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KatieParticipant
Just want to thank you Anita, for your consideration and responses. Don’t really have a lot to add…however your insight has definitely caused me to examine my relationship with my mom in a new way. Could never really get a clear picture of why our relationship might not be the healthiest, but now I see that it’s because she WAS and really in a lot of ways still IS my main caretaker (not that I need one now, but she does support me to some extent). So I have taken on her perspectives on things and because she was so in and out emotionally, it makes sense that I would be constantly seeking approval and have anxiety about everyone in my life doing this in and out thing too. It’s hard when I want to move on and move forward but I don’t want to leave her behind. I want her to always be a part of my life. I can’t imagine her not being part of it and truthfully I don’t feel that it would need to come to that. I just hope I can figure out a way to separate without actually cutting her off.
KatieParticipantAnd now my boyfriend of the past 1.5 years has decided that we need time apart to focus on ourselves. I think he may be right and rationally I know that he and I are not right for each other, but why is it so hard to break up even if you know it has to happen??? I feel like it must be the feeling of rejection? He knows that all I need is for him to open up to me more and be more supportive but he just isn’t willing to do that so of course I tell myself it must be because I’M JUST NOT WORTH IT. I’m pretty devastated right now and want to crawl out of my skin. It’s like trying to squeeze blood from a turnip. I knew early on in our relationship that there was something off. But I just went with it anyway, hoping that it would change as feelings developed. How foolish. At 32 I have a string of failed relationships and I just wonder if I am capable of having a real and lasting connection with anyone ever. What am I doing so wrong.
KatieParticipantMiniature Bodhisattva – Thank you for your answers!! Those questions were indeed not rhetorical, so I am grateful. 🙂 How long did you distract yourself with food and tv? It is crazy to me that I have only really had this awakening that my reasons for drinking and finding boyfriends have not been healthy. But I know this is the first big step on my journey towards a happier and more peaceful life!! Truly finding myself. I have been hiding for a while…experiencing the initial twinges of anxiety and then reaching for booze or a boy to try to make me feel better. It’s so temporary and in the end I feel further and further from myself. Just in these last two weeks while I have been not drinking and spending more time at home, alone – I can already feel more peace and balance. I know it might be fleeting, and anxiety and uncomfortable feelings eventually always find their way in, but I have learned that to sit with those feelings for a bit DOES NOT KILL ME. And I wake up in the morning with a clear head and having had a great night of sleep and feel GOOD about myself and the choices that I’m making. I have always been a loner and an introvert but I am human, so I do need human connections. This is where I find it hard to balance – sometimes when home alone, I am overcome with intense feelings of loneliness and anxiety that I will always be alone. What to do in those moments? I have a broken Led Zeppelin record in my head sometimes…”the best years of my life roll by, here I am alone and blue.”
Anita – thank you as always! I actually had an incident with my dad last night where it was immensely clear to me that *HE* is an extremely large trigger for my anxious and depressed feelings and thoughts. He is unable to provide even emotional support, which is all I have ever asked for from him. It’s really ridiculous and I would love to get into the specifics of it but I am starting to feel weird sharing all these details on a public forum. I think he is a master manipulator, obsessed with money, and super passive aggressive. I’ve only really taken notice of these things since becoming an adult but I know from conversations with my mom that these are traits he has always possessed. How crushing though, to at one time have been a real daddy’s girl and still carry around precious memories of childhood times with him but now see him for who he really is. I guess I should see that I am fortunate to have any positive memories of him at all. Still, I am left with this feeling that I might not have a choice but to cut him out of my life. He seems to be content to text me pictures of his food and dog and constant updates on his boyfriend, but when anything gets deeper than that he twists it around and the mind games begin. ughhhhh so much ridiculousness!!! He told me last night he needs to be free of the bullshit and crap from people he is related to and finds plenty of satisfaction and confidence in strangers and close friends. This after I asked him for advice on buying a home. Crazy, right? Sucks…
KatieParticipantAnita, you are most welcome; thank YOU!!!
Yes, a role reversal indeed. Funny enough, this is what my mom has also said when I’ve talked to her about my interactions with my dad. It is quite confronting when we get to the age where we realize how flawed our parents are. And find ourselves surpassing them in emotional intelligence…I guess it is a good thing, to want to move forward and past this junk.
KatieParticipantAnita, I am truly touched by your responsiveness here. 🙂 Also reading over some other threads and the way you’ve talked with people and helped them sort out their issues…I am just really grateful and I hope you know you are a beautiful person.
Unfortunately, my dad and I haven’t been so close in the last few years. When he was going through his break up with his ex (who had been another father figure to me since the age of 3), my dad would share far too many personal details of their relationship with me. He would keep me on the phone for hours, just talking trash about the ex and failing to respect my boundaries. I had always had some guilty feelings for him…like if I was anything less than loving he would fall apart. He knew how to manipulate this. Like getting really short and pouty if I had to get off the phone. Even as a little kid I can remember him saying things to me like “I only get you for 4 days out of 30…” and I can remember feeling responsible for this. Feeling responsible for both his and my mom’s happiness, but I couldn’t make them both happy at the same time, so always torn. Anyway, when I was living in Maryland and going through my own adult life struggles and splitting up with my ex, I decided to stop falling for the guilt trip trap and started cutting our contact down because I WAS DEALING WITH MY OWN ISSUES. I feel that he is only happy when in a relationship and he becomes CONSUMED with that person when he is in one (which is always). Like it is all he can talk about and this leaves little to no room for me to share my stuff. He is a 65 year old man and in this regard he reminds me of a 12 year old girl who has her first crush. I feel if we have one thing going it is honesty (at least on my part – he is very selective with what information he will share and with whom). I have repeatedly and currently try to maintain a relationship with him but at a bit of a distance and I try to see it for what it is but at the same time keep an open mind with him. He has told me since I was small “your mom and dad are the only people in the world who will love you no matter what.” He is aware of my mom’s emotional tendencies, so yes – he is someone I sometimes talk to about that stuff but he doesn’t like to spend too much time talking about me lol.
KatieParticipantWow, I really relate to what you’ve written. Pretty frustrating to be open and supportive and get that response in return. Could be that he is just not that much of a texter. Also, do you know what his relationship history is like? Like, has he had long term relationships or just more casual short things without a lot of depth? I think you know what sort of relationship you want and if he is able to be a participant in it, which sounds like he really hasn’t shown himself to be. But he might just operate at a different pace than you. And perhaps Anita is right – if you think he has potential to be the sort of partner that you want and if you really do *like* him, maybe try to be more assertive with what you want. Heck, even if he’s not the sort of partner you want, practice is definitely a good thing!
KatieParticipantHey Anita,
Thanks for your thoughtful insight. I think you have some valid points. I have been to counseling on and off and have never really found it to be much help. Finding the right person is essential and that hasn’t been easy. I’ve found most of the therapists I’ve seen have a theory about why you have the problems you have before they even know the whole story and then try to frame everything to fit that – always focusing on that and possibly missing other important stuff in the process. Either that or they don’t really do anything but listen blankly.
Growing up, I actually did have a relationship with my bio dad. He got together with his partner when I was very young and they had an awful break up about 3 years ago. Even though I was only with them every other weekend, they created a very stable and loving home for me. Also probably showed me what a loving relationship looks like since I did not have that example from my mom. Even though that was the case, the fact he is gay was difficult for me growing up as I attended a small Lutheran school and felt constantly like there was something wrong with me because I had this “sinful” secret in my family. Once I entered public high school I grew to embrace it until it eventually became a non-issue, but I struggled greatly with it early on.
I think you have given me a lot to think on, and I appreciate that. I knew some of my struggles could probably be traced to my mom but wasn’t really sure how other than that she was my main role model and example of what is “normal”. Never really thought of it like you have laid out for me. I hope to hear from you again.
Katie
KatieParticipantlgdelacruz92 – thank you for the support, that means a lot to me. It is a perspective like the one you shared that I possess when I am at the most peace in my life but I know in the last several months I have lost it or found it increasingly difficult to grasp. For whatever reason. I think I just need to practice being mindful and non-judgmental about whatever I am feeling. I like this image of picturing ourselves as the clouds.
Anita – thank you 🙂 To answer your questions, that is basically correct although I never really told him that he needed to man up. This was what he realized that he hadn’t done when we were together the first time and so was trying to when we were together more recently. I do feel that my mom constantly thought he wasn’t good enough for me and it’s possible I slowly adopted that feeling also.
Overall, my relationship with my mom is a pretty big can of worms. She has been diagnosed as bipolar but after taking medications and suffering side effects for years she is untreated. I don’t think it’s severe but it has shown itself in my own life as her presence being very inconsistent. She will be super involved and energetic for a month or two and then emotionally disappear for a month or two. This has happened repeatedly throughout my life. Also a lot of anger and bitterness but I’m not really sure what for. Anyway…she and my dad divorced when I was a baby, she remarried when I was 6 to an emotionally abusive and EXTREMELY controlling and jealous man. She and I couldn’t do anything together because he thought it wasn’t fair to leave his kids out. She went along with it all but there was constant fighting. She was in this relationship till I was 16 and we moved out, but ex-step-dad continued to come over for sex for a couple years. Gross that I know that, but I do. To this day she gets defensive when I try to bring up that shitty part of my childhood but has no problem talking about how rough she had it when she was married to him. She hasn’t displayed any real interest in dating since. As for her role in my own dating life, other than her dislike of J, she’s left it mostly up to me. She loved S big time, but he was a parent’s dream really. I know my mom loves me probably more than anything but I do sometimes struggle with wanting to blame her for a lot of my issues…self loathing, being overly critical, isolating myself, having a hard time connecting with people….KatieParticipantI agree that he is actually into you, but it could be he is just not as emotionally connected as you need. I’ve had one great emotionally connected relationship and then the others that turn into long term relationships I end up feeling like they’re not that into me because of this lack of conversation and random banter-y texting. If everything continues as it is now, do you think you will remain interested in him? It could just be that he doesn’t have a lot to say and doesn’t need much out of a relationship. I am currently going through a break up that has been a long time coming because he is fine with seeing each other once or twice a week and only texting “hope you’ve had a good day” and crap like that rather than actually asking me how my day is or what I’m up to and trying to relate to is. Well, obviously that’s not the only reason, but I hope you see my point. Good luck to you, I think he is interested in you but you may want to evaluate how you actually feel about him as he is now.
KatieParticipantThanks all for your responses! I’m sorry it’s taken me a couple days to respond – I don’t have internet at home and find it too tedious to type thoughtful responses on my phone, so I had to wait till I was at work to get back to you.
suzb – Thank you. What a powerful reminder of exactly what I need to be reminded of right now. I think I will come back to your message again and again. It is so scary to take some time out and work on myself because I worry about what I might be missing out on in the process. I know this is illogical, but it’s this stupid fear that I just can’t shake. Truthfully, I have realized I’ve been drinking a little dysfunctionally as a way to avoid dealing with these things and that has probably set me back. I’ve been confronting that issue and just for the past week of not drinking I can see how I’m already thinking more clearly and I do believe I will sort through these feelings and come out the other side. It’s so helpful to have this community to help me with that. 🙂
Miniature Bodhisattva – Thank you for the clarification! That is a pretty empowering distinction, and I appreciate your kindness and taking the time to write. I have a hard time wondering when I will be done processing these feelings? It’s been over two years already but I guess I’ve been running from everything by using alcohol, pot, and other relationships to not confront anything. And I don’t know what this processing looks like? Sitting at home alone, reflecting? Just doing things that I enjoy? You can see how I feel quite lost and confused sometimes.
Anita – the relationship with J was fun, spontaneous and easy. We enjoyed being around each other, things were NEVER boring, we laughed a lot and we just generally got each other on a pretty deep level. We were without a doubt best friends. The problem was all the practical stuff – I was always a student and eventually got my master’s degree, while he never finished high school. My mom didn’t like him at all and would make no effort to talk to him when he was around. She was worried I was always paying for things for him, which I did do some but not excessively. J didn’t have any strong parental role models and I feel like he really didn’t learn a lot of life skills that I would have to be making up for and worrying about. I guess that was one thing that sticks with me – the feeling that when we were together I was the one who needed to always be taking care of things, and this created a lot of anxiety in me that manifested as being outwardly very critical of him. I would say this is what eroded our relationship the first time around and caused all the break ups and make ups – the fact that I was so critical and he was unwilling to man up (he did admit this when we got together the last time). He treated me well…we are both emotional so we could have blow ups at times but I don’t feel either of us ever became abusive. If he hadn’t met his current girlfriend (actually they are engaged) when he did I fully believe I would have come to my senses and SOON and we would’ve got back together again. Logically though I know that even if we had I wouldn’t have learned the exact lessons I am meant to be learning now and for the past two years and we probably wouldn’t have succeeded because of that.
Ok, relationship with S – was a complete opposite to J. S was stable and successful and older and I felt completely taken care of by him and like it was an actual adult relationship. He is a Brit who was working in the states when we met, and after being together for about a year and a half he had to go back to the UK so we did long distance for another year and a half and then he got a job in Maryland (I’m from Indiana) so we moved there together where we were for yet another year and a half before I ended it and moved back to Indy. I would say things were great until he had to go back home…I started feeling a lack of connection but decided to take a leap of faith and move to Maryland with him anyway hoping that being together would make everything better. I became isolated and missed my family and home and because of circumstances the only way for us to move back to Indiana together was to finally get married and I just couldn’t take that step. S treated me great and in the beginning I was also great. Towards the end, I became overly critical yet again and I know I hurt him a lot.
The relationship with R is really just a blip on the screen. We both started at a company around the same time and developed a kind of teasing friendship but there was definite chemistry there that most people could see. He had VERY recently lost his mom to cancer and I felt some strange pull to make him feel better (I don’t even know how to explain this). Our relationship became physical pretty much immediately when we started meeting outside of work but I was always the one trying to make plans and driving to his house and I really feel pretty lame about all of it especially because I betrayed J in the process – although I did break it off with J the first time R and I kissed. But still…Anyway, R went back to college (yes, quite a bit younger than me. dumb!) and we had a couple good weekends together before he became distant and broke things off with me. I’m sure I was putting too much pressure on him for a real and serious relationship. I probably wanted him to replace J’s role in my life which was obviously unfair. R has since graduated college and come back to work full time at the company I am still at and there is surprisingly no awkwardness but also NO RESIDUAL FEELINGS. I think this is what kills me – how I could have sacrificed this relationship with J for a fling with someone I now see on a daily basis and neither of us feel anything for one another. I just don’t know what I could have been thinking.
Geeze, thank you for reading all of this Anita, and I am really hopeful to start conversing about it with you.
KatieParticipantThank you for that super sweet and encouraging message Lifelifeloveeleni!! I believe you are a beautiful person too. 🙂 You gave me lots of positive things to remember and think about and I am grateful for that. I think part of my struggle right now really has to do with currently being in a relationship I’m not happy in but I’m finding it so hard to get some courage to get out. It feels so much easier to just be complacent…
KatieParticipantWow, I have goosebumps after reading this thread. Nan, what a challenging time you are going through right now but cling to that hope for the future…that is absolutely amazing that after all these years you have a chance of real love and a life together with your first husband!!! Thank you so much for sharing your story. I think that takes a lot of courage. At 31 years old, I have had a similar re-connection with a first love but I think I was still too immature to appreciate how special it was so I have lost it yet again. Perhaps that’s what these 40 years have given you…the awareness of how special and rare your connection with R-1 is…and with that knowing you won’t lose it again. It’s so scary to have the realization that time is ticking and when it’s gone, it’s gone. This life is YOURS. It’s clear to me that you’ve done so much for the people you love, and have been successful even though you had close people in your life scheming and working against you. I wish so much for you to be happy in any way you choose and I hope to read an update in another few months or even sooner. Hugs, strength, and patience to you. 🙂
KatieParticipantKayt and Inky:
THANK YOU!! Just an update…I had an appointment on Friday with two awesome behaviorists. It was intense and I learned SO much. I’ve been implementing my new tools and Nugget has started using the treadmill. 🙂 I know now that Nugget was really confused about what he was supposed to be doing because I was not being a leader to him. We won’t do a 180 overnight or even over a weekend, but I am really hopeful that our relationship (mine and Nugget’s) will become stronger than ever. I also feel some growing confidence within myself just because of how I am handling my dog differently. So Nugget is my focus right now, and even with that being said, my boyfriend and I had a pretty great weekend together. He realizes he is not being supportive and so right now we just don’t discuss Nugget much. I know this isn’t a solution….at some point we are obviously going to have to figure it out. If things continue to progress as they are with Nugget, he will be with me forever. And I will not allow someone to mistreat my dog or set him back. So I’m hoping that boyfriend will be on board with a little time and positivity from my end. If not, it will be super hard because of the feelings I’ve developed but I know I deserve more than someone who would either not respect how I want my dog to be treated or pressure me to get rid of him.
KatieParticipantKayt…
Wow, I very much appreciate your thoughtful response. You spoke right to my heart and brought me to tears. After reading what you wrote a couple times, I feel even more determined to work with Nugget and learn what I need to do to be a good human for him. I know he is capable of so much….it amazes me how smart he is. I just need tools to help him direct that towards being mentally and emotionally healthy.
As for the boyfriend. It makes me sick but…I know these things you say to be true. In my gut. I KNOW. But I’ve allowed myself to fall in love with him (either that or I am just so desperate to be in a relationship that I will put up with things I know are not right) and I’m finding it really hard to end it. I say end it because I have tried to have these talks with him and there is just no changing his mind on certain things (like how to deal with dogs). I’d say his violence is definitely ignorance based which is probably why I’ve stuck it out in the hopes I could enlighten him but that’s not happening at all. I’ve seen him be so gentle and loving…and very understanding and open at times which is probably what makes me hold on. Thankfully I’ve never been in an abusive romantic relationship before, but I see some patterns with him (never physical, but saying things like “no man will ever want to deal with that dog”). It’s so strange how I can observe these things and for the most part see them for what they are, but make the conscious decision to still want to be with him. When I realized a while ago he was not the best person for me, it was almost like I was playing a game by sticking with him to see how ridiculous the relationship could get. How much stupid shit I would put up with. Doesn’t make any sense to me, and it probably makes even less sense reading it. I’m hoping writing some of this out will be therapeutic for me and help me come to terms with what I need to do and take action.
I hope to hear from you again!! Thanks very much Kayt.
- This reply was modified 9 years, 1 month ago by Katie.
KatieParticipantHi Jeena,
I ditto everything Filipe said. And I DO think it’s absolutely possible to develop real feelings online…how those feelings translate in the “real world” is a different issue entirely. But that you won’t know until you are physically around the person. I say you keep trying to meet. You won’t know if it’s real until you do. 🙂
- This reply was modified 9 years, 10 months ago by Katie. Reason: forgot a word!
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