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DerekParticipant
Hi Anita,
I am not quite sure I understand. Do you mean that psychotherapy will help understand where that comes from and help me understand the flinch?
Because, I don’t believe the flinch is a sign of a bad relationship or one that should be left.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Yes maybe you are right. I can’t help but wonder how young I was when I was emotionally locked out.
It’s hard because the anxiety is passing today. Today I left a note at home for my partner, who has been worried he is not learning English well enough. I knew he would be home before me so I wanted to know that I love him for being him, not because he does or doesn’t do English…that even if he stopped tomorrow I would love him the same.
He just wrote me a message and I smiled with happiness, followed by the ever so common and awful flinch of doubt and fear in the stomach 🙁
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thank you for that post. It is quite tough today. A whole month since I had last posted, trying to focus on the positive feelings I was having then.
I had never thought about the dream in that sense. I am never sure how much importance to put on dreams. I like how you describe it as a dance, as fire. That is certainly how it feels.
It is true about the child thing because just this weekend we were chatting about if I would ever like to learn to drive. He asked ‘When you turned 18 were you not so excited to do it?´and I had to respond ‘When I was 18 the years of emotional abuse was coming to an end as it was the last time my Mother had forced me out of my home, and from there I never went back.’. There was an odd moment of sadness shared between us, and I could see he was sad for me, and I felt bad for making it uncomfortable but that was the truth. We both laughed a little and moved on. Then less than an hour later there it was ‘Are we talking enough at lunch?’. ‘Are the people around us talking more, are their relationships better, is this a bad sign?’….
As for the origin, I can’t even begin to think where it comes from…but I would love to udnerstand and explore further.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
I hope you’re well?
I am posting today as I can feel the relationship anxiety rising so want to name it for what it is as a way of helping me cope.
I haven’t been journalling as much and I believe that now I must try and do it even when feeling good. In general since the last time I have written I have not felt anxious about the relationship. In fact, my anxiety has focused on other areas of life: studies, future, money etc.
Since we last spoke I took my partner to meet some family. That was a big trigger for me indeed. Estranged family and difficult past coming together with a beautiful loving present.
I have also been quite self critical recently particularly with my physical appearance. I have found that I often project this onto my partner now and he is not ‘strong enough’ or his belly is getting ‘too fat’. Moreover, I find myself more critical of his appearance. Particularly when I look at photos of us. I feel horrible as I am starting to see the similarity I share with my Father and that upsets me. I then look at my partner and can see his supposed flaws.
Apart from this my dreams have been quite intrusive. I have had nightmares that he has left me and I am often in the dream screaming begging him not to go. Or in some dreams he has passed away and I am searching for him and wondering about ‘how I will ever survive’. This weekend when I felt myself entering anxious mode I had horrible sensations that ?I just don’t love him anymore’. This was very upsetting and confusing because it was not the usual harsh tone of thought but a gentle one. I imagine this is anxiety at its worst, the ego and fear based thoughts trying to convince us.
The other usual questions have popped up ‘Am I in love enough?’. Will we ‘earn enough to buy a house?’. Is he ‘too quiet in social situations?’ and if so ‘what will people think of him?’.
The list is growing as I feel myself getting more anxious, so I am trying to acknowledge the feelings but not allow them to influence me or panic.
Very upsetting.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thank you for sharing. It has been quite a relief to know that someone who has such insightful and helpful answers can also have their own fears and insecurities.
I am definitely trying to be more mindful. I have been feeling some relationship anxiety surfacing again and rather than allow myself to judge and criticise my partner, or look for WHY these thoughts are happening I am leeting them go. Or, I am looking at the bigger picture. For example, I can see triggers such as the future (studies, money, job) and how they are impacting on my mood and how this may escalate into criticism of my partner.
To being more mindful and living in the present 🙂
Derek
DerekParticipantDear Anita,
How are you? I hope this message finds you well. As always thank you for your kind and thought provoking messages.
The delay is down to the simple fact that I have been taking time to be as kind as possible to myself. And yes, the ego has tried to beat me down quite a few times, and I have tried to let it go with love and focusing on more positive aspects, which I actually have done and I have noticed myself feeling more positive in general. This is nice because this week alone I have been enjoying life more, seeing my partner and myself in more positive lights and just feeling calmer. It means that when some thoughts do creep in on me I kind of just let go and know they well pass as hard as they may be.
I’m really sorry to read about the guilt and anxiety that you experienced. It can’t have been easy and definitely resonates with me. Over the years has it improved for you? If so, what has helped you get to a more comfortable place? How do you cope with anxiety now??
I do understand more what you mean by the guilt now. This too came up in therapy, ‘when will you stop cutting yourself short and beating yourself up’ was what was said to me. For anyone I have told, they feel that I was drunk (lost any inhibitions) and still managed to be conscious enough to remove myself from the situation. So now I feel more proud of myself than anything.
Unfortunately I never knew why she did it, and if I do try and find out I get answers that don’t answer it. It was a tough time for definite. But I had been put out from home for maybe 1 or 2 years and often would have to wait in the garden and eventually she would let me in. So on and off for 2 years these threats were happening. They only stopped this final time when after it happened, I decided not to go back. and I guess that was a very important and wise decision for a 17 year old to make.
DerekParticipantA final update.
I spoke to my partner on the phone. Firstly I apologised for causing any overwhelm or unnecessary panic today. I thought about what you said and decided not to play it down because that won’t help. But I also realised that imagining the worst and over panicking is not helping either.
I then apologised for sending a message saying that people were trying to have a threesome. Because that’s wrong. I explained the actual events and explained that my interpretation was that there was potential for it to turn sexual and that the girls made out and that hugging I did feel body parts and I think i did feel temptation and that is what scared me most. I also told him how special he was and that I need to rethink alcohol and be more careful. When we were first speaking I still felt a wave of guilt. Then as I opened up and said everything I relaxed and stopped catastrophising and saw it from a different perspective. I told him, hugging people it’s natural you will feel their bodies but the fear of not remembering how or why and if it was as bad as my fear is making it or not.
Basically, I’m trying to be kind to myself. And to him.
Now I need time to breathe and relax and not beat myself up over anything.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thank you for your response.
I realise where I may have over exaggerated and where not.
I read back over my messages. The first thing I sent to my partner said “they were intending to have a threesome and as I reached for my phone I made contact” this was at 8:35 am. I went to bed very drunk at 4am. So I hadn’t slept and clearly didn’t think of that message. Later in the day I sent further messages which were more honest etc and clarified everything.
I hust spoke to my friend, the girl. I read her that message. She kindly turned to me and said “I’m not sure what you seem to think has happened. Nobody tried to have a threesome. We explained last night, that in Work we do a thing called cuddle circles to relieve stress. These circles sometimes involve more than 10 people each spooning each other one way for 5 mins, then we all turn to the other way for 5”. I stared blankly. I know that things felt uncomfortable. I know the girls made out which my friend says “was her fault for kissing her best friend.” For example now they are watching a movie together and are cuddling. They are childhood friends so maybe it’s more common for them.
Also, I was sure that something was going on. But when I asked about the Male friend se said “Derek don’t you remember how nervous he was and moved away”.
anyway, my point is is I still feel like I almost crossed a line and risked temptation and walked away. But I am afraid too that I completely over exaggerated a situation. That doesn’t mean that it was entirely innocent as I clearly felt nervous etc. But now I just feel crap because I could’ve just asked this morning, and then could’ve explained a lot better and a lot less exaggerated and hysterical. Now I feel like I blew a situation up, drunkenly lost self control, catastrophised and also probably distressed my partner.
Because “they were intending to have a threesome”
or “they were being drunk and did this bizarre cuddle circle thing that got even more bizarre and could’ve escalated but didn’t”
i dunno I feel like I let anxiety and fear take over. I’m sorrt that you know the feeling. It’s sad. It’s a horrible feeling.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thank you once again. I don’t feel judged or scared when I read your messages and do take all points on board.
I have started to feel a bit a bit better since I met with my friends. When they saw I had been crying they asked why and they clarified the situation.
There was no no sexual engagement. Yes people were hugging and naturally that means leaning on each other, but not in a sexual way.
Before the hugging, they stated “nothing strange here as people are in relationships etc so no breaking of commitments”
When I said I feel like I have been unfaithful or I’m not sure my friend laughed and said “Derek you were drunk because at one point I got in between you both because you were both very nervous and uncomfortable to be in our hugging circle.”
So now I know nothing happened I’m trying to let it go. Every couple of minutes I get this dreadful feeling of fear and I’m trying to let it go.
I too want this to last last a lifetime. Even when I read Jason’s comment about “try move past his mistakes, and if you can’t move on” I felt a hot rush of fear because I could not imagine anything worse.
I think im struggling to understand that I make mistakes, like anyone, but love for me has always been so conditional, that having someone love me for who I am frightens me, so sometimes that fear I fall into old patterns, all learned from a long time ago.
I will see my therapist on monday, that should help. I’m also worried if it’s “normal” how much I have missed him whilst away, and how much I have spoken about him. I have called him everyday too and feel so relaxed when I hear him. Of course, my anxiety may kick in before and say “what if you don’t feel enough when he answers”.
Its almost like a dance of anxiety. Rejection and abandonment have made it very difficult to be close to people. So sometimes I look for ways “his flaws maybe” to push him away. Then when I’m away I feel scared, and the build up to being reunited I worry, and find it difficult to reunite, but once I’m there everything goes away and feels so safe.
DerekParticipantAnita,
This post made me cry with happiness. I feel proud for even with alcohol I could stop a situation escalating, rather than wanting to beat myself down over it.
I think how how I described it here may sounds more catastrophic than it was. Anyone I have spoken to says “I don’t understand how you think you’ve cheated on your partner, nothing happened”. My friends laughed because I was part of a drunken hugging circle, of course you’ll have contact.
My ego is beating me saying I told my partner about it in a light hearted way, but I feel that if I allow my catastrophic nature step in, it could hurt him unnecessarily. He knows I was in an uncomfortable situation drunk and foolish where contact was made. Describing a 3 second interaction in graphic detail may cause unnecessary worry and upset for him.
I forgive myself, and I will always forgive him. I have been so excited just to feel his hand and have him close. I want to feel safe again.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thank you for your last post. I come to you today with a difficult entry.
I am on a weekend break with two friends. One is a girl I know from college, the other is her friend. We have been having a great time. My first day I had painful anxiety and missed my partner dearly. Yesterday I felt overwhelming love for him. Then alcohol was involved.
Ny relationship with alcohol has never been very healthy. I don’t have much self control and often don’t know when to stop. Yesterday we met with a friend of my friends. It is worth noting that both girls have been sexual together before and had a threesome with the best friend of the straight guy we met yesterday. The guy yesterday also has a girlfriend.
Everyone hot got pretty drunk, I felt awkward because I am a few years older and they were here to party. We went back to our flat (the 3 of us) and the very nice guy (also very young, sober I wouldn’t think anything of him in a sexuality fashion). In typical form I put music on and danced. The girl had invited the guy back so they could smoke weed. I took a drag thinking it was a cigarette so gave it back once I realised. Then things got a bit well I don’t know touchy feely. As I lay on the bed the three were harmlessly hugging. They encouraged me to have fun and hug them too. So I did. But, the girls began making out and the guy was excited but I could see he was trying to keep his distance. He looked very nervous and uncomfortable but was clearly aroused. I felt strange. I lay there and thought about my partner and as I was being cuddled by the guy On his right, the girls were on his left and also were extending hands to me etc. I had also noticed we were kind of rubbing feet (with him or a girl Im not sure). It brushed off his crotch area(everyone was clothed fully) and explored his abs, I felt my hand going further towards his Penis.
then something happened. I stopped. I panicked. I didn’t want to touch anyone, only my partner not someone else. Nor do I think this guy wanted me to touch, afterall he is straight. I felt scared. I opened my eyes and like lightening realise “this is not my boyfriend”. So I left. I went to the balcony and I cried. I cried hard. My friend came out and asked why I was crying and if I was ok. I said “I love my partner so much and I feel like I’ve just cheated, and also, I feel like this would be what it would be like without him”. She smiled and laughed and said “Derek everyone is fully dressed and cuddling, ok hands wandered a bit ?75 you left, you’re here because you love him, that’s why you’re not on the bed”.
At at one point I’m not sure before or after I had vomited a lot in the bathroom, too much alcohol I suppose.
So today I am awake, and sightseeing and my mind is racing. The first thing I did was tell my partner briefly that things got weird and I found myself in a difficult situation and am sure I brushed off a penis touched some abs and potentiallly felt some boob. I told him I felt scared and that I feel like I almost fucked it up. He was a it confused and thought it all sounded a bit crazy. His response?
Derek. Calm down. I trust you. You must be more careful with alcohol because you’ll have more anxiety later and struggle to feel better and is not worth it just for being drunk. He told me to enjoy my trip and stop worrying. Disconnect. Enjoy. That he loved me. I told him with overwhelming certainty that I really fucking love him too.
So so now I am panicked. I feel awful both hungover and guilty. The young guy seemed nervous too this morning. Once I had moved he also moved to a different bed and the situation thankfully diffused.
i feel guilty, awful, a horrible person fucking up the one relationship I have that makes me feel whole and loved. That makes me believe I am worthy.
I guess I don’t know what I’m asking for today. Your insight I suppose.
Jason, thank you for your comment too. I am trying to learn to accept my flaws and his and for the first time in life love unconditionally.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
I didn’t feel distressed as such it was just dificult. He has contact with my mother and was sad that when the family broke apart he has felt like he doesn’t have a family. He feels that we don’t even meet once a year and be in the same room together. i understood but also thought that at least he and i have kept contact and can meet (although it was quite stressful at times when he came to visit). I guess because we have different views. He feels that I can meet with other family members who at times also cause me hurt because I say ‘I just think that the good outweighs the bad and that meeting for dinner is better than severing the relationship altogether’. my goal is to learn to maintain relationships rather than follow family patterns and cut people out.
With my mother, I had wanted a dog as a child. I was never allowed. We did watch my grandfathers dog for 2 weeks once as my Grandfather went away on holiday. That dog was old, and a little sick. He passed away a few years later i think. My grandfather also passed four years ago and it would have been his birthday last week.
I suppose by the age of 17 my needs had changed and i was shocked to see a dog in the kitchen. I was happy naturally. But the same week i had also been for a job interview to work 8 hours a week. this was because I was often told I needed to earn some money for myself because she couldn’t afford to pay for everything. So when I got the job, then she didn’t want me to take it because ‘who would look after the dog’. It was December time as well and my brother was away working and studying abroad. So she threatned for two weeks that she would sell the dog, and I obviously didn’t think that would happen. Plus I had told family, friends, school about the dog. Then one day I was getting ready for work and sat at the top of my stairs as I came down to leave and saw her hand the dog over. I never even got to say goodbye. She turned and looked up at me and said that I couldve stopped her. Then I went to work very distressed.
I should mention that my Mother bought the dog from the same pack as my Aunt. They bought two puppies, one for them, one for us. When I lost contact with my Mother (she came to my work the following summer with a bag and told me never to come back…), so I never did. I was distraught I suppose. traumatic maybe. Anyway my Aunt also told me I couldn’t visit her until I ‘went back home’. So I threw myself into final year of high school and studied as hard as I could to get out. I was awarded top boy of the year and still was disappointed with my results.
About 3 years ago at Christmas my brother and mother went to my Aunt’s house. He sent me a pic of a dog on his lap (it was the other dog I guess because was the same type). I tried to make a joke about how it was a bit silly because ‘doesn’t he remember what happened’ (apparently he wasn’t told about the dog until some time later). He said that he ‘hadn’t thought about it before sending the picture’ then ‘that was years ago I thought you would be over it’.
So now my partner is comuing to collect me and we are going on a hike, with a dog. I guess it makes sense I am overjoyed by having a dog at home (altthough quite nervous). So maybe two worlds have collided, my old broken home and my new home of love built on trust and stability (both of which are still very new to me).
I feel like this is all very personal, should I delete it? I don’t mind i just can’t believe wrote all that without even thinking.
DerekParticipantThank you Anita.
That helped to see it written like that. It also helped me to understand other problems. I have been feeling low about my appearance and that may also cause a spike in criticsining and questioning his.
I agree about the family, however, would feel sad to never speak to my brother so think I can rethink about HOW to speak with him. Maybe it is better that I tell him that topics as heavy as Saturday are best dealth with with a professional or other friend rather than myself as it is very difficult to understand and help. And listening is tough too.
Thank you for the advice.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
I hope you are well. I am currently in a wave of anxiety and going through the motions as usual to try and calm it.
Since last week I have been feeling full of doubt (it was a family members birthday who has passed) and I had a difficult conversation with by brother about childhood on Saturday. I am aware that these themes have probably played a role in my current spike.
On Saturday I was quite cruel. We went for dinner and i barely spoke, I guess I was withdrawn because I wanted to see if ‘he could keep a convo because I am bored’. I realise this was mean behaviour and very dysfunctional. Also, telling him I was bored was cruel. I know I learned this cruelty from childhood so must try not to repeat it. I also cried with him on Saturday too, because I felt so horrible. I cried again on Tuesday I believe because I felt so overwhelmed with negative thoughts that I wanted to be close to him but struggled. But I knew I was changing the old pattern by just opening up to him. twice this week I have felt a pang of anxiety when I saw him and immediately thought that thsi was becasue I ‘wasn’t attracted to him.’ Once with him however I have felt calm and secure, and free to cry and explain how I dfeel. He has responded with overwhelming support. For that I felt so in love. Twice in the last week I have openly told him ‘I am very frightened and am not sure if we should just end this’. I am convinced this is me allowing fear to rule me rather than making a conscious decuision to stay in the present moment. I worry that this will hurt him. But he understands. \
Also, this week we are dogsitting for a friends dog. We are both so happy as we love dogs. I cant help but wonder if this is healing an old wouind. My mother surprised me with a puppy when I was 17 (as a boy I had always wanted a dog) and she sold it in front of me two weeks later and told me ‘I couldve stopped her’. Since then I haven’t really dealt with that or really had an interest in dogs but the last year I have started to refind my love for them. I cant help but think that my partner is helping me to redicover the love that i have inside and that all of this is shedding wounds of old and allowing me to progress further. However, with that comes fear and doubt. He struggles to say the name of the dog and i feel that is ‘stupid and how can you forget so easy’. Then realise HEY why be so hard on anyone, who cares, mistakes are ok.
I am struggling to feel ‘in love’ this week, but also think that breaking up is not what’s necessary. Realistically, beneath everything I say here about the relationship is a whole well of dark memories and wounds.
Would love to hear your thoughts.
DerekParticipantHi Anita,
Thanks for your response. In regards to the studies I am currently arranging to meet with different faculty members to see what options I have and how to find a solution to any issues. So yes I am staying 🙂
About the English exam: he said “I know you encourage me because you love me for who I am” and I had an instant fear of “No I don’t” even though a few hours before I couldn’t stop thinking about how positive I felt about it all.
Thanks for the comments on the crish. It came up again today and I think I realised something. I often worry that he “doesn’t do enough” because he “always says he will try new things but just before he does he stops” and I realised I’m talking about myself. For months I have gone on about all the things I “would like to do” that never came into fruition. So in fact maybe I’m scared of new things, so when I got an invited to go join a local tennis club today I worried “what if he doesn’t do anything he will be left home alone” or “other couples are so much more active”. Actually I think what it is is that I have low self esteem and am afraid so the easiest thing to block the fear is anxiously search for excuses and project them to my partner….
yesterday he told ne he was going to do an activity, a sport. I joked with him and said “now you always do this so is there something wrong with why you never just do it”. Then we laughed about how actually I’m talkinh about myself too because I do the same but then he said “well actually I just didn’t tell you because I know what you get like but last week I was googling activity centres”. I felt weird. I felt bad maybe he was afraid to tell me. I felt that maybe I need to respect his privacy more because maybe he is more introvert. I also said “these are the things I’d love to hear more about I had no idea you were interested in xyz” (I worry that our conversations are boring sometimes…he tells me it’s ok not to talk every second of the day)
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