Home→Forums→Relationships→Why my relationship is so fragile
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December 8, 2017 at 12:17 pm #181115AlanParticipant
I and this man started dating 3 months ago. At the beginning, I was kinda hesitate as he was older than me 15 years, a divorced and having kids man, while I’m just starting to shape my identity (in mid 20s). However, over time he showed that he was a caring, funny and responsible person. In addition, we’re both like-minded people that are into latest technology, art and music. I slowly developed my feelings for him and was convinced to become his gf. Besides his time for his kids and whenever he’s out of town for work, the rest of time he spent it with me (~2-3 days per week) But there’s a problem that always presents in our relationship that no matter how many times I talked it out, it still persists and mainly is the reason leading to the breakup. It’s that he thinks I’m not experience enough (I only was in one teenie-type relationship before, and dated 2 guys short term which didn’t lead to anywhere) while he has a lot of experiences about this. So after 3 months during his vacation, he suddenly said he felt like he was happy with or without me, he didn’t want to take our relationship as a priority momentarily, and would like to take a relationship break as he’ll be busy in a couple weeks traveling overseas for a planned vacation and business trips. He told me to go out and have fun, dating someone to see if I still feel the same about us, and he would also do the same, but dating others is not his main focus. He later revealed that he felt as if I chose him because I had no point of comparison, and he just filled in my imagination of some relationship goals which anyone could fit in. He said he wasn’t sure he needed a girlfriend to be happy, and maybe we would pick it up next year.
I was shock and paralyzed. It felt like falling from the cloud to the ground without any warning sign. If he wants space, I won’t mind that. But the thought that he thought we could go out and date and intimate with others made me feel like he didn’t value our connection, our relationship at all. Have I been blindsided all along that I haven’t seen his true colors? My female friends all said that he was manipulating and controlling me and no loving couples choose a break to solve a conflict. I don’t like sitting around and waiting for someone decision about a future. It’d be a prolonged pain. So I decided to send him a breakup email with my thought about his actions without waiting for him to come back to town.
A week after sending that email without a response, I asked him and he said I was a great girlfriend but I was just like people in my age, rushing relationship (I did ask him to spend the holidays together but he felt the relationship was early for that) and jumping into assumption (I told him in the email that he valued relationship as a business transaction and he wasn’t the man he said he was). And he did say we would not get back together as he doesn’t go back and because I was the one to break it off. Was I misunderstanding somewhere or he just used excuses to make me to break up with him?
December 8, 2017 at 1:24 pm #181125PeterParticipant“At every stage of life, our inner self requires the nurturance of loving people attuned to our feelings and responsive to our needs who can foster our inner resources of personal power, lovability, and serenity. Those who love us understand us and are available to us with an attention, appreciation, acceptance, and affection we can feel. They make room for us to be who we are.”
“When we feel unsafe with someone and still stay with him, we damage our ability to discern trustworthiness in those we will meet in the future.”
“The opposite of interpersonal trust is not mistrust. It is despair. This is because we have given up on believing that trustworthiness and fulfillment are possible from others. We have lost our hope in our fellow humans.”
“The foundation of adult trust is not “You will never hurt me.” It is “I trust myself with whatever you do.”
― David Richo: How to Be an Adult in Relationships
December 9, 2017 at 8:56 am #181199AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
My understanding of what he told you, that you “chose him because (you) had no point of comparison, and he just filled in (your) imagination of some relationship goals which anyone could fit in” is that he felt that it didn’t matter who he was in the relationship with you, that he could be anyone. Meaning, that he felt a lack of intimacy: of being seen and understood for the person he is.
As if you had a script of how a relationship is supposed to be like with no consideration of who the man in it is.
What do you think?
anita
December 13, 2017 at 9:53 am #181959AlanParticipantI’m not sure what a scripted relationship is. For me, it’s been always clear if I want to be with someone long-term or not. I also don’t expect him having to do fancy things for me either. Right now, if I text him something, he will answer right away until he stumbles on a question from me that he doesn’t want to answer. I feel like the culprit for our breaking-up is the miscommunication. But I’m not sure how to fix it, how much his feelings for me now and if we could work it out. He travels for business a lot lately, like nonstop, and he also mentioned that it was a very lonely path.
Is it possible that I (we) work it out and mend our relationship?
December 13, 2017 at 11:22 am #181981AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
This relationship doesn’t look promising to me at this point. He clearly expressed wanting a break, then you sent him a break up email and followed with emails aiming at reconnecting.
You did rush the relationship, like he said. It’s been only three months. I do understand your intense hurt about having been physically intimate with him and being rejected following that.
The physical intimacy was very meaningful to you, more than it was for him. For you it meant different things than it did for him. Because of what it means to you, it is very important that you are not physically intimate with a man before you spend long enough time getting to know him.
It is an emotional mess otherwise, for you.
A bit too late for this relationship, not possible to undo the physical intimacy and your strong emotional attachment to him, a result of such physical intimacy, was already formed.
With that emotional attachment, it is difficult or impossible to see who the man is. He clearly is not who you need him to be: as emotionally attached to you as you are to him.
I am sorry that you are experiencing this pain. Please do post anytime, if it helps.
anita
December 22, 2017 at 1:30 pm #183301AlanParticipantI have met him for a closure, which he agreed. He said he wanted a break to think about our future goals, but not intended to break up with me. Since I sent that breakup letter, it was official and he didn’t want to do an on-off relationship, especially for his age. Also, he told me we were at different stages in life. He doesn’t know if he wants a life partner, marriage and more children. If he wants to get married, it’ll be in a year of knowing each other. To him, he wants to spend his time for relaxing and traveling, while I’m still pursuing my career goals and won’t be ready to get married in at least 2 years (I think it’s a minimum amount of getting to know each other before marriage). He didn’t think we would have a future together, and he wanted a more experienced person as there was something he could not talk to me about. He said he could do friend with benefits with me, which I refused. Then he said he could only compromised to date me, while we also needed to date others. It won’t be like when we were together, with sleepover and meet every week. I also rejected this option, as it was painful to see him dating others while my feeling still linger on. He also mentioned my career was not stable yet. Well, I make a relatively good salary compared to other in my age range. Of course, it’s no where compared to him, but I can live comfortably by my own with my current salary. He told me if we started again, it would be at least 6 months, contact him then if I still want to be with him. I asked him what about 3 months. He said if only I have dated enough to know what and who I want.
I’m confused as I want to believe his intention is good. Maybe after enough time has passed, I may realize we aren’t meant for each other. But right now, I’m just heart broken and the breakup repeats over and over in my mind. I don’t know why I’m willing to compromise the fact that he has children and I will never be a top priority, but he cannot compromise my relationship experiences. I have a hard time to swallow the fact that there’d be no chance to start again. Even though I know it’s unhealthy for me to keep false hope.
December 23, 2017 at 6:46 am #183329AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
He told you that “he wanted a more experienced person as there was something he could not talk to (you) about”- any idea about what that something is?
He also said that you can contact him in three months if you “dated enough to know what and who (you) want”- any idea what it is he wants you to know that (he thinks) you don’t currently know?
anita
December 23, 2017 at 9:17 am #183333AlanParticipantHe told me for example, parenting (but it doesn’t make sense, as he started hang out with a woman that was not even a parent), and relationship goals. Actually, I think the relationship goals talk is the one causing all the doubts. We had this talk right before he went on vacation, which made him rethink about of relationship and wanted a break. In the talk, I was sort of crying when he mentioned he “might not” want more children at this age (although it might depend on the women he’s with, but more children is not in his need) and couldn’t imagine living at one place forever. He has a future goal of a comfortable living in an Asian country when he retires early. He said it was just a discussion but it seemed like I didn’t handle well. He said I might not even know what I wanted, as all the future goals I mentioned was higher education, opening new businesses and advancing my career. He asked among those goals, when I would have time for a family life and future kid. I admit I’m a very driven and ambitious person. It’s not only about getting rich and providing my parents (as immigrants) a better life, but I also want to be a part of innovative future and see how far and high my ability can be expanded. But at heart, I’m still a traditional woman, I value a family life which partners support each other. He told me to date others in this time, to know what kind of man I really want, like a man with stability but older like him who’s already had a past life, or a younger man who is also building a career or someone else. I don’t see my future goals and his are totally opposite to each other. In a relationship, there’ll always be a compromise of some sort, won’t there?
December 23, 2017 at 10:34 am #183341AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
Reads to me that his rational side is strong, he is goal oriented and he rationally processed your reaction when you cried following him mentioning that he may not want more children in the future, figuring you do want children. Well, he probably doesn’t, except, maybe in special circumstances, none that exist now.
He suggested to you to be friends with benefits, meaning he believes he can be friend with benefits or date you while dating others, while knowing you want children in your future. I suppose he figures you dating others means he is not preventing you from meeting the man with whom you will have children.
Regarding him hanging out with a woman who is not a parent, it not making sense to you- it makes sense to me when incorporating his openness to non-monogamous dating into the picture. He is okay with dating a woman who is not a parent and who wants to be a parent if it is not a monogamous dating.
You figured you are not emotionally okay with non monogamous dating. He seems to be okay with it. So there is a no match in this regard.
The title of your thread “why my relationship is so fragile?”- a mismatch of goals and you being more emotional than logical while he is more logical than emotional, do you think?
anita
December 31, 2017 at 11:30 am #184507AlanParticipantHappy holidays Anita and everyone,
I and my ex are still in contact. He recently wished me a holiday and stated that he missed me, asked me about my dating life and was jealous when I said I started dating others. About him, he’s currently not dating anyone, although I don’t know how long it will be that way. I started warming up and responding to him, in which he asked me to a coffee meetup but later postponed. I think he sensed my expectation so he became cold again. It frustrates me so much. He told me I should have my own independent feelings about him and us regardless of how he feels, and that I see things in black and white while he wants space to develop gradually. He also mentioned the reason he wanted a break because he felt guilty that he went off on adventures and traveling without me. He didn’t think we would break up but rather each enriches our lives with more experiences and be a stronger couple.
He’s a very intelligent man, which makes his rational side overpowers his emotional side a lot of time (like you said). The things he said somehow even confused smart people with more life experiences than me, as I have consulted with others. It’s not entirely about our life goals, but more of experiences to communicate feelings well to each other. I actually don’t want to let things between us go, but sometimes I’m getting tired of uncertainty. I think he has prejudges about people in my age and combining it with his rational thought that large-age-difference couple won’t work to shadow any feelings he has. He requires maturity level as of 40s, but maturity also comes with acceptance, accept life the way it is, while 20s is the time of trials and errors and taking risks. For me, I did tell him about my future plans with all the businesses I want to open, further education and advance my career. But I didn’t clearly describe him conditions and priorities of each plan, which made him feel like I want to do all and it’s really risky, time-consuming and show that I’m not stable in life enough. If I just stick with one job, it’s not me anymore. Maturity also refers to emotions. I guess that’s why I see things black and white and don’t accept any grey areas. I just don’t understand why expectation is necessarily a bad thing. I do know we’re both strong-headed even though we want to make it work. Which areas do you think we should improve in order to make it work?
January 1, 2018 at 5:50 am #184553AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
Thank you for your wishes and Happy New Year to you!
Regarding the first paragraph of your recent post: “He …stated that he missed me, asked me about my dating life and was jealous when I said I started dating others”, and he told you that he is “not dating anyone”. As a result of what he said, you “started warming up and responding to him”.
This new information teaches me more about him, changes somewhat earlier understanding. What it teaches me is that he either forgot the important things he told you earlier about each one of you dating or he is dishonestly manipulative. If he forgot… then he is not as rational as I thought he was. If he is dishonest, that is a problem.
He asked you to a coffee meetup but later postponed. You wrote that you think he postponed because he sensed your expectation. My problem is that he created your expectation by expressing jealousy and telling you that he is not dating. Maybe he postponed for other reasons, I don’t know.
And then, you wrote: “He told me I should have my own independent feelings about him and us regardless of how he feels”- if this is what he told you, then he is irrational, doesn’t make basic sense. How can a person have feeling for another that are not in part reactive to the feelings expressed by the other. It is impossible. Not to mention one cannot choose one’s feelings.
His statement that you “see things in black and white” is suspicious to me as well as his vague expressions: “wants space to develop gradually… each enriches our lives with more experiences and be a stronger couple”- develop how specifically? More experiences of what kind?
Regarding your second paragraph, the reason that “The things he said somehow even confused smart people” may be because of his vagueness. Regarding the black and white vs grey areas: I see honesty in communication in a black and white way: if a person is dishonest with me, maybe purposefully says vague things so to.. confuse me or to avoid saying what is true, I am turned off and away from that person in a very black and white way. Staying in … the grey area of confusion is very unpleasant for me.
I hope you write again with your thoughts and feelings.
anita
January 10, 2018 at 10:00 pm #186071AlanParticipantDear Anita,
After canceling the coffee meetup, he contacted me to ask for a different time to see each other. There was some personal stuff came up on his side on this new scheduled day but he tried to make it work this time. It was a date (dinning out at a fancy restaurant and having conversation at a bar) and for a moment, I feel like he put efforts in making it work again. Since our past relationship started out as friend with benefits and he was my first sex-wise, he doubted that I didn’t like him for who he is and sex clouded my judgement. He thought I needed more dating experiences in order to know whom I want to be with. We sort of falling back to texting each other every day and we hung out again a couple days later. But this time, when I expressed about getting back together, he told me he didn’t want to have a relationship, he didn’t see the value of having a relationship and why don’t I just enjoy the time we have together. He said things could not came back like in the past and our huge age difference created a difference in maturity that he saw no point in trying it make it work, and he’s too old for this. He felt being contained when we were in a relationship. He said I still needed a lot of grown on my own and he got tired of hearing me asking about it all the time we hung out together. At least 6 months he said before a relationship can be recovered. During this time, if I want to continue dating him casually or not is my choice, but he himself prefers to continue dating without the pressure of a relationship. I’m just afraid if I choose this, I cannot get over my jealousy when he starts dating new people. After that last time hanging out, our texts got lessen.
In my retrospection, I realized I had tendency to depend on my boyfriend for my source of happiness when we were in a relationship and I need to work on it. I, however, don’t agree that having a lot of dating experiences is worthwhile, life experiences yes, but not dating experiences. In rational thought, I know it’s better to keep a distance away from him as it just affects so much on my emotional side, but still, it’s a really hard thing for me to do. I think I need to find a way to enjoy my life by myself first so that my emotion (coupled with anxiety) will stay in check.
January 11, 2018 at 6:29 am #186105AnonymousGuestDear Alan:
I got to know the man through your shares of over a month. I feel comfortable with my understanding at this point. Here it is: his main motivation being with you is to establish his alleged superiority over you.
This is what he told you about you, quoting from all your posts: “(You) are not experienced enough… while (I have) a lot of experiences…(You/people your age) rushing relationships… jumping into assumptions… at different (inferior) stages in life… (your) career(is) not stable yet…(you) see things in black and white while (I) want space to develop gradually… (You) still need a lot of grow(ing) on (your) own.”
He is the one who is older, more experienced, more intelligent, more insightful, wiser who knows best.
And because he knows best, he tells you what you should do, how you should feel, and what you need: “go out and have fun, dating someone… (You) should have (your) own independent feelings….sex clouded (your) judgment… (You) need more dating experiences”
And he gets impatient and quite rude with his alleged inferior: “(I) want a more experienced person as there was something (I) could not talk to (you) about…(I can’t) compromise to date (you)…(I) get tired of (you) asking….”
So his message basically: I am significantly superior to you in every way. Therefore, you are not qualified to have a relationship with me other than friends with benefits. Take it or leave it.
And you, having taken in his alleged superiority as true, ask him, after he said to contact him in six months to see if a relationship can take place: can I contact you in three months? And he says: only if you “dated enough to know what and who (you) want”, that is, if you catch up to his experience/ superiority just a little.
Just a little is key. If you continue this relationship, you will never catch up to him. You can’t because he needs you inferior. And this is why your relationship is so fragile (the title of your thread), because he needs you inferior.
You can not satisfy his requirements for a relationship other than friends with benefits because he needs you to feel and behave inferior to him. If he ever agrees to your …. pleas for a relationship, he will be doing his inferior a great favor and will remind you of that, again and again. He needs to.
anita
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