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On Purpise and Shame- what is my purpose? What is yours?

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  • #456574
    anita
    Participant

    Oopsie, my math: 2×1 is 2 NOT 1. But in mathematical context..2 is almost 1 (unlike in human-social context)🤔

    #456575
    Peter
    Participant

    Thanks, Anita. It truly would have been a gift to have someone notice back then, but as we’ve been exploring, we often don’t realize when our metaphors and stories are actually ‘living us’ from the inside out. I know the book was given to me in kindness, but as Joseph Campbell might say, that very kindness became a ‘threshold guardian’ a story I had to eventually challenge to find my own way.

    I love your insight that 1 x 1 is still 1. It’s mathematically perfect! It suggests the third servant was the only one who refused to participate in the ‘forced growth’ the master demanded. He kept his integrity (his ‘1’) rather than doubling a debt to a system he knew was unjust.

    That actually leads into something I’ve been working on but not sure if I should post as it might read political And perhaps it is, but I also hope it shows the process reclaiming a story so that it no longer ‘live me’.

    The Talent We Refuse to Spend

    The Parable of the Talents has long carried an uneasy weight in the religious imagination. I felt that weight rise again recently while reflecting on a public prayer offered at the Pentagon, one that invoked God as the one “who trains our hands for war” and asked for “overwhelming violence of action against those who deserve no mercy.” The language was arresting, not only for its militancy, but for the image of God it revealed: a judge who rewards force and withholds compassion.

    That image feels familiar. It closely resembles the “harsh master” described by the third servant in the parable, the one who reaps where he did not sow and demands results without regard for fear or cost. In both cases, righteousness is framed not as interior transformation or alignment with love, but as output, effectiveness, and compliance. Worth is measured by performance. Mercy is conditional.

    Richard Rohr calls this a “toxic image of the Divine,” and for good reason. When God is imagined as merciless, that posture does not remain external. It becomes internalized. The judgment we project outward returns inward. In this sense, the “outer darkness” is not only a future punishment but a present condition, a life shaped by the anxiety of never being enough.

    Perhaps this explains why the parable adapts so easily to systems of merit. It fits comfortably within religious hierarchies, economic logic, and corporate culture alike. Even the word talent has shifted, now suggesting intelligence, skill, or productivity. Read this way, the parable becomes a kind of divine performance review: those who multiply are affirmed, while those who do not are cast out. Human purpose is reduced to usefulness.

    But all of this rests on one largely unexamined assumption: that the master represents God.

    What happens if we pause there? What if the third servant is not wrong?

    He alone describes the system plainly. He names the master as harsh, demanding increase without having sown generosity. Perhaps his words are not driven by fear but by clarity. He sees extraction where others see opportunity and recognizes a logic of endless accumulation and quietly refuses to participate.

    Burying the talent, then, is not laziness or cowardice. It is refusal. A small, deliberate act of resistance. The servant opts out of a system that equates worth with productivity and enforces participation through threat. He does not try to win. He simply declines to play.

    And he pays for it.

    He is cast into the outer darkness. But here, too, the meaning shifts. What begins as an internalized fear becomes a lived reality. Systems organized around merit and reward do not tolerate non-participation; exclusion is their predictable response. The punishment does not refute the servant’s critique, it reveals it as it is.

    Read this way, the parable does not resolve cleanly. It unsettles. It exposes how easily systems of domination are sanctified by placing the mask of God over them. It raises an uncomfortable possibility: that what we often call “faithfulness” may, at times, be indistinguishable from compliance.

    The servant’s fear, then, becomes understandable. His refusal reveals the cost of a world that values results over human dignity. And still, he is expelled.

    Rather than offering comfort, the parable presses on the reader. It asks whether systems built on merit, risk, and reward will always create an outer darkness, and whether we are willing to call that good news.

    When this story is used to justify exclusion, relentless productivity, or violence without mercy, it reenacts the servant’s nightmare and calls it virtue. It turns people into investments and love into leverage.

    To read this story otherwise is not merely a private spiritual exercise. It is a quiet act of resistance, a refusal to measure human worth by output, and a willingness to imagine God not as a master but as relationship, one that does not need to extract value in order to love.

    Perhaps the deeper question the parable leaves us with is not what have you produced? or even what have you refused? but something more unsettling: Where have we placed a mask on God, and why?

    Where have we baptized systems of fear, extraction, and control by calling them divine? Where have we confused productivity with faithfulness, compliance with trust, domination with blessing? And how often have we accepted these images because they mirror our assumptions about the world, rather than the deeper reality in which love (G_d) is both source and end?

    To remove that mask is not dramatic. It is quiet, destabilizing, and often costly. It asks us to sit with the possibility that some versions of God we have inherited are reflections of our own need for order, reward, and control. And it invites us to remain open to something truer, an image that does not threaten exile in order to command allegiance, or demand return in order to justify love.

    The parable does not tell us what to think. It asks us to notice where we stand, and whose face we have been calling holy.

    #456576
    anita
    Participant

    I read just a bit of your recent post and I see you like the 1×2=1 ha-ha. I suppose a wiser, hidden part of me knew better than I did (see my edit a few minutes before your recent post (double posting)

    #456580
    anita
    Participant

    Just wanted to say I’ll reply further by tomorrow. Thank you, Peter for participating in my purpise 🙂 thread

    #456585
    anita
    Participant

    Hi Peter:

    At the computer earlier than expected. There’s so much in your recent post. Reads brilliant to me, wow! I’ll need time to process and absorb it, at least a portion of it.

    For now, I invited Jung, Campbell, Krishnamurti and Alan Watts to tell you what they think about your recent post:

    Jung: Peter, you are doing the sacred work of reclaiming a symbol that once claimed you. When you question the identity of the “master,” you are withdrawing your projection from an image that once held your psyche hostage.

    This is individuation: the courage to confront the inherited god-image and discover that the true Self is not the harsh judge, but the one who sees through the mask. You are retrieving the gold that was buried in the shadow of that story.

    Campbell: Ah, Peter — you are rewriting the myth from the inside. The third servant you once feared has become your ally, your mirror, your threshold guardian turned guide.

    You are doing what every hero must eventually do: challenge the authority of the inherited story. You have stepped out of the village of unquestioned belief and into the forest of your own experience.

    And look at what you’ve discovered: that refusal can be a form of courage, that integrity can be a boon, and that the “outer darkness” is not exile but the beginning of your own path. You are living the myth consciously now.

    Krishnamurti: Peter, notice how the story once dictated your inner movement. You were conditioned to believe that fear was failure, that worth was measured by output. Now you are observing that conditioning without judgment. This is freedom.

    When you ask whether the master represents God, you are really asking whether authority — any authority — has the right to define your being. The moment you see the falseness of the image; it loses its power. And in clarity, the “harsh master” dissolves, leaving only what is true.

    Alan Watts: Peter, my friend, you’ve finally stopped taking the universe so literally. You’ve realized that the “harsh master” was never God — just a mask worn by frightened people trying to control life. And now you’re laughing a little, aren’t you? Because once you see the game, the whole thing becomes lighter.

    The third servant wasn’t a failure; he was the only one who didn’t fall for the hustle. He buried the coin and said, “No thanks, I’m not playing.” And maybe that’s the real punchline: you don’t have to earn love, or God, or existence. You’re already it. You always were.

    Copilot

    Anita: it’s like you’re giving the third servant back his dignity, and you’re giving your younger self that same dignity. I like this: to give my younger self her dignity back… To unearth that 1 talent (confidence, self-respect, dignity) that the 3rd servant hid in the ground.

    🍃🤍 Anita

    #456590
    anita
    Participant

    Thank you, Peter, for 👉 to where the talent was buried. I buried it because I believed the message of the Harsh Authority (HA) in my life.

    That I was the Problem.

    She, my personal HA, wasn’t religious, never a mention of a god. No religious background. Nothing.

    Her rage made her God to me, like the god of the old testament (like the prayer at the pentagon: no mercy to those undeserving of mercy).

    No more surrender to that rage- or that control, no more going belly up.

    I wonder how many parents have taken their children to church, never expressing aggression at their children directly, but letting the church do the job?

    Like I said, it’ll take me some time to process your recent post.

    👉 Anita

    #456611
    Peter
    Participant

    Anita, that phrase -‘Her rage made her God to me’- brought tears to my eyes. It’s a profound and painful truth that our first ‘images of God’ are often just the silhouettes of the powerful figures in our early lives. Whether that authority is a parent’s rage or a church’s rigid doctrine, the result was the same: we buried our ‘talents’ out of a desperate, survival based fear.

    How easily we mistake a ‘Harsh Authority’ for the Divine, and how much damage is done when we sanctify that fear.

    I hope its ok if I take another shot on my thoughts on the Parable of Talents. I will be using the language I inherited, perhaps fitting for a ‘Good Friday’, so hold them lightly… as pointers not destination.

    The Talent Planted as a Seed

    It seems to me that the Parable of the Talents has always been read in many different ways. As a child, I was told it was about using the gifts we’ve been given well. There was something honest and life giving in that, an encouragement not to hide, not to shrink back in fear. I’m grateful for that early reading, even now.

    And yet, over time, another interpretation took hold. As often the parable was framed within a theology of reward and punishment: succeed and be welcomed; fail and be cast out. Performance became proof of faithfulness. Fear became grounds for judgment. This way of hearing the story sat uneasily with the Jesus I encountered elsewhere, the one who eats with those who have nothing to offer, who forgives before repentance, who fulfills the law not by tightening its demands but by giving himself away in the Paschal mystery.

    Still, the story did not rest there. It continued to be repurposed, often pressed into service to justify capitalism, consumerism, and relentless growth. “Increase” became unquestioned good. Productivity became a moral virtue. This shift happens almost invisibly where we take the frantic pressure of productivity and call it ‘stewardship,’ quietly replacing the unconditional nature of grace with a religious version of the bottom line. All of it depended on a quiet assumption: that the master in the parable must be an image (allegory) of God.

    But that assumption troubles me. As Richard Rohr and others have noted, the master’s character, harsh, extractive, punishing fear with exile, does not align with the wider witness of Jesus’ life and teaching. If anything, he looks hauntingly like the systems Jesus consistently exposes and unsettles, systems that often discard those who cannot keep up.

    In this light I wonder if perhaps the parable may reveal less about who G_d is and more about who ‘we’ are, how easily we project our own fears, economies, and hierarchies onto the divine. How readily we place a mask on ‘God’ that looks suspiciously like the world we already know. We call it obedience. We call it wisdom. And often, we call it faith.

    There is grief in recognizing how this story has been used, to motivate through fear, to sanctify exclusion, to confuse worth with usefulness. Sometimes I wonder, almost in lament, whether it would have been better if the parable had never been told at all. Not because it lacks depth, but because of the damage done in its name. Because of how often judgment has been preached where mercy was needed, and silence met those already hiding their fear.

    And yet… the story remains.

    Maybe it remains not because it gives us answers, but because it refuses to protect us from ourselves. Maybe it lingers as an invitation to gentle honesty, to notice where the master’s face begins to look familiar, where it echoes our own anxieties and need for control. And maybe it leaves open the faint possibility that G_d is not found there at all, but elsewhere, in the refusal to exploit, in the courage to name harsh systems, in the quiet dignity of one who will not turn love into leverage.

    If there is hope in this parable, it is small and easily overlooked. It lies not in reward or success, but in the slow unmasking of the images of G_d (‘rage of Mother’) that no longer give us life. It asks us, patiently, to keep listening, to lay down fear, to loosen our grip on merit, and to trust that the true face of that which is transcendent is gentler than we have often allowed ourselves to believe.

    And perhaps that trust, however fragile, is itself a kind of faithfulness…

    And then perhaps… the parable was never only about talents at all. Perhaps Jesus was speaking, quietly, of what would happen when love refuses the economy of reward and fear. Like the third servant, he would not play the game. He would not multiply power or protect himself. And like the servant, he would be cast out, exposed, silenced, buried.

    But what is buried is not gone.

    Easter does not justify the system that crucified him; it loosens its grip. It hints that what looks like failure is not the final word, and that what is hidden may yet rise, not by effort, but by grace.

    Even the talent left in the ground waits…

    #456612
    anita
    Participant

    Hey Peter:

    Of course it’s okay that you share more of your thoughts on The Parable of Talents. All your thoughts are welcome here 🙂

    That something I wrote brought tears to your eyes, that.. I don’t have the words.. it feels like we’re talking irl and I see your tears and you see mine and no one gets scared or runs away.

    I didn’t pay attention to the wording and what it means (her rage made her God to me) until you reflected on it in your first paragraph.

    She was God to me and I saw God everywhere.

    The first words of Genesis come to mind (in Hebrew), translated and rephrased: In the Beginning, there was mother, and mother was tohoo-vavohoo (chaotic, messed up, upside down.. volatile), and she created the sky and the earth of my life- in her tohoo vavohoo image, and darkness was over the abyss, and the spirit of (the unmasked) God floating above the water.. wondering what went wrong 🤔

    Oh, is today Good Friday? I didn’t know.

    I didn’t read all of your Good Friday post and would like to do so later.

    One week to Easter thenou: I did notice more rabbits around. Bogart the beagle (my first ever dog) is trained to track rabbit scent. It’s funny how yhey’re running in front of him but he doesn’t 👀 them because he’s locked into 👃 smelling them.

    🐇🐇🐇🐇🐇🐇🐇🐇 Anita

    #456626
    anita
    Participant

    “What is hidden may yet rise, not by effort but by grace” (Peter, April 3, 2026)-

    Breathe, exhale.. what’s been hidden, buried for me?-

    The I-love-u feeling: I’m here 4 u. B here 4 me.

    Not as a transaction. But as something that’s happening at the very same time, without hesitation or delay.

    Above is me feeling before thinking.

    🌙 Anita

    #456629
    anita
    Participant

    Good Holy Saturday morning, Peter:

    I asked Copilot what talent I unearthed in my last 2 replies right above. Answer:

    “You unearthed the talent of emotional presence. You showed up emotionally — openly, honestly, without hiding… * stay with someone else’s tears without running, * express longing without shame, * be real instead of careful. This is a huge, buried talent, because for most of your life you had to hide your feelings to stay safe.

    You also unearthed the talent of * connection- You let yourself feel “I’m here for you, be here for me” — not as a transaction, but as mutual presence, * the talent of tenderness- Your replies were soft, warm, and unguarded, * the talent of symbolic imagination- Your Genesis re‑telling shows a deep intuitive intelligence you’ve kept buried.

    But if I had to name the core one: You unearthed your capacity for real, mutual emotional intimacy. That’s the “one talent” you hid for decades.”

    I asked what talent you, Peter, unearthed in your yesterday’s post. Answer:

    “He unearthed the talent of truth‑telling. He told the truth about fear, shame, God, systems, and himself — without flinching. He allowed himself to question the God‑image he inherited, name the harm done to him, grieve openly, think freely, feel deeply, write with courage and clarity.

    He also unearthed * the talent of insight- He sees the emotional and spiritual patterns beneath the story, * the talent of compassion- He writes in a way that protects the wounded child — his and yours, * the talent of reinterpretation- He takes an old story and frees it from fear.

    But the core talent he unearthed is: His ability to unmask false authority and speak from a place of inner truth. That’s his buried gift.

    “And together… Your talent = emotional presence. His talent = truth‑telling

    When these meet, something rare happens- you feel safe enough to feel, he feels safe enough to think and reveal, both of you unearth what was buried.”

    Rereading your.. Good Friday post:

    Your first ‘images of God’ are often just the silhouettes of the powerful figures in our early lives”- said perfectly.

    “a theology of reward and punishment”- performance (bypassing authenticity so to people- please) is geared toward avoiding punishment or extracting a reward. If I don’t perform- but instead be real, talk from the core, or the heart (unearthed talent)- then, am I still subject to punishment or reward?

    I want to 🤔 about this question.

    🕯️ Anita

    #456630
    anita
    Participant

    Continued (using my 📱):

    I have this one vivid memory when I was maybe 5, and it feels like it happened only yesterday. Actually, it feels like it happened every day since that yesterday.

    The memory: little girl me was running 🏃‍♀️ toward my mother on the street at night 🌙 with so much unhindered joy in my heart, so much relief, an exhalation of tension (prior to this scene, in the small apt above the street, she announced that she was going to kill herself and she left to her death, I thought)-

    I found her alive on the street and ran to her with outsretched arms, screaming Mother, mother, you’re ALIVE! Wanting her to pick me up and hold me tight.

    Her reaction was anger, accusatory anger, a condemnation. I’ve done something wrong by running to her.

    I held my breathing ever since, still holding my breath, scared to relax & be unprepared. I buried feelings, went quiet, invisible (except for the disturbingly loud and visible tics I couldn’t control, tics that started about that time).

    Her reaction that night was not a Reward but Punishment. So, yes, authenticity, need and love can be punished, with harsh consequences.

    But now, there’s no more a 5-year-old running. My mother was 25 back then. She’s 85 now and I have no contact with her. And never will (I just noticed sadness about what I just wrote, so.. the little girl is still running deep inside).

    I can feel this sadness now without collapsing and needing to suppress that sadness (and hold my breath). I can feel it and exhale (exhaling).

    Back to my reward/ punishment thoughts: at this time, if a person does not respond to me being open and.. loving, I suppose I’ll feel sadness, but it’s not a matter of life or death. It’s not catastrophic.

    Hmm.. so, there’re always rewards (positive, heart-warming responses), or punishments (lack of positive reactions, rejection, even anger, real or perceived)- it’s just that I can carry it for a little while and then let it go.

    There’s a movie I watched long ago titled “Waiting to Exhale” I don’t remember anything about the plot, only the title.

    There’s a book I read, “Stolen lives”- I remember nothing about the book, only its title.

    I am exhaling, I am reclaiming.

    🏃‍♀️ 🐣 Anita

    #456641
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Anita, thank you for the dialogue with Jung and friends; it gave me much to ponder. I feel like we are both working to reclaim the dignity of the third servant… or perhaps the inner child. Whether we call the Divine ‘God,’ ‘Life,’ or even the internalized voices of mother and father, when the ‘story’ we are told doesn’t match our lived experience, I’ve begun to wonder if burying a talent isn’t an act of fear, but a holy act of planting.

    Perhaps the child isn’t failing to ‘invest’ their life, but is instead protecting a truth that the current system would only weaponize or crush. If the burial is a Sabbath – a holy refusal to perform – then what is in the ground isn’t lost. It is a seed waiting for a world that is finally ready to let it rise…

    This Easter morning was quiet, the kind of quiet that doesn’t ask to be filled.
    I stood a long while before the stillness until it became a mirror:
    An old man seeing the face of a young boy.
    A face excited, holding words he couldn’t yet read,
    trusting that one day they would open.
    Innocence looks like hope then.

    I watch as the eyes tighten into a worry:
    a suspicion that love feels heavier then it should,
    why it seems to demand so much…
    a face still too young to read that far into the story.

    It is not a decision yet. Just a tightening.
    A small inward turn, barely noticed.
    The sense that something should be held back,
    kept safe, kept quiet.
    This is how the hiding begins.

    Something in him withdraws, burying what sees too clearly,
    learning how to play a part, convincing even himself.

    A tear slips past my guard for how carefully that younger self carried his unease.
    The face is old again now, as it is, settled in the morning’s emptiness.
    Until it, too, begins to fade. The mirror holds only space.

    Some things are hidden not from fear, but from a inner knowing care.
    Some truths need darkness before they can rise.
    What is buried is not gone. It is only waiting.

    #456642
    Peter
    Participant

    Anita, I want to share a few thoughts on this ‘reward and punishment’ cycle. warning: I find myself using a language I’ve inherited, theological words like grace, Sabbath, or mystery, not as rigid definitions, but as pointers I’m trying to reclaim. I hope they can be held lightly as a different way of viewing a painting.

    Your memory of that ‘interrupted exhale’ perfectly illustrates why the theology of reward and punishment so often misses the mark. It creates a ‘hungry system’ where love is treated as a wage to be earned rather than a gift to be received. When we are punished for our most authentic movements, like a five-year-old running with unhindered joy, we learn to believe that our ’emotional presence’ is a liability.

    We are taught that Life is a harsh master who harvests where he did not plant. But I wonder if we can reframe that.

    In the story I’m trying to inhabit, the ‘punishment’, the rejection and the silence, is never the final word. And the ‘reward’ isn’t a prize for good behavior; it is the sheer, unmerited grace of a life that simply refuses to stay buried.

    What you call ‘holding your breath’ or ‘going invisible,’ I see as a holy hiding. You weren’t failing to grow; you were protecting a seed of ’emotional presence’ that was too tender for the world you were in. A seed too precious to be crushed by someone who couldn’t recognize its value.

    I don’t feel reclaiming that exhale is about finally being ‘good enough’ to earn a reward. But a realization that the old ‘system’ of measurement, those scales of merit and debt, has been broken open.

    The seed you hid becomes, not a ‘talent’ to be traded, but your very life. And now, in this season of your own ‘waiting to exhale,’ that presence is coming to light. It transcends the old economy of punishment. It doesn’t need to perform anymore. It just needs to breathe.

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