August 18, 2018 at 2:13 pm #222045
Thank you so much 🙂 It is kind of you to say that, I will do my best !
I am starting to focus on the bright side : thinking that I needed that event to grow and to be a better person 🙂
At the end of the day, I won’t repeat the same mistake and I hope I will handle things differently if I am under similar circumstancesAugust 18, 2018 at 2:51 pm #222047
Thank you for your time, you seem like a benevolent person 🙂
I don’t know if I have the courage to tell her. I think I will just drift away, if that is okay. I haven’t been sharing much with her anymore, we barely talk and I don’t make many efforts to see her. So I guess I have already started to drift away :/
Thank you, they made sure I would not do to others what I would not want them to do to me.
Well, I have been thinking and no, I wouldn’t say they (especially my mother) made me feel like my feelings were important as well.
For example, even though she was supporting me and she did say their behavior was really wrong, she also made me feel like I had my share of responsability because I was not firm and strong enough to confront those kids. She asserted that if I wasn’t afraid and if I faced them properly, they would probably stop. I don’t know if that is true, but I don’t think it is relevant to blame a bullied kid. But of course, she had great qualities otherwiseAugust 18, 2018 at 3:18 pm #222049
We’ve all done things that we are not proud of. The question is what we learn from those mistakes. It sounds to me like you are a sensitive person. I also get the impression that you felt extremely disappointed that your friend resented your happiness. This made you very unhappy, but because of who she is (assertive) you didn’t know how to distance yourself from her. I have the feeling you did what you did because you wanted to force an end to the relationship. This is of course not the right way to do it, but at the time you didn’t see any other way. So the situation is also a very good learning experience for you in the art of letting go (often a VERY hard thing to do. You’re certainly not the only one with that issue. Most of us have experienced the same thing in one form or another). If you can learn from it, then you’ll have a much easier time the next time you are in a similar situation. It’s good to be there for other people. It’s great to be there for ourselves.
GunterAugust 19, 2018 at 7:40 am #222081
You are welcome.
Did I understand correctly: your mother was there to protect the musician when you said one sentence that she believed offended him, but she was not there to protect you when you were bullied for two years?
anitaAugust 21, 2018 at 5:26 pm #222449
My mother went to see my teachers, even the parent’s bully and did everything she could for me to change school !
but sometimes she would just lose her patience and hold me for responsible because I wasn’t assertive enough :/August 22, 2018 at 6:18 am #222511
You wrote about your mother: “sometimes she would just lose her patience and hold me for responsible because I wasn’t assertive enough”
– it is true that you are not assertive. Notice these two sentences that you wrote regarding your former friend:
1. “I don’t think I want to pursue a friendship with her anymore. I feel awful for saying this, but I don’t like her”- it is okay for you to not like a person, feeling awful about it means that you feel like you are a bad person for not liking another person, but it is not true. Everyone doesn’t like some people, it is okay.
2. “I don’t know if I have the courage to tell her. I think I will just drift away, if that is okay“-it is okay for you to drift away, or otherwise to end the relationship with her, you don’t need permission. It is okay for you to choose what is right for you, who to have in your life and who to not have in your life.
And now, back to your mother. She told you that you are “not firm and strong enough to confront those kids… that if I faced them properly, they would probably stop… hold me for responsible because I wasn’t assertive enough”
Here is the problem with what she told you about being assertive: she wanted and expected you to behave assertively even though she taught you early on to not be assertive, not with her. She taught you early on that being assertive with her (and with others) means that you are a bad girl.
How do I know that? Because little girls and boys are born assertive. For example, a baby cries when she is hungry, not considering that her mother may be busy at the moment, so she shouldn’t be bothered. Hungry, the baby cries automatically assertive. You wrote: “I wasn’t very thoughtful or considerate as a child”- but all children are not thoughtful or considerate as children, crying when hungry, asking for food when hungry later on, saying: I want this! I don’t want that!
You wrote (the whole sentence): “I wasn’t very thoughtful or considerate as a child. Fortunately, my parents who are sensitive and compassionate people, taught me”- as far as assertiveness, your parents, particularly your mother, taught you to no longer be assertive.
And then she complained to you that you are not assertive.
If you look back, do you remember specifics of how she taught you to not be assertive, at an early age?
anitaAugust 28, 2018 at 7:42 am #223383
Thank you for your reply !
“I also get the impression that you felt extremely disappointed that your friend resented your happiness”, that’s accurate. I could explain the events that seriously damaged our frienship and eventually that led to that resentment if you are interested ? I don’t know if my feelings are legitimate and an external perspective could be helpful !
“you didn’t know how to distance yourself from her. I have the feeling you did what you did because you wanted to force an end to the relationship.” Indeed, I may have done that unconsciously to try to end the frienship because I didn’t have the courage to tell her abruptly that I didn’t want to be her friend anymore. But it is such a cowardly act :/
Thank you very much for the good advice, I will really do my best to learn from it and not repeat the same mistake again
How did you manage to forgive yourself after you made mistakes ?
Thanks to everyone here, I feel much better and I think I am on the right path, so thank you all 🙂August 28, 2018 at 8:08 am #223387
I will never thank you enough for your good advice 🙂
1. Indeed, that sounds obvious when you put it that way ! I don’t know why I feel like this, I suppose it’s because I feel like disliking someone is mean, which is totally not. I will try to think about that
2. You are so right ! I know she still cares about me, and she will be very hurt and I don’t want her to suffer …
Plus, a part of me is afraid that she will react badly or take revenge … I know that is silly. I can’t remain friend with people just because I am afraid of their reaction if I leave. That will just confirm that I made the right decision ending the friendship
And there is the fact I still feel guilty for what I have done (even if I feel much better, thanks again 🙂 ) and I feel like I “owe” her now. (I could develop the events that explain why this friendship went south if you want). All those reasons make it difficult to end the friendship
“but all children are not thoughtful or considerate as children, crying when hungry, asking for food when hungry later on, saying: I want this! I don’t want that!” Yes, absolutely
“do you remember specifics of how she taught you to not be assertive, at an early age?” I’ve given this some thought, I don’t know if I remember specifically.
All I know is : one hand she wanted me to respect other’s feelings, to be polite and kind
And on the other hand, shewanted me to be firm and to defend myself when I had to, which I struggled to do.
She said when she was a kid, she was sweet but well aware of her boundaries and didn’t let others walk all over her, like I didAugust 28, 2018 at 8:33 am #223393
You are welcome.
Your last sentence is: “She (your mother) said when she was a kid, she was sweet but .. didn’t let others walk all over her”-
My questions: Has your mother been sweet to others/ to you?
Did you notice how she sees to it that others/ you don’t walk all over her?
August 28, 2018 at 6:27 pm #223481
- This reply was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by anita.
Good to read from you again.
You mentioned about how you wanted to clarify your feelings about your friend and understand how the relationship between the two of you went south. You still feel that you owe her since you still feel partially guilty.
Please do write about it. I will read and try to give my perspective on it.
You mentioned about struggling to be firm and defending yourself. Have you noticed if this pattern keeps repeating. That means that more often than not you are able to respect others’ feelings and able to be polite and kind; so when you do the contrary you experience guilt. And more often than not you are unable to defend yourself and struggle to be firm.
Could this be the basis of why you are not able to let go easily of your friendship with this particular friend?
If it is a pattern that has repeatedly happened in the past, it is likely it may keep happening again unless you take active measures. This would mean practice being more assertive on a regular basis.
Take careAugust 30, 2018 at 3:41 am #223689
Thank you for your reply, I will try to explain how the relationship has deteriorated. I am sorry if it is too long, I am trying to do my best to expose the situation properly.
I have known her for over 10 years ago.
She has many great qualities, I trust her completely, we are really supportive to one another and we never argue. I know she has some insecurities : she’s very possessive so she feels threatened when I meet someone because she doesn’t like to “share” her friends with someone, especially if she judges he’s “not worth it” and she has a fear of abandonment. She has a big personality
To set the context, 6 years ago, we were both trying to enter med school but I was the only one who succeeded :/ I was very very sad for her and did everything I could to help her. She was happy for me me (she still is) but never gave up and she has spent the last 6 years trying to get another degree that could allow her to access med school in third year (that’s how it works in my country, sorry if that’s confusing). Unfortunately it didn’t work so she’s planning to study abroad. She never met any of my friends in med school because that depressed her, and i noticed she was kind of jealous when i mentioned them.
Our friendship was fine until september 2017. It was tense sometimes and I felt like walking on eggshell because she would get upset if I mentioned her attempts to get in med school or outraged if I said something about someone who left the school … Apart from that, the friendship was great. She was always here for me if I had any personal problem, etc
Last september I started dating a guy who became shortly after my first boyfriend. Due to my studies, I only got to see him once a week and at the time, I was living with my best friend.
I admit, I did some mistakes, I struggled to manage my time and I had to cancel going out with my best friend because I had a lot of work. But in the other hand, I was still seing the guy once a week. I had (and still have 🙁 ) a lot of insecurities about my body, so being in a relationship freaked me out completely and she was there to reassure me everytime I panicked.
But she started to be really annoyed I would find time to go out with him and not her so, at some point in november, she bursted into tears saying she “had been hugely disappointed at me”, that “she was proud of herself because she handled well the fact I had a boyfriend, but she felt like I was taking her for granted and she didn’t want to be sacrificed.”. She stated I should have know she wasn’t okay because she was stressed that she wouldn’t manage to get in med school
I apologised to her, I explained her I was going through a lot of thing and that the only reason I started to go out with her less often, was that I was already living with her in the same apartment so I got to see her everyday.
She said that she was ready to forgive me because she still thought I was a good person, but if I was someone else, she would have cut me out of her life. She knew I hadn’t done her wrong in purpose, but she said she “didnt care”.She explained that she was no longer willing to listen to anything I had to say about my boyfriend and that I would have to talk to someone else but she was still here for me regarding any other issues.
Some months later, I got dumped. He was tired of me not getting enough time to see him and he said hurtful things to me
I talked to my sister, another close friend of mine and I got a therapist to get through all the usual sadness and distress that comes after a break up.
At some point, I did say to her we broke up and she replied “okay, sorry. Unfortunately I will not be able to comfort you, but i am sure you can find someone to talk to”
I don’t know, maybe I am being incredibly selfish here but I don’t understand her reaction and I feel disappointed too. Those events damaged our friendship. We still talk every other day, but I don’t feel like opening to her anymore. Regarding her studies, I have been here for her because she had a lot of exams in may/april and she went through a stressful period. My break up was in march and she never asked how I was doing, not even once. I think I resent her for that, but again, I don’t know if that is selfish of me.
I just didn’t think our frienship was like that :/ If I felt temporarily neglected by a friend because she had a boyfriend and it was all “shiny and new”, I would have been confident she would come back to me at some point. So I think I would just have backed off, and find others friends to hang out with before she came back. I don’t know if that makes sense ?
And if she was going through a break up, I surely hope I would have been here for her
I don’t know how she feels about that though,, but for me the friendship is not the same.
August 30, 2018 at 3:56 am #223695
- This reply was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by Naia.
Yes, my mother is extremely sweet, caring and confident at the same time.
She really isn’t vindictive or resentful, but she knows how to put somebody in his place if he behave inapropriately or tries to hurt her, people she cares about or an innocent person
She has been generally kind to me, except when she makes me feel like I am not strong enoughAugust 30, 2018 at 4:39 am #223699
A lot of our relationship troubles in adulthood follow some trouble in our first ever relationship, and that is with our parent or parents, most often it is with the mother, the most present and dominant parent.
This is why I asked you the questions I did. I will ask you two more questions at the end of this post, but please, feel comfortable to not answer those. I am okay with that.
Most people prefer to not talk about their mother, afraid to speak against her in any way, and prefer to focus on the adult relationships. Doing so is like baking bread again and again without yeast and wondering why it is not rising, why it comes out flat. Maybe it is the heat in the oven, so you increase the temperature but it still comes out flat. Maybe it needs more sugar, so you add sugar… still flat. Got to get to the root cause and add that yeast.
That yeast in your case, I believe, is insight. My purpose is not for you to turn against your mother. It is to get insight so that you can improve your future relationships and live a better life. And so, I ask, regarding your most recent post: “she knows how to put somebody in his place if he behave inappropriately”-
How did. does she put others in their place?
How did/ does she put you in your place?
anitaSeptember 15, 2018 at 9:56 am #225813
I am so sorry for my late reply, I was on vacation and I completely forgot to answer your questions ! I promise I will do my best to give a quick answer !
My purpose is not for you to turn against your mother. It is to get insight so that you can improve your future relationships and live a better life.
Of course I understand. I know some problems we encounter in relationships are related to the one we had with our (dominant) parent and I must say I have reflected on that in many occasions. I don’t think the relationship I had with my mom was (is) completely healthy, and we don’t get along very well these days but that’s another story.
Regarding your questions :
She put others in their place with words.
And she put me in my place with words and sometimes it was physical (i got spanked, or smacked) but I don’t think that was excessiveSeptember 16, 2018 at 5:43 am #225845
I re-read your posts. I think that the main challenge you have is that you are trying to “respect others’ feelings, to be polite and kind”, not as much because you genuinely respect others’ feelings but more so because you are “afraid that (others) will react badly or take revenge” if you don’t. In other words, you are kind to others because you fear them.
You felt angry with your friend but you feared her, so you tried to hurt her in a way that she will not be able to trace it to you, and that is what you did with the email you sent to the company she applied to.
You wrote: “I didn’t have the courage to tell her abruptly that I didn’t want to be her friend anymore.. a part of me is afraid that she will react badly or take revenge… I can’t remain friend with people just because I am afraid of their reaction if I leave”.
Because of your fear of others, you can’t be honest with them when you experience anger at them or some conflict. You force yourself “to be polite and kind” so to prevent their revenge. You probably pretend that you like people whom you don’t like because you “feel like disliking someone is mean”.
You wrote about your mother: “she put me in my place with words and sometimes it was physical (I got spanked, or smacked) but I don’t think that was excessive”-
I think her words and smacking were effective enough to instill fear in you, fear of people’s reactions to the smallest perceived offenses, such as if they find out you disagree with them on any one topic. So you hide your feelings, your anger, act polite.
But angry inside you take revenge, such as in the case of sending that email to the company. Interesting, how it is you who is taking the revenge you are afraid others will take against you.
What do you think/feel?
- This reply was modified 9 months ago by anita.