substantial to talk about. He has said that she judges him and he feels like he can’t be himself with her, that she doesn’t help out much, she spends money frivolously. He enjoys hearing about my life, struggles, and adventures and has commented that it is nice to talk to someone with so many different experiences. Since she is so young (23 is her actual age) she doesn’t have anything like this to share yet. He has asked my opinion on things and based some important decisions on advice I’ve given him because he felt his girlfriend didn’t listen and fully try to understand his position. He felt that she just got upset because what he wanted to do wasn’t what she wanted him to do, whereas I had listened and asked him questions to get a better perspective of his situation, realized that what he was asking was important to him, and gave him advise based on that instead of my personal feelings or what I wanted him to do.

    I haven’t ever actually asked him what the draw is though, why he all of a sudden loves her or chooses to be in a relationship with her. I have wondered but didn’t feel it was appropriate for me to ask, and because I didn’t want to hear the answer that he loved her. He hadn’t ever told me he loved her before a week ago, so it was a shock but now that I know, I suppose I could broach the subject with him. Up to now, I’ve tried to remain neutral on the subject of his relationship. I don’t support him when he talks about her and I don’t really ask questions, but I’ll make comments. For example when he says that she is judgmental and isn’t accepting of him, I might comment that it must make the relationship difficult. As we got to know each other more, and had more in common, I had just hoped that would be enough to see that he could have what he wanted and deserved out of a relationship. I didn’t want to have to say it plainly, I just wanted him to see that I was valuable too, and a good choice for a partner for him as we are so compatible.

    Over the last few days, I have wondered if he really does love her or if he just feels guilty for having feelings for someone else when she is so young and dependent on him. She lives with him expense-free, she drives his car, she uses his accounts for food and bills. She works, but only a little bit and goes to college full-time. I suppose if I really want to know I should just ask.

    #107351
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear dixie082:

    His relationship with the 23 year old woman is a lose-win relationship in terms of money/ material resources: he loses, she wins. In other areas, I don’t know. It is not an enviable relationship as far as I am concerned, not from his point and not from hers.

    Here is your thinking as I see it, more or less: you think that if you listen to his relationship problems, he will see how compatible the two of you are; how incompatible he and she are, and he will, over time, come to his senses and end his relationship with her, starting one with you.

    What in effect may happen instead is that you will be encouraging his relationship with her to continue, the exact opposite of what you are hoping. What may very well happen is this pattern: he complains to you about her; you listen, supportive of him; he goes back to his life with her relieved of distress, relieved because he got to complain to a woman who is sympathetic to him, and so he is able to endure more of his girlfriend’s lack of empathy and her using of his material resources. Frustration will build in him over time about her, he relieves it with you and goes back to her for more of the same.

    If I was you, being still interested in keeping him in your life, I would be asking him questions, getting to know him. You can use any and all time you are in contact with him to get to know him. That will not be wasted time, if you can do that without being harmed.

    I would ask him questions, simple, direct, in as gentle way that you want, but questions clear enough. You owe it to yourself, to get to know the object of your affections and attraction. Who is he? What motivates him?

    Please post again, anytime. I will be curious to learn how this develops. Best to you!

    anita

    #107371
    Rayna
    Participant

    Hi Anita,

    I tend to agree with your evaluation of his current relationship – she’s going to end up ahead and he will be the one losing something, whether it’s money or resources or possibly something emotionally. I wouldn’t want to be in the type of relationship he is in now. I also tend to agree with your evaluation of my thinking, with one key exception: I want him to see how compatible we are without having to hear about his current relationship problems. We’ve had many, many long discussions about our lives and how we fit into each other’s lives, what we want, what we hope for, all kinds of things like that and we have much in common. These discussions are the main reason for feeling so let down when he revealed that he loved his girlfriend last week.

    I feel like we know each other well, but I like your idea of getting to know more about who he is and what motivates him, especially in regards to who he chooses to be in a relationship with. I’ll figure out a way to ask the questions I feel I need to ask in as gentle and respectful a way as possible. I’m not sure I understand how he views our friendship right now and I don’t want to overstep my boundaries, so I’ll work on understanding that first and take my time getting to the more difficult questions.

    That is also a great perspective and I hadn’t considered that as a cycle…that he unloads his stresses about his girlfriend or relationship by talking to me, then feels refreshed and continues on with her in the same way he always has. I am, in a way, contributing to his potentially unhealthy relationship (when that is the opposite of what I mean to do) just by being supportive and understanding. I want him to understand how valuable he is as a person, and how worthy he is of the love and support he deserves in a relationship. By being his shoulder to cry on I may be perpetuating a damaging cycle for him whereby he comes to think that the way his current relationship works is normal and healthy when I don’t think that it is.

    Thank you again Anita, for all of your insight and advice. As things unfold I will post more and look forward to hearing your point of view.

    #107375
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear dixie082:

    I like your willingness to get to know him better and your other thoughts and evaluations.

    You wrote that you don’t want to overstep your boundaries with him above, and then you wrote: “I want him to understand how valuable he is as a person, and how worthy he is of the love and support he deserves in a relationship.”

    This is my point about that: to help him understand how valuable he is as a person, you have to present yourself to him as a valuable person. If you present yourself as not valuable, not important, all-there for him and none for you, as if all that matters is him, then …

    What you are communicating to him is that the person who values him is not valuable.

    For him to value himself because you value him, he has to value you first. So do overstep your boundaries every time (over) stepping your boundaries means asserting yourself, telling him how you feel, what you really think, what you need (ex. his answers, his honest answers).

    Always be true to yourself first, respectful of yourself. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain practicing this principle.

    anita

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