Home→Forums→Emotional Mastery→Alienation or abandonment looking for insight
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December 31, 2024 at 1:33 am #441128beniParticipant
Thank you Anita. Let’s set sails for 2025!
December 31, 2024 at 8:04 am #441135anitaParticipantDear Beni:
Yes, let’s set sails for 2025!
Ever since I read your first post (on June 18, 2023, in your 1st of 3 threads), I found you interesting and difficult (for me) to understand. I want to try to understand you better today. If I understand you better, I get to understand myself better because we are two human beings and therefore, we have a whole lot in common. With better understanding, it’s likely to be a better sailing for 2025..
I hope that you don’t mind the length (or content) of this post (?) You are welcome to choose to read it or not, and if you proceed to read, you can stop reading at any time, and you are welcome to respond, or to not respond to the following.
I will start with what you shared yesterday: “I feel a bit shy to be more active here. It seems I can be active here being more or less authentic. I think it’s difficult for me to help cause I try to help and that confuses me. Somehow it does not feel right. I tell myself that I use you all. And maybe sometimes I seek affirmation or try to impress and also it’s not my true intention. It’s difficult to accept that.”-
– As I understand it, you expressed a level of self-consciousness, fear of judgment, and an internal conflict about being true to yourself while participating in the forums. You find it difficult to help others because your motivations are not entirely clear to you, leading to confusion and discomfort.
You acknowledged that sometimes you seek affirmation or try to impress others. and that trying to impress others is a true intention, stemming from a sense of neediness. This reveals a vulnerability and a desire for acceptance and validation from others. You feel conflicted about your desire for affirmation and the authenticity of your actions.
Your self-awareness and honesty are admirable, Beni. It takes courage to reflect on these motivations and acknowledge them.
It’s important to remember that seeking acceptance and validation is a natural and universal human experience. At the core of our social nature as humans, we have a fundamental need to connect with others. This connection often involves seeking acceptance and validation from those around us— whether it’s family, friends, colleagues, or even strangers.
According to psychologist Abraham Maslow, humans have a hierarchy of needs, and after our basic physiological and safety needs are met, we seek love, belonging, and esteem. Validation from others helps fulfill these social and esteem needs.
Seeking and receiving validation strengthens our social bonds. It fosters a sense of community and belonging, as we feel understood and supported by those around us. In times of uncertainty or stress, validation from others provides emotional support. It helps us navigate challenges and reinforces that we are not alone in our experiences.
While seeking validation from others is a natural part of the human experience, it’s also important to develop self-validation. This means recognizing and affirming our own worth and accomplishments without relying solely on external feedback. Balancing both forms of validation leads to a healthier sense of self and more resilient self-esteem.
In essence, seeking acceptance and validation is a universal aspect of being human. It contributes to our emotional well-being, self-esteem, and sense of connection with others. Acknowledging this need and striving for a balance between external and self-validation leads to a more fulfilling and confident life.
Being authentic involves transparent communication, that is, expressing one’s thoughts and feelings without pretense, disguise or deceit. It involves aligning your behavior with your true values rather than conforming to external expectations or trying to please others. It takes self awareness, that is, understanding and acknowledging your true self, including your strengths, weaknesses, values, and emotions.
Authenticity means not hiding behind a facade and allowing others to see the real you.
Being authentic is about maintaining consistency between your inner values and your outward actions. This means that your behavior reflects your true values, even when it’s challenging. Authenticity includes integrity, that is, upholding your values and principles, even in the face of adversity or pressure. Authenticity requires staying true to your moral compass and not compromising your beliefs for convenience or approval.
Being authentic boosts self-confidence, as you feel more comfortable and secure in your own skin. It reduces the anxiety and stress that come with trying to be someone you’re not.
Living authentically leads to greater personal fulfillment and satisfaction, as you’re able to pursue your true passions and goals without fear of judgment or rejection. It promotes emotional well-being, as it allows you to process and express your true emotions. It reduces the emotional toll of hiding your true self and fosters a healthier mental state.
On July 1, 2024, in your first thread, you shared: “What I wanna say is that some parents do not take there kid’s experience serious. They say it’s being manipulative. They do not understand that the child may feel very very different about this and that it feels real to the child. It’s an ignorant perspective. So sometimes I see my inner child out of that perspective.”-
-Here you expressed frustration that some parents do not take their children’s experiences seriously and often label their children’s emotions or actions as manipulative. This dismissal indicates a lack of empathy and understanding of the child’s perspective. You highlight that children’s feelings are real and impactful to them, even if parents perceive them differently. This parental perspective undermines the child’s emotional needs and leads to feelings of invalidation. You acknowledged that sometimes you view your inner child through the same dismissive lens that you criticize in parents. This means that you occasionally downplays or invalidates your own emotions and experiences.
This internal conflict suggests an ongoing struggle with self-acceptance and recognizing the validity of your own feelings.
In general, parents invalidate their children’s emotions in a variety of ways, a few are:
1) Dismissal: Example: A child says, “I’m scared of the dark,” and the parent responds, “There’s nothing to be scared of. Just go to bed.”
2) Minimizing: Example: A child expresses sadness about a friend moving away, and therent says, “It’s not a big deal. You’ll make new friends.”
3) Criticizing: Example: A child is upset after losing a game, and the parent says, “Stop being a sore loser. It’s just a game.”
4) Blaming: Example: A child says they are hurt by something a sibling said, and the parent responds, “Well, you probably deserved it. You shouldn’t have provoked them.”
5) Ignoring: Example: A child is crying and the parent pretends not to notice or says nothing about it.
6) Overriding: Example: A child is excited about a project, and the parent dismissively says, “That’s nice, but let’s focus on something more important.”
7) Labeling: Example: A child shows anger, and the parent labels them as “dramatic” or “overly emotional.”
When parents routinely invalidate their children’s emotions, it leads to long-term emotional consequences. Children learn to suppress their feelings, struggle with self-worth, and have difficulty trusting their own emotions. It’s important for parents to validate their children’s emotions by listening, empathizing, and acknowledging their feelings as real and important.
I would say, Beni, that you and I do indeed have a lot in common: I too grew up in a very emotionally invalidating home, so much so, that I often refer to myself not growing up, but growing-in (emotions supprssed, turned inward), and I don’t feel that the word “home” applies to where I grew in.. because it was not a safe place, an emotionally-safe place that is (which is what a “home” is supposed to be).
I was severely and regularly invalidated. The emotional Consequences to me: Low Self-Esteem (a poor self-image and lack of confidence in my worth and abilities), Emotional Suppression (leading to difficulty in expressing emotions and a disconnect from my own emotional experiences: dissociation, numbing, being spacey/ not present), Chronic Anxiety and Depression (feeling isolated, misunderstood, and unable to trust my own emotions), Difficulty Identifying Emotions (an inability to recognize, label and therefore, manage my own emotions, resulting in confusion).
Social consequences: Relationship Issues (severe difficulties with trust, communication, and emotional intimacy), Attachment Problems (avoiding close relationships to protect myself from further hurt), Poor Boundaries (becoming overly accommodating to please others or becoming overly rigid to protect myself).
Cognitive Consequences: Negative Thought Patterns (such as self-doubt and negative self-talk), Impaired Problem-Solving Skills and Decision-Making (because of not trusting my own judgment and emotions as valuable tools in these processes).
I will close this post with: let’s indeed set sails for 2025: let’s prepare for and embark on the journey into 2025 with a positive mindset and a sense of adventure, moving further into self-acceptance, validation, and connection both within and without!
anita
January 2, 2025 at 11:44 am #441216beniParticipantHeey, I just did a reply and it got lost on the way. Maybe I do another one later <3
January 2, 2025 at 12:15 pm #441219anitaParticipantDear Beni: I am sorry that you lost your post. What I do every time before I click “submit” is to copy my post, so that if it fails to submit, I can re-submit my copy. Looking forward to reading from you later!
anita
January 5, 2025 at 6:07 am #441275TParticipantI have gorgeous eyes and I have a haunted look because I am being abused every day. People need not to go along with the psychological harassment of others. It is evil.
January 5, 2025 at 12:41 pm #441305anitaParticipant* Dear T:
Thank you for sharing something so personal. I’m truly sorry to hear about the abuse you’re experiencing.
It’s important for people to stand against psychological harassment and support one another. Please know that there are resources and people who care about your well-being. Stay strong, and don’t hesitate to seek help from trusted individuals or organizations.
You are welcome to start your own thread (go to FORUMS at the top of the home page) and share your story. I would like to read and reply to you empathetcally and respectfully.
anita
January 7, 2025 at 12:31 pm #441410beniParticipantThank for your comment T. It’s your first comment here in this forum! It’s an honor 🙂 I wish you well!
January 13, 2025 at 7:01 am #441515beniParticipantHi Anita,
Thanks for the reply 🙂
– As I understand it, you expressed a level of self-consciousness, fear of judgment, and an internal conflict about being true to yourself while participating in the forums. You find it difficult to help others because your motivations are not entirely clear to you, leading to confusion and discomfort.
I somehow lose myself in the process of helping. And then there is an expectation that I need to give to receive. So when I only receive I can feel uncomfortable. I’d like to understand better that people often do things without expecting anything in return and it’s more my view on things and the people wich conditioned me rather than truth. Do you wanna share you’re interest in this conversation and what you expect in return? What it nurishes in you?
I would say, Beni, that you and I do indeed have a lot in common: I too grew up in a very emotionally invalidating home, so much so, that I often refer to myself not growing up, but growing-in (emotions supprssed, turned inward), and I don’t feel that the word “home” applies to where I grew in.. because it was not a safe place, an emotionally-safe place that is (which is what a “home” is supposed to be).
I was severely and regularly invalidated. The emotional Consequences to me: Low Self-Esteem (a poor self-image and lack of confidence in my worth and abilities), Emotional Suppression (leading to difficulty in expressing emotions and a disconnect from my own emotional experiences: dissociation, numbing, being spacey/ not present), Chronic Anxiety and Depression (feeling isolated, misunderstood, and unable to trust my own emotions), Difficulty Identifying Emotions (an inability to recognize, label and therefore, manage my own emotions, resulting in confusion).
Social consequences: Relationship Issues (severe difficulties with trust, communication, and emotional intimacy), Attachment Problems (avoiding close relationships to protect myself from further hurt), Poor Boundaries (becoming overly accommodating to please others or becoming overly rigid to protect myself).
Cognitive Consequences: Negative Thought Patterns (such as self-doubt and negative self-talk), Impaired Problem-Solving Skills and Decision-Making (because of not trusting my own judgment and emotions as valuable tools in these processes).
I hear you suffer(d) much darling!
It makes me feel sad and tired.
How is it now where are you on your journey? How do you relate to your parents? Did you find your people? Do you attract the live and people you want to attract?January 13, 2025 at 7:21 am #441521anitaParticipantDear Beni:
I studied your first thread this morning (well, night really, slept very little) because I realized lately that you and I have a lot in common in regard to our relationships with our mothers. In my almost 10 years in these forums, I don’t remember reading from any other member who experienced something so similar to what I experienced in content, intensity and consequences, so understanding you better leads me to understanding me better.
These are your words from your thread “How can I do what I want with joy”, July 18, 2023- Sept 15, 2024: “it’s something like my space. She was too close. There was not enough space for me… By not expressing myself I protect my Mom from worrying, or meet her need for control. If she makes a request and I’m not sure that it’s selfless I can’t do it… It sometimes feels like that I am my mom”-
– In the early stages of life, babies are naturally enmeshed with their primary caregiver, often the mother. This means that babies rely entirely on their mother for their physical and emotional needs. This close bond is crucial for the baby’s survival and development.
As children grow, they go through a process called separation-individuation. This is when they begin to recognize themselves as separate individuals from their mother. This process typically starts in infancy and continues through early childhood. It’s a gradual journey of gaining independence and developing a unique sense of self.
In a healthy developmental environment, the mother (if she is the primary or sole caretaker) supports the child’s growing independence while providing a secure base. This means the child feels safe to explore and express their individuality, knowing they have support to return to. This balance helps the child develop a strong, independent sense of self while maintaining a healthy attachment to the mother.
If the mother is too controlling and makes everything about her, this process is disrupted and the child struggle to separate and individuate, as they constantly feel pressured to meet the mother’s needs or expectations.
In such cases, the child may remain enmeshed, finding it challenging to develop their own identity and autonomy. This can lead to difficulties in establishing healthy boundaries and self-confidence later in life.
In summary, while all babies start with a natural enmeshment with their primary caregiver, a healthy development involves gradual separation and individuation. If the mother is overly controlling, it hinders this process, leading to ongoing enmeshment and challenges in forming an independent sense of self.
More of what you shared in that thread: “When I’m with people with different dialect I adopt it. I can easily be with a group and agree to every activity. I might lose my autonomy with time. Yes, I tend to tell people what they want to hear… I’d like to learn how to set healthy boundaries… I’d like to set boundaries with my mother.. I have some memories of self destructive behavior. Where I destroy things I like or a window or hit myself on the head to find some exit for how I feel… Empathy and the ability to express how you feel, really listen with the heart. I do not remember my parents doing that. Telling me how they feel or having these moments of connection much… when I think at my childhood I get maybe straight away 2-3 situations. In 4 Minutes I get like 8 situations, I remember… By not expressing myself I protect my Mom from worrying or meet her need for control… I do not wish to be controlled. I want to be asked what I would like to do… I’ve been thinking that I am dependent on her (subconscious). Cause I noticed that the things which stress her out like traveling, working a regular job, not misusing drugs, having a girlfriend are things I struggle(d) creating for myself…It sometimes feels like that I am my mom and my self is this thing I can’t control”-
– Like you, I struggled with autonomy. I was mostly unable to make decisions and act independently, without being controlled by others. I was unable to form and pursue my own goals and values. Essentially, I didn’t have the power to make choices and take actions that were in line with my own desires and principles. Like you, my tendency has been to tell people what they want to hear and people-please in other ways.
Growing up and into adulthood, on one hand I felt too close to my mother, so close that I felt suffocated. There was little to no emotional space for me. She took all the space, none left for me. I was unable to distinguish my own emotional state from hers: if she was anxious, I was anxious. If she felt hurt by a person, I was hurt by the same person. If she was angry at whomever, I was angry at him or her. When she felt good, it was my opportunity (as rare as it was) to feel good. It’s like I didn’t have my own feelings. I experienced her feelings.
But I did have my own feelings, it’s just that there was no space for my feelings. Her feelings took all the space.
On the other hand, the relationship severely lacked genuine emotional intimacy and understanding. This created a paradox where I was physically and emotionally close to my mother but psychologically distant and isolated, a confusing mix of being too close and too far.
Like you, my memories of my childhood last (if I replay them in my mind) only a few minutes. My mother’s dominant presence dominated my own experiences away from her (like when in school).
In general terms, severe enmeshment is traumatic and it therefore affects mempry.
in an enmeshed relationship, the child is continually exposed to the parent’s intense emotions and needs. This is overwhelming, causing chronic stress and anxiety. The child’s emotional system is constantly on high alert, trying to manage and respond to the parent’s emotional state, which leads to emotional exhaustion and trauma. The constant suppression of self is traumatic, as the child’s needs and desires are persistently overshadowed by the parent’s. The undue burden of feeling responsible for the parent’s emotional states creates intense feelings of guilt and shame and prevents the child from developing healthy, age-appropriate relationships, leading to long-term psychological distress.
When the child faces an ongoing internal conflict between their need for independence and the parent’s controlling behavior, it is deeply distressing and traumatic as the child feels torn between loyalty to the parent and the desire to assert their own identity. The inability to resolve this conflict leads to feelings of helplessness, frustration, and emotional pain.
The emotional trauma from enmeshment has lasting effects into adulthood, including difficulties in forming healthy relationships, feelings of inadequacy and low self-worth, anxiety and depression caused by chronic stress, and a weak or fragmented sense of self, making it challenging to make independent decisions and pursue personal goals.
Moving to this thread, you shared on Dec 15, 2024: “I wonder if someone want’s to share his insight to the following: I noticed that when I meet someone with the glassy alienated look in their eyes. It affects me very much… I have stomach pain… It’s hard to move my body. It’s hard to speak even to myself. I feel alienated too and I worry big for the person even if I don’t know her”-
– This heightened sensitivity to others’ emotions is an extgension of the traumatic enmeshment experience of childhood. The child is continuously exposed to the mother’s intense emotions, creating a constant emotional overload. Unlike in healthy relationships where the child has space to process his/ her own emotions, an enmeshed child is perpetually entangled in the mother’s emotional state without relief. The child often feels responsible for managing the mother’s emotions, which is an overwhelming burden for a young mind. Failing to meet her emotional needs leads to feelings of guilt and shame, further compounding the emotional distress. The mother’s intense emotions are, in effect, traumatic to the child and trauma can indeed manifest physically, with symptoms such as stomach pain, headaches, or other stress-related ailments.
In summary, the intense and continuous exposure to a controlling and emotionally overwhelming parent, coupled with the burden of emotional caretaking, can indeed make the mother’s feelings traumatic for an enmeshed child. Fast forward, the enmeshed child is now an adult… and other people’s strong emotions, like the stranger with glassy alienated look in hia/ hwe eyes, are experienced as traumatic.
Back to something you wrote in your first thread: “I feel disconnected when I set boundaries. It’s like one or the other extreme: only you or only me”- You experienced boundary-setting as an extreme, feeling that it has to be either “only you” (completely giving in to the other person’s needs) or “only me” (focusing solely on your own needs).
This all-or-nothing thinking (as in it’s me OR you) is common in enmeshed individuals. Setting boundaries can feel like an act of self-betrayal (if you satisfy the other person’s needs) or betrayal of the other person (if you satisfy your own needs), creating significant emotional discomfort. Healing is about finding a balance, and since you are way into your healing journey, you will put balance more and more into practice with people who are not controlling and dominanting (better avoid and stay away from controlling and dominating people, family or otherwise).
anita
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