Home→Forums→Relationships→Depressed due to guilt and fear
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March 31, 2016 at 7:38 am #100553ravi_zimmerfanParticipant
I understand what it comes across as, Anita. I would be lying if I didn’t admit I myself hadn’t felt this way at some point. “I wish I had never started watching that show at all, never participated in that forum, never became a fan of that actor… none of this would’ve happened”. That sort of feeling. But analyzing it deeply, I can see that I’m only deluding myself. Everything did happen for a reason. I know that I suffered, but I also learned more than I can express. She learned from me, I learned from her. Be it patience, understanding, working together, not giving up hope, knowing who’re your allies and enemies, sacrifice, the joy of togetherness… everything, I practically experienced with her. It surely did make me a better person in many ways, more than I can express here. It did make me confident when we worked together and I was able to do things I never imagined I otherwise could, all thanks to her encouragement. I may not have been able to be independent in my real life here with my family, but whatever I did online was my independent work, thanks to her and others too. The inner flaws in my personality due to my upbringing were always there, even if I had never met her, and they would’ve turned up at some point or the other in my life. I’m glad they turned up sooner rather than later.
There is nothing wrong with “fantasy”. Everything we discussed did have some practical thought. I guess it’s just my flaw of being overly pessimistic in thought and word, something I’ve always done from childhood. I know the cat is out of the box and her reaction was more out of fear than anything. But like you said, and my friends remind, she’s still very young and in terms of the long run of life, our relation has barely started. Doesn’t mean she’ll always be upset with me or keep thinking like this. I don’t want to do any haste and cause more damage. Gave it a lot of thought today and at least managed to calm myself to an extent reminding myself of this. Managed to study well too, as a result.
I won’t post about her, if you say. But I surely won’t call it an obsession or sickness now. It had become that, during the past few months when I got overly possessive, caused the fight and now when I started posting here. I’m trying to move ahead of that and be calm in my approach. At least I won’t ever regret our relation, no matter what happens.
March 31, 2016 at 8:57 am #100554AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
We are all emotional beings first. In my anger about my own departure from reality with my own walking-into-the-sunset image, I wrote that there is no better Ravi as a result of this relationship. Afterwards, after I sent my message, I doubted this point and thought to myself (before reading your post above): there may very well be a better Ravi, a more loving Ravi. Perhaps her love and kindness for you did make a change in you. I believe, I know as I write this now, being calmer, that indeed she made a change in you. I have no doubt that you know more, you know more about what love is. No doubt.
What I still believe regarding Ravi not being a better Ravi, is that you have not become a stronger Ravi, a more confident person than you were before, not an independent Ravi. You did not become more assertive than you were before that relationship. So no better Ravi as far as assertiveness, confidence, strength and independent.
And so I remain true to my own assertion, and that is, that at this pint- at his point, the way reality is now- that is indeed an obsession and therefore a sickness. The reason I refer to it as a sickness is that it only distresses you and it hasn’t motivated you to develop assertiveness, confidence, strength and independence. It is keeling you STUCK. See the difference? At the present, this preoccupation (aka obsession aka sickness), is keeping you stuck, not moving forward. It interferes with your studies when little time is left before your exam.
Since this exam or exams in May are so important to you, in your own mind, and this preoccupation is taking away from your time and resources to study- how can it be anything but a sickness?
I agree with you then, agree with your last paragraph: “It had become that (obsession or sickness), during the past few months.”
I support your efforts to be calm and move ahead (with becoming assertive, confidence, strong and independent). Please do post here anytime. With our common goal in mind, as stated in the very sentence before this one.
anita
March 31, 2016 at 9:17 am #100557ravi_zimmerfanParticipantI agree, Anita. That’s just what I felt, what you wrote in the first paragraph. I could not be a stronger Ravi or independent Ravi, however, because at the end of the day we both faced the limitation of communicating online only. Via phone or computer. It’s the people I am living with who have had the power to decide what I act like and truthfully speaking, even if I had been in an offline relationship physically, I don’t feel I could maintain it because of how I am restricted at my place. In fact, did not even realize that my anger stems from my upbringing until I discussed with you. In a way, this present painful situation has exposed to me the roots of these flaws that had always been within me, and given me a chance to eliminate them.
I believe that anything in the world, when approached and treated in the wrong manner, can become an obsession/sickness. Doesn’t make it objectively bad. I do not want my loving, understanding and unique relation to become an obsession or sickness. At the very least, I owe it to her to ensure it does not become that. Therefore I am now trying to push away the obsession and focus on assertiveness, positivity and everything we discussed thus far. I’m controlling myself and focusing on studies to ensure that my love doesn’t degrade anymore into an obsession/sickness, and after my exams, once again becomes what it once was.
I just wish I had some way of giving my inner voice a big, hot, strong cup of “STFU” so it did not goad me into doing wrong things in life.
March 31, 2016 at 9:35 am #100559AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
It is interesting, your last line, wishing you could give your inner voice a big STFU- I read a psychotherapist online recommending just that on his website in one of his articles, to become angry and aggressive with that inner voice. He was referring to the Inner Critic, the voice that tells you negative things about yourself. I did that for a while. It may work.
I am glad to read your above post. I didn’t know where my posting of this morning will lead. I was quite emotional about it and before it. This is to show that the best way to operate is to stick to one’s truth. I stated the truth of my thinking and feeling just as it was, even made a mistake to correct on the second post to you today, and it works. It is one more evidence for the benefit of honest communication compared to manipulative communication.
When i stated to you my truth in my first post today, I did not have in mind the results I wanted to accomplish. I just told you sincerely what I believed at that time. Not all correct, but it doesn’t matter: when you have an honest communication with another person, you can correct yourself when less emotional and you can correct the other. I corrected myself and so did you, correct me in stating that you did become a better Ravi as a result of the relationship (just not a more assertive etc. Ravi).
Often unexpected good things happen in this kind of communication. From your last post, your attitude about not turning the good in what was there into a sickness is the kind of a good thing I am referring to.
And as you wrote in your last post, it is in the relationships that are still happening, relationships that are very real and happening in your life where your answers are. Evaluate the honesty there, in your relationships with your parents and grandmother: are they hones with you or manipulative?
I wish they were honest with you. If they were, we wouldn’t be here on this thread.
Be strong, Ravi. See reality for what it is and post anyime. I do open your message first whenever I am online.
ania
March 31, 2016 at 10:27 am #100562ravi_zimmerfanParticipantYes, I’ve read about this inner critic thing. It’s so strange that despite knowing this voice is not your friend and only causes damage and chaos, you can’t help but listen to it. As a matter of fact, the very first time I read about this was back in 2008… the very next day after that neighbour abused me. I was searching online for something else and just happened to come across a website explaining about this issue. It helped a lot because at the time, understandably, the inner critic was tormenting me for not standing up to the neighbour. Looks like nearly 8 years from them, I’m facing the same situation again.
I agree that honest communication between two people almost always achieves the best results. One of my teachers always tells me, that people who tell you the bitter truth despite knowing you would feel hurt, are your greatest well-wishers. I don’t think any person in the world would want to be in a relationship with a pathologically obsessed person who only talks of depressing/suicidal things. Most definitely she’ll feel so bad if she knows I spoiled my exams due to this issue. Might even feel it’s best to never come back, for my own good. For sake of the good that I firmly believe is still in there, I will definitely change my attitude. Your post helped a lot in me making this decision, Anita. Genuine thanks from me. 🙂
Regarding my family, I feel their intentions have always been good but they feel that it’s only they who know best for me, and I don’t. So in order to make me do what they felt is right for me (like the college issue), they did get manipulative in some instances. And also… my mom ignoring the very real issues with my attitude and pushing me to study, I do feel even that’s a kind of obsession.
March 31, 2016 at 9:05 pm #100591AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
Your genuine thanks are humbly accepted.
Regarding your family having good intentions regarding you, that is nice.
I would like for each one of them though to respect your thoughts and feelings while having good intentions toward you, to listen to you and take what you say seriously, as if it matters a lot … because what you think and what you feel really does matter. And it should matter to those who claim to love you.
I am glad to read above about your intent to change your attitude and so, change it. No matter how you feel, remember your intent to change your attitude. You will have to remind it to yourself when you forget….
anita
April 1, 2016 at 7:11 am #100625ravi_zimmerfanParticipantI’m sure it’ll be time for a heart-to-heart with my family once I qualify the exam (hopefully). They have been promising me from long that once I do that, they’ll give me anything I wish. I hope asking for the long-overdue independence won’t be too much then. I don’t feel my grandmother will understand (she’ll just say “you already do have independence”) but my parents will do, hopefully.
I’m trying my best to change my attitude. At least I didn’t go cry today when she didn’t reply to my message, though I did feel bad. But reminded myself that things don’t happen overnight and the path of love is not easy. At least will do my best to do keep doing what is right. Am not compromising the exam preparation.
April 1, 2016 at 7:36 am #100626AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
I like your perseverance regarding maintaining your attitude (second paragraph above)!
Regarding your second paragraph:
are you a prisoner waiting to be freed by your jailers?
And if you don’t clarify the exams, then you are not freed by your jailers?
And what if this is a manipulation, the promise of you getting anything you wish?
And what if, and this is no longer a question in my mind, this is a statement:
There is no such thing as you, Ravi, getting anything you wish at any time in your life, not now and not if you clear the exams. Your parents are not wish givers, they are not capable of giving you what you wish.
You have to reach out and take what you wish, responsibly.
It is a child’s view that parents are all powerful and can give the child all that the child wishes. Study as hard as you can and focus on studying because it is your individual goal. Do not expect to be given freedom or anything else that you wish for other than a food specialty, a material gift of some sort (this is ALL they can give you).
You will have to initiate and pursue your own freedom, your own… everything that matters. Please be strong, Ravi: you can make wonderful things happen in your life! I am trying to stir you in the right direction of thinking and believing so that indeed you get a lot of what you wish for. Only it will be you initiating, taking action and this has to start with seeing reality for what it is and forming a realistic, true to reality thinking and believing.
anita
April 1, 2016 at 10:01 am #100636ravi_zimmerfanParticipantYou are very right about that, Anita. I had never really thought of it that way. I cannot really comment on its veracity since I’ve not practically tested it myself, but my parents often say – “if it weren’t for fear of your grandma’s anger, we’d have given you freedom long back”. But there was this incident back in school days when I was cycling to school and met with a small accident. When I came home, my grandma didn’t say anything but my mom shouted at me and after that, I had to reduce going out on cycle and completely stopped after leaving school.
Now sadly, it’s not just due to family but as a result of the inertia developed from years of this situation, I myself don’t feel like going out anywhere. I don’t feel like attending parties or even visiting friends, and merely sit at home on the PC or reading books. I don’t feel like I have confidence to even to go to a shop and buy something since I was never given money to use and to this day, if I ever needed anything, it was always my parents paying next to me with the wallet, never me. I guess the neighbour was right in a way saying I’ve become a dummy. Will take a good deal of time to change myself, and then become independent in true sense of the word.
April 1, 2016 at 10:13 am #100651AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
I just read your first two and a half line and before going further, I will comment on the amazing thing your parents often say: “If it weren’t for your grandma’s anger, we’d have given you freedom long back.”
This is a very meaningful statement, especially it being repeated often. What it means is that both your father and mother are prisoners of your grandmother. Even though both are way older than you, they themselves are prisoners of your grandma’s anger.
How can prisoners give you freedom? If they haven’t tried or haven’t been able to free themselves, how can they free you?
This is so powerful, their statement, that I don’t want to respond to the rest of your post at this point.
So telling….
anita
April 1, 2016 at 7:48 pm #100678ravi_zimmerfanParticipantIt’s true Anita, what you said. At least that’s what they keep telling me. Honestly though, I feel a lot of times they overreact. They say that they cannot go out since she’ll shout at them, they cannot let me go anywhere without them as she won’t allow and we cannot stay out after a particular amount of time as again the fights will start. I said that they could just do anything they wish, come home and ignore the shouting, and stay away from her until she becomes calm and normal (which almost always happens within 1-2 hours or so). That way the problem can be easily managed without any trouble. But they don’t do that, instead they engage with her and escalate it. Either way I really don’t like the way these things go here. I want to qualify this exam and then strive for freedom as discussed.
April 1, 2016 at 8:02 pm #100679AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
I like this sentence very much: “I want to qualify this exam and then strive for freedom.”
As I read your short post about the dynamic in your home, I felt some anger and started typing … but then deleted. What is the point? I can’t change what is happening in your home and you can’t change what is happening between your parents and grandmother. This kind of bullying between family members as in your home is not unusual, not the specifics in your home, but bullying in homes is very common. But children don’t know it can be different, and as you never lived outside your home, you probably thought nothing much of it. But can you imagine now how different things can be for you?
The home that you will have someday, there will be no bullies in it, no prisoners. Nobody throwing tantrums on a regular basis so to bully the others, no arguments, no fuss… You can make the rules of your own home. This is what freedom is about: you make the rules in your own home.
Do study then, calmly, with all your brain power. Freedom is a worthy pursuit.
anita
April 1, 2016 at 8:16 pm #100680ravi_zimmerfanParticipantI don’t even know if I would call it bullying, or if there really are any prisoners or jailors or whatever. My personal observation is that the majority of it, from both sides, is merely creating problems where there are none. She complains about them, they complain about her. Both sides have some valid complaints and also have done things I feel they shouldn’t have. At the end, I am not interested in these family politics but I get sandwiched in between, and the result is here to see. Both sides claim I have my freedom as far as they’re concerned, and it’s only the other side not letting me be free. And of course nobody likes at all to be blamed (except dad who does accept his faults). Especially my mom… it’s a sin against nature to blame her of anything at all. Now that the time for freedom is hopefully near, I’m not mulling over this as much.
The home I will have someday… I don’t really wish to think of it. I knew whom I wanted to make that home with. And I don’t wish to have lost her directly or indirectly as a result of all this. Only when she’s with me, I can consider my home complete. Right now, as we discussed, trying to be optimistic and focus on the only step I have power over – the exams.
April 1, 2016 at 8:30 pm #100681AnonymousGuestDear Ravi:
Focusing on the only step you have power over, the exams- these are words of wisdom.
I saw an Indian family the other day in the local market (WA, USA) where there is a dining area. They were having lunch. It seems to be a grandfather, mother, father and son. The boy was maybe 11 or so. I thought about you. I wondered to myself what kind of a family they are.
Good night (for me) and take good care of the getting-stronger-by-the-day, sensible, to-be-free and independent Ravi!
anita
April 2, 2016 at 5:03 am #100688ravi_zimmerfanParticipantHehe. I hope that boy is far luckier in these matters than I have been. 😛 My aunt and cousins live in the US, and both of them have done world tours to Japan and Europe all alone, when they were barely 12-13 years old. The kind of feat I can’t ever dream of myself doing.
The getting-stronger-by-the-day, sensible, to-be-free and independent Ravi again had a short burst of temper today. Realized I’ve not updated my progress diary for long. Need to do it today.
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