fbpx
Menu

Inspirational words

HomeForumsSpiritualityInspirational words

New Reply
Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 83 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #441916
    Peter
    Participant

    I was reminded of this quote Life of Pi while working though some past stories. I find it inspirational as it reminds me of our humanness, how hard we try, maybe sometimes try to hard… That it may be enough to speak our fear out load and doings so find ourselves surprised that were not alone.

    I must say a word about fear. It is life’s only true opponent. Only fear can defeat life. It is a clever, treacherous adversary, how well I know. It has no decency, respects no law or convention, shows no mercy. It goes for your weakest spot, which it finds with unerring ease. It begins in your mind, always. One moment you are feeling calm, self-possessed, happy. Then fear, disguised in the garb of mild-mannered doubt, slips into your mind like a spy. Doubt meets disbelief and disbelief tries to push it out. But disbelief is a poorly armed foot soldier. Doubt does away with it with little trouble. You become anxious. Reason comes to do battle for you. You are reassured. Reason is fully equipped with the latest weapons technology. But, to your amazement, despite superior tactics and a number of undeniable victories, reason is laid low. You feel yourself weakening, wavering. Your anxiety becomes dread.

    Fear next turns fully to your body, which is already aware that something terribly wrong is going on. Already your lungs have flown away like a bird and your guts have slithered away like a snake. Now your tongue drops dead like an opossum, while your jaw begins to gallop on the spot. Your ears go deaf. Your muscles begin to shiver as if they had malaria and your knees to shake as though they were dancing. Your heart strains too hard, while your sphincter relaxes too much. And so with the rest of your body. Every part of you, in the manner most suited to it, falls apart. Only your eyes work well. They always pay proper attention to fear.

    Quickly you make rash decisions. You dismiss your last allies: hope and trust. There, you’ve defeated yourself. Fear, which is but an impression, has triumphed over you.

    The matter is difficult to put into words. For fear, real fear, such as shakes you to your foundation, such as you feel when you are brought face to face with your mortal end, nestles in your memory like a gangrene: it seeks to rot everything, even the words with which to speak of it. So you must fight hard to express it. You must fight hard to shine the light of words upon it. Because if you don’t, if your fear becomes a wordless darkness that you avoid, perhaps even manage to forget, you open yourself to further attacks of fear because you never truly fought the opponent who defeated you.
    Life of Pi – Yann Martel

    #444429
    Peter
    Participant

    Happened upon Anthony de Mello today as I was pondering the notion of separation. the problem of man’s assumed separation from nature in relation to the notion of the separation of observer from the observed, the thinker from the thought… how this false sense of separation may be the source of illusion, maya, of suffering?

    “As soon as you look at the world through an ideology you are finished. No reality fits an ideology. Life is beyond that. … That is why people are always searching for a meaning to life… Meaning is only found when you go beyond meaning. Life only makes sense when you perceive it as mystery and it makes no sense to the conceptualizing mind.”
    ― Anthony de Mello

    “People mistakenly assume that their thinking is done by their head; it is actually done by the heart which first dictates the conclusion, then commands the head to provide the reasoning that will defend it.

    “Happiness is our natural state. Happiness is the natural state of little children, to whom the kingdom belongs until they have been polluted and contaminated by the stupidity of society and culture. To acquire happiness you don’t have to do anything, because happiness cannot be acquired. Does anybody know why? Because we have it already. How can you acquire what you already have? Then why don’t you experience it? Because you’ve got to drop something. You’ve got to drop illusions. You don’t have to add anything in order to be happy; you’ve got to drop something. Life is easy, life is delightful. It’s only hard on your illusions, your ambitions, your greed, your cravings. Do you know where these things come from? From having identified with all kinds of labels!”
    ― Anthony de Mello

    #444431
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Peter:

    Anthony de Mello says that everything is deeply interconnected. When we stop seeing the world as divided (by labels, ideologies, religions, ethnicities, social classes, etc.), and ourselves as divided ((observer vs. observed, thinker vs. thought)- we can move beyond the illusions of separation and the sufferings that go with this illusion.

    He says that happiness is not something to chase or acquire—it’s already within us. Children, for example, are naturally happy because they haven’t yet been influenced by societal pressures or labels. The problem is that we become polluted by ambitions, cravings, and illusions that block us from experiencing the happiness we already have.

    To rediscover happiness, there is no need to add anything to our lives; instead, we need to let go of the illusions and labels that weigh us down. In essence, happiness comes from simplicity and shedding what isn’t real.

    Thank you for posting these Inspirational words this Thursday afternoon , Peter 👭👨‍👩‍👧‍👦🐶🐱

    anita

    #444486
    anita
    Participant

    Reflecting on the above, if everything is deeply connected, it wouldn’t have crossed Anthony de Mello’s mind to state what is unquestionable. As I see it, everything is deeply connected until it isn’t. Question is how to individually reconnect the disconnected parts within, and how to reconnect the individuals within society.

    anita

    #444489
    Alessa
    Participant

    Hi Peter

    Thank you for the wonderful quotes! It always makes me wonder when people say that children are naturally happy. I feel like happy is the wrong word for it. I do know what they mean though.

    I feel like children focus naturally on their desires. They are just very immediate. It is very interesting to learn that by 18 months old they fully understand language but just lack the physical co-ordination to talk. Yes, a child is happy when they get what they want. The needs of a child are just very simple. To learn, to explore, to exercise, to cuddle, to have fun, to play, to touch, to taste, to eat, to drink, to poop, to vocalise, to express, to move, to cry, to share, to love.

    Even at a young age they are learning the rules of the universe. The rules of their parents. The laws of physics. The rules of nature.

    And as wondrous as things are. The things that they want the most are simply things that get them attention. The thing that they are not supposed to touch. The thing that makes mummy and/ or daddy smile and praise them.

    Toddlers have this wonderful dichotomy. A limited understanding and concern for their survival. Carefully, lowering oneself from the couch. Walking on grass instead of the path, because ow falling is sore. At the same time, they will try and murder themselves by throwing themselves head first off the couch to see if you will catch them. 😂

    A love of being self-sufficient. Okay, if it’s fun and I really do need your help please do help me climb things. I just don’t want to do what I don’t want to do. And I want to do what I want to do while you cheer me on… unless I need help… and it’s fun… or it hurts. Otherwise please don’t interfere. Please read me this book.

    Banter aside, this approach has been working for me. Dropping things. Thank you for the reminder and the opportunity to reflect. ❤️

    #444530
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Alessa
    “Happiness is the natural state of little children” When I hold such words lightly, I feel the truth of them and wonder at those flashings of memory where it was so.

    Hi Anita

    Pondering the words that “everything is deeply connected until it isn’t” What happened between connection to disconnection? Language, thought, measurement… space created between thinker and thought, the thought separated from the thinker becomes other.
    The illusion of language and thought disconnecting what is always connected. – The sun neither rises or sets yet its rising and setting measures out out our day.

    the tragedy of an attachment is that if its object is not attained it causes unhappiness. But if it is attained, it does not cause happiness – it merely causes a flash of pleasure followed by weariness, and it is always accompanied, of course, by the anxiety that you may lose the object of your attachment.” ― Anthony de Mello

    The poet’s greatness is contained in his words; yet the study of his words will not disclose his inspiration.” – Anthony de Mello

    Surely, we must all have had experiences of those moments when the mind is absent, and suddenly there is a flash of joy, a flash of an idea, a light, a great bliss. How does that happen? It happens when the self is absent, when the process of thought, worry, memories, pursuits, is still. Therefore, creation can take place only when the mind, through self-knowledge, has come to that state when it is completely naked.” -Krishnamurti

    #444532
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Peter:

    Thank you for your thoughtful response—it really got me thinking. To answer your question, “What happened between connection and disconnection?” I believe it’s primarily early life abuse or betrayal that creates that divide. When a child experiences this from parents or society, it disrupts their natural sense of connection and leaves them feeling deeply wounded and disconnected.

    Abuse and betrayal, in my view, are real events that cause an undeniable rupture. These aren’t misinterpretations of reality—when trust is broken by a parent, it truly happens. A child, not yet shaped by distorted thinking, perceives this betrayal clearly and accurately.

    Your example of the sun neither rising nor setting beautifully illustrates the illusion created by thought and measurement. We may misinterpret the sun’s movements as separation (of day from night), but when it comes to early life betrayal, the disconnection is real—it isn’t a matter of misperception.

    Maybe it’s the aftermath of early-life betrayal—the self-doubt and questioning of whether the betrayal was even real—that gives rise to distortions and misinterpretations, adding further layers of disconnection within. For the many of us who were betrayed early in life, recognizing the betrayal for what it truly was can serve as the first step toward reconnection within and without.

    What do you think, Peter?

    anita

    #444557
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Anita

    I’m curious if you feel I’m suggesting that our betrayals aren’t real or that any literal separation of relationship needs to be justified? I am attempting to step past the notion of temporal relationship that we tend to project outwards…

    We talked of the problem of rumination. That each retelling of our stories is an act of reliving them often reenforcing the illusion that the past happening is happening now vice the reality that its the memories/labels/measurements that are happing now. To the body there is no difference between the happening and the memory of a happening. The danger is that we become attached to our story telling and its this attachment to that creates the illusion of distance from our natural self and so we suffer.

    My feeling is that everyone has been betrayed at some point in thier lives, probably multiple times, and oddly a something that connects us. I suspect betrayal is at the root of the divide and is very real. Just as even though the sun nether rises or sets the experience of it rising and setting is real, real enough that we measure our experienced by it. Awareness reveling that it is in the latter that we suffer as it separates us from the former. Stepping past a notion of ‘temporal relationship’ the “issue” moves from betrayal to the separation from Self.

    Early life betrayal is real and as we have explored, we tend to entangle ourselves and measure our experiences by it. Anthony de Mello suggests the task is to get back to The Reality where “Happiness is our natural state” – where the sun neither rises or sets but Is and We Are, we must drop something. My thought is that we drop language, and or hold it more lightly and in this way reduce the space/illusion of separation from our “natural state”.

    Aside: religion often unintentionally teaches that we must work and follow commandments and in that way become compassionate and loving. When the reality is that compassion is a natural arising and that from the natural arising such commandments aren’t required. Do you see what I’m pointing at? That the question of our betrayals being real or not may be second half of life distraction. We don’t’ need to fix our betrayals to get back to our “natural selves”. Awakening to the realty that we are already and always Are… the question of betrayal and justifications fades. Compassion and interconnectedness naturally arises. It really does!

    I’ve mentioned before the notion that the reality of each breathe being a “birth, betrayal, death and resurrection”. Birth a state of innocence betrayed, the betrayal, very real creating the illusion of separation from ‘Self’ and the suffering that results, death a process of detachment (not indifference) removes the illusion of separation, resulting in resurrection the return to what Is as It Is, as We Are. A rebirth of innocence…

    The word innocent is often used to mean a person of no knowing, or a simpleton. But the roots of the word mean to be free of injury or hurt. In Spanish, the word innocent is understood to mean a person who tries not to harm another, but who also is able to heal any injury or harm to herself.” – “Innocence is knowing everything (life as it Is) and still being attracted to the good.” ― Clarissa Pinkola Estés (Sound familure?) 🙂

    #444559
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Peter:

    Good to read from you again! Inspired by our discussion yesterday, I started my own thread today: “The Betrayal We Buried: Healing Through Truth & Connection.”

    You asked, “I’m curious if you feel I’m suggesting that our betrayals aren’t real or that any literal separation of relationship needs to be justified?”—I didn’t feel that you discouraged my physical separation from my mother. However, I do see a discrepancy between our perspectives: while we both acknowledge the reality of betrayal, we differ in how healing should happen.

    I believe that recognizing and processing betrayal is the path forward—something I wasn’t fully able to embrace before because I doubted whether the betrayal even happened. You, on the other hand, see detaching from the narrative as the key to dissolving suffering related to betrayal.

    You point to a higher-level awareness where betrayal, justification, and suffering become secondary to an inherent natural state of wholeness. However, this perspective can feel dismissive of real trauma if it suggests bypassing emotional processing. Trauma survivors often find that reconnection requires first acknowledging betrayal fully before letting it go—not simply moving past the story without processing it.

    “We talked of the problem of rumination. That each retelling of our stories is an act of reliving them, often reinforcing the illusion that the past happening is happening now.”- I believe I will stop retelling my story when I fully believe it happened. I can’t emphasize enough how much gaslighting myself has played a role here. I keep retelling my story because part of me is still trying to convince the other (fragmented, separated) part that what I truly experienced was real. At this point, I am highly motivated to believe my own (retold) story so I can move beyond it.

    “The danger is that we become attached to our storytelling, and it’s this attachment that creates the illusion of distance from our natural self—and so we suffer.”- If I start fully believing my story, I will stop retelling it. The distance from my natural self has been real. I know you say it’s real only in the temporal realm, but we live in the temporal realm—and for as long as we exist in it, we cannot escape its reality.

    “That the question of our betrayals being real or not may be a second-half-of-life distraction. We don’t need to fix our betrayals to get back to our ‘natural selves.’ Awakening to the reality that we are already and always Are.”- I understand that you’re saying we don’t need to fix past betrayals to be whole again—rather, we should awaken to the reality that we were never truly broken in the first place.

    In the eternal realm we were not broken. In the temporal realm, we were. I was. I suppose I can’t fix past betrayals, but I do need to believe they happened. I can’t emphasize enough the role of denying my own story—the one I keep retelling.

    “Death, a process of detachment (not indifference), removes the illusion of separation.”- There is no illusion in the reality of separation—separation is tangible, an undeniable reality in human experience. Yes, it happens in the temporal realm, but the temporal realm is where we live. While we can incorporate a touch of the eternal, we cannot escape the reality of time and space.

    I really liked all your input about the eternal realm, over time, and found comfort in it. This realm exists, of course. But the temporal exists as well, and in very practical, tangible ways.

    “Innocence is knowing everything (life as it is) and still being attracted to the good.” —Clarissa Pinkola Estés (Sound familiar?) 🙂”- Amen! The ultimate goal—not to erase the past or deny its reality (gaslighting oneself), but to move forward with awareness and still embrace connection, compassion, and love, “Healing Through Truth & Connection”, as I phrased it in my new tread.

    Peter, I truly appreciate the thoughtfulness and depth you bring to these conversations. Your insights challenge me to explore new perspectives, and I value the way you articulate complex ideas with such clarity and openness. Thank you for engaging in this dialogue with me—your reflections are meaningful, and I deeply respect the wisdom you share.

    anita

    #444564
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Anita

    I have the same problem with Krishnamurti. He is often viewed as being dismissive the problem IMO is language. For example my poor attempting to differentiate the difference of temporal relationships with others, real, and Relationship with Self, Very Real. The thesis being that healing arises from the latter more so then the former as that has been my experience.

    The following I Know as Truth.
    “We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.” TS Eliot
    “We work for that which no work is required” T Morris
    I know this at the Core of my Soul is true. We already have/are what we are seeking!

    These Truths have allowed me the freedom to hold words lightly which I know can be experienced as being dismissive and make communication difficult.

    I see that I made a assumption. From what I’ve read from your posts I assumed that you have indeed done the work and processed the betrayal. That you have come to a place of “Innocence” (after much dying) to do no harm and capable of healing others and yourself all arising from compassion. Being candid I have been perplexed why you keep returning to the story. Thankyou for clarifying.

    The experience of being gaslit is the worst. To the issue of not believing if something actually happened or not?

    As a young boy I used to have these very vivid dreams only to be told dreams were not real. Older I recall Shirly MacLaine talking about her experiences with past lives and noting how the conversation went to trying to prove the experiences were real. Even though I never had such experiences I recall thinking that they were asking the wrong questions. Later investigating Jung I happened on a story: During her first meeting with Carl Jung, Marie-Louise von Franz was startled when Jung mentioned a patient who claimed to have been on the moon, and she suggested the woman might have been dreaming or fantasizing about it. Jung looked at her very seriously and replied: “No, she was on the moon!”. Later reflecting on this incident she suddenly realized that what happens psychically, is the true reality. This realization change her life and for me put the question of what is real to bed.

    The question of whether a resonating experience is real or not has never interested me much. That the experience resonated such a question resolves itself, the experience was and is real. The better question IMO asking what have I “learned” from it? What might I, learn from it to close the distance to the ‘Natural Self’.

    You are correct there is a time for going deeper and I apologize if I jumped the gun.

    “The distance from my natural self has been real. I know you say it’s real only in the temporal realm, but we live in the temporal realm—and for as long as we exist in it, we cannot escape its reality.”

    Here I think I’ve been misunderstood. The distance from our natural selves is very very Real. That it is also real in the temporal is what creates the distance from our “natural Self”. My experience in the second half of life is that addressing the temporal experiences (now a long in the past memory) while needing to be processed leads to “dealing with” but not healing. Healing coming from closing the distance to the Relationship with Self. My experience has been that when the latter is addressed the temporal now long past experiences resolves by de-solving.

    You may notice I only tend to comment on stories that happened long in the past and were a person is at the point where the “Innocence” Clarissa talks of is possible. A “Innocence” you express many times in your posts… So the question what are you seeking?

    #444565
    Peter
    Participant

    Perhaps a better question. When does the seeker get to be one who found?

    #444566
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Peter:

    About you feeling misunderstood, I am sorry Peter. Sincerely, I think that your intelligence is significantly superior to mine and it’s difficult for me to catch up.

    “Healing coming from closing the distance to the Relationship with Self. My experience has been that when the latter is addressed the temporal now long past experiences resolves by de-solving.”- You say true healing comes not from revisiting the past, but from deepening the Relationship with Self.

    But I have to revisit the past- and believe it really happened- because my self was left, abandoned, in places along that past.

    “So the question what are you seeking?”- myself. The abandoned parts of self left along the way.

    “Perhaps a better question. When does the seeker get to be one who found?”- maybe this very Tuesday evening, April (not Fool?) Day. Collecting the pieces left along the past: here’s the piece that wants to be loved, here’s the piece that’s so very scared, here’s the piece that.. wait, reverse, here’s the piece that so desperately want to be loved: “oh love me, love me, PLEASE!”

    There it is: I am seeking love. I know it’s true because there are tears in my eyes. I always sought love, a thing that wasn’t there for me. it wasn’t there.

    “So the question what are you seeking?”- Love, as Always.

    anita

    #444567
    Alessa
    Participant

    Hi Everyone

    I think the difficulty with severe abuse is that it causes structural issues – brain damage as well as deregulating the nervous system. It is not just that there is attachment. If only it were as simple as attachment.

    I truly don’t believe that language is the issue. As I pointed out infants have a full grasp of language at 18 months, they even have memories that last for 9 months at that stage. Language is not the problem. Memory is not the problem. Sense of self is a cornerstone of child development and an infant doesn’t have much of one. It doesn’t develop until the tween years. One of the difficulties severe trauma causes is impairment of sense of self.

    Children have total reliance on their caregivers. From a young age their parents define what is right and wrong for them. What is dangerous, what is safe. Reinforcing behaviours that the parents value. The child experiences emotional attunement towards their caregiver. There is a huge amount of control parents have over their children and that is why parental abuse is so damaging.

    People with severe trauma have to deal with unpleasant experiences of trauma re-emerging. Learning to accept it, let it happen and let it pass. That is the reality of dealing with these issues. Treating ourselves with compassion when these difficulties occur is vital.

    Perhaps I’m approaching this with the knowledge of an infant that developed PTSD at 4 years old. I was never a happy child. I simply did my best to cope with my environment. Children experience the same difficulties that adults can if they are exposed to the same traumatic environment. I honestly don’t see much difference between adults and children. More understanding of the world. More experience and the ability to choose what we would like to do with our lives. Meta cognition as well realise that we do have the ability to shape our own minds.

    #444568
    Alessa
    Participant

    I’m a fan of Krishnamurti myself. I do find value in these things, but I think it is important to take these things with a pinch of salt and understand that everyone is different, has their own unique journey and their are many ways to skin a cat.

    Regarding processing betrayal. Addressing the trauma can be helpful, and so can detaching from the narrative. Personally, forgiveness was helpful for me and even then I’m not 100% there. Will I ever be? I don’t know. Science believes no, but I remain hopeful and at peace with the situation either way.

    The truth of the matter is that the past does shape who we are today. Habits are deeply engrained and take a lot of effort to retrain. We all have our unique quirks and I do believe that is okay. Simply the nature of being human.

    #444570
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Anita
    I’ve been asking myself how I could express my thoughts without being dismissive are making it appear I was suggesting thier was only one path.
    How does one express that the world of Maya is a vivid and compelling reality, but ultimately, it is a temporary and illusory manifestation, not the ultimate truth. and not sound dismissive?

    For me the path of rumination doesn’t work as another Truth I’ve come to know is that – “No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it,” Albert Einstein
    Rumination has helped me gain better understanding and come to terms with past hurts but never healing. Never the Love that I also desired. For that I’ve had to ‘transcend the world of maya’ only to surprised that I already was, what I was seeking. These tend to be momentary realizations as you noted Life is lived in the world of Maya and it is thier that we must find our way, or own path… Only something did changed the past pains that had hunted me no longer had the same power over me. I still had to deal the repercussions of the past but…yeah that’s going to sound dismissive.

    I’ll let Anthony de Mello speak for me (though I don’t think myself enlighten – “Before enlightenment, I used to be depressed: after enlightenment, I continue to be depressed.” But there’s a difference: I don’t identify with it anymore.”

    Hi Alessa
    I agree, I’m a fan of Krishnamurti but in small doses. I’m still coming to terms with how he totally dismantled my notion of belief. Which I will spare everyone. “)

    I also would not say I was a happy child. Anxious child seems a better description yet when Anthony said -“Happiness is the natural state of little children” I knew what he was saying was a truth…. so I must of had moments… yes thier were moments.

    For me language is a problem as you can’t use it without creating duality. Anything one says eventually has to be unsaid. I think this is why Krishnamurti came to the path of negation in his path to know Love. For me language and duality are intimately connected so belongs to the world of maya.

    I’ve been exploring the thought that its motion and language that creates our experience of life within the world of Maya. AI wrote that as ‘our perceptions and understanding of reality are filtered through the lens of language and shaped by the constant flux of experience (motion).’ And of Allan Watts noted most of the language we use was given to us and not our own…

    Anyway their I go again and again I apologize

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 83 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Please log in OR register.