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  • #203883
    Kevin
    Participant

    Hi everyone,

    Following a recent post I made with regards growing up with certain values, I wanted to ask about a similar issue that I have strong feelings for.
    I have always had intuitive feelings that any kind of drugs are a no no. Yet, a while ago whilst in a “spiritual awareness” facebook group, a member asked if what he “saw” whilst very high on drugs, was real or not.

    I was totally surprised with all the members in that group who openly shared their experiences whilst on drugs.

    And today in a “Lightworkers” facebook group, I encountered pretty much the same thing with some guy sharing his experiences smoking cannabis. Lots of members had smoked cannabis too.

    I am very anti-drugs and I will stick by that, but am I out of touch with society?

    Are there no more “clean living” spiritual people around?

    Some people will say it’s only cannabis or it’s not a drug or whatever, but I don’t know why I am deeply affected by this. I have a niece who smokes drugs and it has completely messed up her life and she’s not allowed to have custody of her little boy.

    Am I wrong in thinking that it is not productive to take drugs?

    I always thought that spiritual people are the last that would take drugs, but I am having to re think about my view on the world.

    #203931
    Peter
    Participant

    I assume by drugs you mean recreational as well as the other types people use to escape

    Like you I have no experience with taking such drugs

    I have read that in some practices like shamanism hallucinogens are sometimes used to amplify “spiritual/dream” experience however always under guidance. I suspect such experiences are not that helpful to those without training or guidance.

    For example, I have a friend who had experiences of remembering a past life. She was very excited about it however she didn’t use the experience to help her in the present… actually, the experience lead to an inflation of the ego as well as the temptation to escape into it.

    My own view is that a good understanding of symbolic language/images, the problem of opposites/dualism, and the shadow are required to unpack such experiences if your going to learn something from them.

    Actually, I found that opening myself up to symbolic language has allowed me to experience the ‘oneness’ and ‘Love’ that many who used drugs have said they experienced. No drugs required

    #203949
    Regi
    Participant

    Good question Kevin. I’m not sure if visions or whatever you can have using drugs are real, I doubt that.

    Anyways, I once used LSD on a festival, it opened my eyes. During the trip I could understand how life works, I don’t know why but at that point it was clear for me. I was very happy and thinking about my future. It felt like everything in my life was how it’s supposed to be and I was happy about what still had to come.

    After that day this feeling remained, not that intense but the optimism in my mind was very unique for quite a while. Saddly, a month later my best friend died which made me lose that positive mindset.

    Psychedelics make your brain work differently, which makes it possible to discover things you normally can’t. It may give you understanding about spiritual things, but I don’t think it’s actually that magical as some people describe it.

    That’s my experience and opinion.

    Greetings

    Regi

    #203955
    Kevin
    Participant

    Thanks for your replies.

    The facebook groups I mention are heavily populated by American people and I know there has always been a big drugs culture over there.

    I can’t help but think that the inhalation of substances to enhance a spiritual experience is the wrong way to go about it.
    Maybe it was ignorance on my part to assume that spiritual awakening and drugs do not go together.  I am learning more and more about life, even at the ripe old age of 52.

    Nobody has instilled these views in me, they’ve always been there.

    I am proud to have lived the way I have and for so many years, but I do not know exactly why I am so anti-drugs and it is something I will have to look into.

    Life is definitely a learning curve.

    Kevin

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 1 month ago by Kevin.
    #203959
    Regi
    Participant

    I’m only 22 years old, I did quite a while of different drugs (party and fun purpose only). My advice for a 52 years old man is probably not the best :p But I can say that this party period made me look differently at life. Your thoughts are intense and different when on drugs, it may change the way you feel about life and yourself. In many circumstances drugs negatively influence your brains, but experienced spiritual people may use it to think differently and perhaps find answers or insights.

    I wouldn’t bother to much about the drugs, I don’t think it’s the right way to achieve spiritual goals either. What is it You’re looking for? What do you want to achieve if I may ask? I’m just being curious.

    #203965
    Kevin
    Participant

    Thanks for your reply Regi.

    There’s no need to think too much about this.

    I’m not looking for anything,

    I’m not trying to achieve anything.

    Just curious to see if anyone else shares my views on this topic.

     

    Kevin

     

     

     

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 1 month ago by Kevin.
    • This reply was modified 6 years, 1 month ago by Kevin.
    #203979
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Kevin:

    You asked: “Am I wrong in thinking that it is not productive to take drugs?”

    My answer: depending what drug and in what quantity, as well as in what circumstances (while driving is one example)

    I feel that it is productive for me to take caffeine in moderation, as I do drinking coffee this very morning. I feel that it is productive for me to drink a bit of red wine, sometimes, before I take a long walk in the afternoon. I believe prescribed psychiatric drugs are helpful to some, harmful to many. Pain relievers, including narcotics are necessary to those experiencing significant physical pain.

    Smoking, snorting, injecting street drugs or psychiatric drugs sold on the street or overdoing alcohol, drinking-and-driving.. even overdoing caffeine, I suppose, have destroyed many millions of lives all  over the world, many, many millions of people are dead or their lives are destroyed otherwise.

    anita

     

    Am I wrong in thinking that it is not productive to take drugs?

    #203983
    Kevin
    Participant

    Hi Anita,

    Thanks for your reply.

    I wasn’t referring to alcohol or caffeine as such, only drugs that people take to get an instant high – whether they use it for spiritual awakening or not.

    Kevin

    #203997
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Kevin:

    How do people/ you define “spiritual awakening“, I wonder.

    anita

    #204011
    Kevin
    Participant

    Best to google it.

    #204093
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Dear Kevin:

    I took your advice and did a bit of googling, just a bit. No entry on Spiritual Awakening on Wikipedia. Elsewhere, random, I read that someone thinks that spiritual awakening is “experiencing something new”.

    According to this definition, “drugs that people take to get an instant high” (from your post before last) definitely do provide a new experience.

    Until the brain gets used to those drugs following repeated use, that is.

    anita

    #204119
    Airene
    Participant

    Hello Kevin –

    You asked: “Am I wrong in thinking that it is not productive to take drugs?”

    I have a brother who started smoking marijuana when he was in high school.  He is 60 years old now.  He has had what some would call a rough life.  He is also an alcoholic.  I won’t say marijuana alone ruined his life, but it sure didn’t help him.

    I have 4 kids and when I discovered one of them was smoking marijuana when he was 16, I handled it this way.  I told him I loved him and was disappointed (that’s an understatement…I was actually heartbroken).  I told him I would do random drug testing, and that if the test ever came back positive, he would go immediately into a rehab program (outpatient or inpatient).  I told him that if the tests came back negative, he would begin to earn back my trust.  I said this would continue until he was 18 years old and at that time he would legally be an adult, and I would have no say in what he did with his life.  I also said that I would not – ever – bail him out if he got in trouble with the law for possession of illegal drugs and/or drunk driving.

    When I drug tested him, my husband went in the bathroom with him.  I waited for my son to refuse the drug testing, but he never did.  If he had refused, I had a consequence ready for that.

    It might seem harsh, but my husband and I both had parents who were alcoholics and the destruction from that was enough for me to know I would not tolerate it in a spouse or with any of my kids.

    My son never tested positive when I drug tested him, and I kept my word and continued testing him through age 18.  He went on to college.  I never got a call saying he was in jail.  However, when he was 21 and moving from one apartment to another, I discovered a marijuana pipe.  I was heartbroken and told him so.  I also said he was on his own financially from that point forward.  We would lend him money if he wanted to finish school (he did), but he would have to pay us back (he is).

    He graduated and got a job shortly after graduation.  I’d be naiive to say he doesn’t smoke pot.  All my kids know I am strongly opposed to illegal drug use.  When and if pot becomes legal, I will maintain my position that I have never seen anything good or productive come from anyone using it.  I hate drugs, and addiction and all the destruction left in its path.

    Just my thoughts.

    Airene

    #204185
    Kevin
    Participant

    Hi Airene,

    Thanks for taking time out to tell us about your story. You are obviously a responsible parent and it’s a shame that many parents out there are not.

    Although I am not a parent, I think you did a wonderful job in the way you handled your son with regards drugs.

    My post was more about the people who are in online spiritual awareness type of groups and taking drugs, however, your story is one in which many parents should read.

    Thanks again,

    Kevin

    #204413
    Flavia
    Participant

    Kevin, one thing caught my attention in your posts: you say you’re proud (of not using drugs). Being proud means that you believe you’re doing something you must do, means you believe you’re achieving that ideal of ‘right’ or ‘good’. That means there is and ‘ideal’ in  you still, and the fact that you think you’re fullfiling it makes you feel good: makes you feel proud. If you experienced any anger (even a little bit) while reading this, it means there’s still some resitance in you to let go of a mind made self. Allow the anger, if it’s the case. Don’t be indifferent, don’t think it shouldn’t be there, just allow it. My intention is only the best.

    #204423
    Airene
    Participant

    Hello Kevin –

    My apologies!  I responded more or less to your last question in your initial post:  “Am I wrong in thinking that it is not productive to take drugs?”…thus, my response.  Thanks for your patience in reading through all that.

    About the spirituality without drugs and being out of touch with society…I’m not shocked that a spiritual group would use drugs to get an instant high and equate that with a spiritual awakening.  But when it comes to drugs, I think most people will find a way to justify its use.  Placing it in the spiritual awakening category might be what makes the user feel he or she is not “abusing” drugs, just heightening their spiritual awareness.

    Airene

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