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PeterParticipantI also believe living in the present, so in times like this it’s hard to challenge living in the present ‘as if nothing has happened’ but also using what has happened to determine my path.
I appreciate your posts as you attempt to work out your experience that I think many people can relate to. How to build trust when trust has been tested and made even more difficult by the hope of being loved.
Perhaps the question that needs to be answer first is do you trust yourselves again after your experience?
“The foundation of adult trust is not “You will never hurt me.” It is “I trust myself with whatever you do.”
― David Richo, Daring to Trust: Opening Ourselves to Real Love and IntimacyI also struggle with the concept of living in the present and memory however I don’t think living in the present means living as if the past hasn’t happened. Our memories are a part of who we are and so present in us.
And then there is the memory of the imagined future hope for…
“The most painful state of being is remembering the future, particularly the one you’ll never have.” ― Søren KierkegaardHow much are we willing to overlook in order to keep a dream alive and not experience this most painful state of being?
PeterParticipantBut now i think i should be the person i seek( i should be the Love i seek:) )
Love that!
PeterParticipantI definitely think that I have some form of Relationship OCD
One of the purposes of relationships is to heal or past so repeating a pattern is expected. Not OCD
The goal is to become conscious of the patterns and step out of them when we notice them.
We will always trip into old ways but the sooner the we notice the sooner we can respond to the situation.I found the book ‘How to Be an Adult in Relationships: The Five Keys to Mindful’ Loving by David Richo Helpful.
Lots of tools to help a person become aware of the patterns being repeated so they might step out of them.
PeterParticipantWhat comes first the chicken or the egg?
Do our thoughts and angst create the imbalance or does the imbalance create the thoughts?Like the serpent Ouroboros that devolves its own tail… mind, body, soul become codependent feeding off of each other.
So with regards to the question Mental or Emotional Prison? Both but its complex
In the hermetic teaching there is a riddle – as above so below, as below so above.
We are influenced and we are influenced. We are fated and we have free will. Free will is just more difficult to exercise.The reality is that for most people the outer world influences them more than they are able to influence the outer world. Most people live the stories the outer world has written for them and forget how to participate and write their own story. .
As above so below, the outer world influences the story you live.
As below so above, the inner authentic self participates in the writing of the story you liveIt’s complex and simple as this kind of story creating requires learning the art of doing by not doing. One enters the present moment perhaps with intention and then lets the moment unfold.
As Yoda said there is no try only do
If you watched the Dog whisperer Ceaser describes it as leaning to become ‘calm assertive’.
Calm and assertive sounds like a contradiction but it’s not. You can be assertive/clear in your intention of what you are aiming at while remaining calm.
To train a ‘dog’ (our thoughts and feeling that have become instinctual) one needs to set boundaries so that we notice where we are and what we are aiming at, set our intentions firm and clear and then calmly let the intention unfold.
The challenge is setting our boundaries and knowing what it is that we want and actually aiming at let alone not trying to control and manipulate the how the moment unfolds.
PeterParticipantOne of the quickest way to lose the experience of joy or happiness is when we try to capture them for examination.
Whenever you find yourself evaluating your feelings you’re not feeling them your thinking them.PeterParticipantI firmly believe that we create what we fear so having anxiety issues is going to make discernment difficult. The car goes where the eyes go. Staying focused on the anxiety and that is what you will see.
Your statement about Not having the feeling of wanting to rip his clothes off, reminded me of a song by Collin ray
“Not That Different”
She said we’re much too different
We’re from two separate worlds
And he admitted she was partly right
But in his heart’s defense he told her
What they had in common
Was strong enough to bond them for life
He said look behind your own soul
And the person that you’ll see
Just might remind you of meI laugh, I love, I hope, I try
I hurt, I need, I fear, I cry
And I know you do the same things, too
So we’re really not that different, me and youShe could hardly argue
With his pure and simple logic
But logic never could convince a heart
She had always dreamed of loving someone more exotic
And he just didn’t seem to fit the part
So she searched for greener pastures
But never could forget
What he whispered when she leftI laugh, I love, I hope, I try
I hurt, I need, I fear, I cry
And I know you do the same things, too
So we’re really not that different, me and youWas it time or was it truth
Maybe both lead her back to his door
As her tears fell at his feet
She didn’t say “I love you”
What she said meant even moreI laugh, I love, I hope, I try
I hurt, I need, I fear, I cry
And I know you do the same things, too
So we’re really not that different, me and youDecember 21, 2016 at 9:40 am in reply to: "It's so easy for them, why is it so hard for me? They're so lucky. #123200PeterParticipantThe statement “It’s so easy for them, why is it so hard for me. Life’s not fair.” Is more likely then not a cognitive distortion.
First you can’t know what others are experiencing so are only imagining that such is so ‘easy’ for them. You also can’t know how much work they may have done to get to where they are.
Second the notion that life is or should be fair is man made measurement as it does not exist in nature. Our ability to measure such a concept of “life being fair” is very limited so we tend to do it very very badly. What we usually end up doing is projecting our fear onto others.
That said we are a product of our nature and nature and the gifts we might have will be greatly influenced by that. Some will be more gifted and have more possibilities then others.
A cat can’t be a bird no matter how much it admires how easily it fly’s. We must respect our natures.
Anyway what are some of the things you can say to yourself when the thoughts come up?
Your half way there.The first step is to notice that you’re telling yourself this particular story with out labeling or judging yourself for doing so. Just notice.
Second step. Stop and create space. In this space you might move on or if the story persists used to identify the cognitive distortions for what they are. Check if you are creating/projecting villain and victim stories so that you might take ownership.
Third, the Car goes where the eyes go. Take your “eyes” off what others may or may not be expecting as well as any any villain or victim stories you’re telling yourself and instead look towards where you want to go. Your goals, your gifts, what you have to work with.
PeterParticipantThe difficult portion is for its practical application, and which is why so many people end up frustrated on what to do for finding a life partner.
Yes, my question is only specific to a personal relationship with another person hence the wordings in my post which started the thread – “How to find a soulmate, a life partner?”
Watched the movie ‘Collateral Beauty’ over the weekend. It was interesting how the philosophy, theology, apologetics, platitudes about Death, Time and Love do not comfort in the times of anguish. For myself I would have wrote the letters to Life and Love but I suppose that Life would have been played by the same character as Death, probably, Love as well. They are all part of each other.
Anyway your right understanding and even experiencing Love at a universal level does not at first glance help the practical application in a personal relationship. Understanding is not wisdom
I do however feel that understanding love at the higher levels creates space in which we might respond to love as a practical application of a personal relationship.
I start from the premises that each of us is the meaning of our life and so our task is in becoming and that Relationships are the crucible in which we discover ourselves and become.
So what does this mean at a practical level?
Psychologically by the age of 5 by nature, nurture, karma, sins of the “father” (however you want to identity it) how we are going to experience relationship is pretty much set and we will spend the rest of our lives working on healing.
What this means is that we will set up and replay scenarios in our relationship, usually unconsciously, so that we can work through them and doing so heal. As in all things the possibility for growth or getting stuck exists.
In a healthy relationship each helps the other work through there scenarios, become more conscious, and end the loop. (The show ‘This is Us’ shows how this is done).
In relationships that become co-dependent instead of working through the scenarios the scenarios remain unconscious and so feed of each other and the couple become stuck. In such cases Love often requires the pain of a relationship ending to push the process forward.
Love/Life always pushes upward to the light. Though it is painful it is still love.
This is just my opinion. Life will put into your path people who through relationship will push you to become as you are ready. By ready I mean open to seeing and letting Life/Love happen. We work for that which no work is required. It might sound easy enough but being open to being loved as we are is very difficult. It is easier to give then to receive.
Understanding and respecting the many experiences of Love as it is, Life as it is, while in relationship you create space to respond instead of react to the lessons you need to learn and heal the hurt and transcend karma. In this space you learn to pull back projections, recognize your shadow, and in doing so learn to see and love the other and yourself as they and you are.
When you and your partner participate in the process of growth and becoming I think is when you discover you are in relationship with a soul mate.
PeterParticipantCan you trust again? Yes it requires work
Can people change? Yes and no. We change jobs, partners, where we live but how we experience life, how we experience our sense of self experiencing life… that is much harder and my own opinion is that it stretches but does not change much.
How can I find out if you want this or no? Only you can say. You say “I know I cannot trust him”. As long as you ‘know’ this I think you have your answer.
Your ex’s “revenge” justification sound immature to me so he has work to do.PeterParticipant‘Fish don’t know they’re in water’ likewise Humanity don’t know they’re in ‘love’
Love has many leaves and so experienced in many ways. I suspect one of the lessons of becoming is to discover that love exists in all of our experiences even those that are painful. Sometimes I wonder if setting up a goal like finding love is what keeps us from finding it. We become seekers lost in the seeking failing to see the water we are swimming in, failing to become finders.
How to find Love? Be open to seeing with eyes anew.
Perhaps rephrasing our question might help?
What you seem to be looking for is the experience of a journey of love within a personal relationship with another individual.
How do experience Love in relationship? Be open to seeing yourself and the other with eyes anew. Be open to experiencing love in all is simplicities and complexities.
PeterParticipantI’m so scared that I’ll spend the rest of my life not doing what I want to
The source of the fear you’re experiencing in the present is coming from an imagined future.
The purpose of fear is to get our attention so that we might deal with what it’s pointing to.
As this fear is coming from a possibility that hasn’t happened yet you can change the story and start working toward your hopes by turning them in to goals. Avoid living in a imagined Future and return to the Present.Dreams and hopes that never become goals are fantasies.
It could be that if you are focusing on the feelings that the fear creates is what is keeping you stuck.
Fight, flight or freeze. In this case the fear of a imagined future seems to be keeping you frozen. As this the fear is about a future that has not happened yet you have space to create a plan and respond (fight) to the fear and not react (freeze)Examine your fears and let them teach you and they will dissipate.
Fear is more often than not False Evidence Appearing Real. Mediate on the stories you are telling yourself and take your eyes off any false evidence. Live now
The car goes where the eyes go. If you focus on the fear you will create it, take your eyes off the false stories and instead focus on where you want to go (goals).
PeterParticipantHow to respond?
For you it’s the first time your hearing about a problem while your girlfriend has likely been thinking about it for a while. So it’s fair for you to ask for time and space so that you might better come to terms with what is being asked of you.My opinion is that when such a request is made it needs to be taken seriously and respected.
That said you deserve to know what she means by giving space… No contact, limited contact, seeing others…. How will both of you know when it’s time to talk about whatever is behind the need for space?
What is the real meaning? The likely hood is that she does not know herself which may be why see needs space, so speculating will just make you crazy and if you argue about it likely end up reinforcing any misgivings she has.
When you both of you understand what giving space will look like let her know that stepping back and giving space does not mean you are giving up and don’t want to ‘fight’ for the relationship. You can’t read her mind (so don’t) Let her know that you expect her to let you know when it’s time to talk and that when she does you may need time to take in the information so that you can respond vice react to the emotions you may be experiencing when she tells you.
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This reply was modified 7 years, 11 months ago by
Peter.
PeterParticipantRead an interesting article about justice and the difference between nature’s justice and the justice of mankind.
The laws of justice are manmade tools needed to create stable community while Mother Nature does not concern itself with concepts of the good and the bad or justice. The rain falls on the just and unjust.
Build a house on a side of a mountain that falls into the sea due to an earthquake that kills everyone inside is Life as it is. We might label such an experience as bad or karmic justice but it’s not. The needs of life and nature to endure, for the world to spin, trees to grow, fish to swim will always come before an individual need. Nature is not personal.
But it gets complicated.
Why did the person build the house on a side of an unstable mountain? Karma?
For me Karma as in the filters through which we will experience life
Paul puts it this way “For the good that I desire, I do not do; but the evil that I do not want, this I practice. … I desire to do; but the evil thing that I desire not to do, is what I constantly do.”
The buildup of karma (this life or past lives) enables us or prevents us from experiencing the world in a way we might measure as ‘good and want to experience it. For Paul to overcome this dilemma/karma he will have to do a lot of inner work.
We know but don’t always understand that pain and suffering can give birth to a great good and that a great good can also give birth to pain and suffering. What then is this thing that we measure as the good or bad?
When we step back and see life as it what we label and measurements as the good and the bad disappear. Karma then isn’t a tool of punishment or revenge but a tool of growth and awakening consciousness. Karma is personal.
Karma is personal yet we tend to project it outward because we want justice we want people to be held accountable for what they do but in a way that we can ‘see’. This might actually create “bad karma”
“First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye”
Karma is personal, about the individual and their growth, a individuals becoming (the all is one, the one all). Every path is unique so the measuring of good and bad with regards to karma does not help much. All experiences push towards becoming.
That said your path of becoming requires you to live your truths authentically as you know them to be in communities based on man’s concepts of justice.
At one level labels of good and bad disappear on another level you must act in a world with discernment of the good and the bad is required and struggled with. It is not a paradox.
PeterParticipantI think in the moment it is best to be present.
Allowing the moment to be about her and not about not about knowing what to say. (Which too many people fill with platitudes and stories of their own losses.)
A touch often says more than words could. A gift left at the door could be nice way of saying you heard and see her. Isn’t that what really all want when we’re hurting, to be seen and heard?
PeterParticipantWe lie because of fear and insecurity.
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This reply was modified 7 years, 11 months ago by
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Though I run this site, it is not mine. It's ours. It's not about me. It's about us. Your stories and your wisdom are just as meaningful as mine. 