To me ego is the identity one assigns to themselves. The concept me being my own entity separate from others comes from the ego. And I had mentioned earlier that I think the ego is there to protect us. Surely, life would be a lot easier if we let go of my understanding of ego because the number of things that matter would dramatically reduce. But at the same time, if I don’t have that ego wouldn’t it be hard to protect myself from others?

In the first sentence you make the statement – “The ego is the identity” (ego = identity) You can how suffering might result. I am a athlete, my self of self, my identity is attached to my athletic ability. I break my leg and can no longer perform. Who am I? Ego experienced as identify is prone to Inflation (Feelings that we are better than we are. I am better than you because I am a better athlete) and Deflation (I am nothing because you are a better athlete then I).  Perhaps you notice how both inflation and deflation are measurements that separate us from the other. Not in the healthy way that would aid someone to learning to live in harmony with others and themselves. Nothing produces more conflict, tribalism, disharmony then when ego = identity and it feels threatened.

How do I see ego? I picture ego as the part of ourselves that communicates experience. A tool we use to help one understand, learn, keep safe, become conscious…. I have an ego, it is useful, I am not my ego.

My feeling is that in the East there is a tendency to negate the ego often resulting in a lack of energy to engage, while in the West a tendency toward over identifying with ego resulting in a need to dominate, consume, own…

As you mentioned ego plays a important role in keeping one safe, the question might be then is how it does so? Ego as Identity? or Ego as container, communicator,  boundaries?

I mentioned Jung’s statement – ‘It take a healthy ego to let go of ego’. Jung suggested that the first half of life task was to develop a healthy container (ego). A neither inflated nor deflated sense of self, healthy boundaries that was capable of providing for itself, family, society…) The second half of life task involves the paradox of separating oneself from others, which at the same time recognizes the other as/in themselves. Which naturally flows into compassion for ourselves and others. A drop in the ocean contains the ocean…

This was a lesson I also learned in dancing. When you start to take classes to learn the rhythms and rules. A waltz looks like this, a Cha Cha like this. Eventually the student will be told that to dance they must ‘forget‘ what they learned to dance. But not until they developed the ‘container’. To break the rules, one must know the rules. Forget is probably the wrong word as what happens is that the student learns to Trust what they learned, trust that the body knows (Body always knew how to dance, the student must work for that which the body already knows. Like the statue that already exists in the stone)

Another story

A man traveling along a path came to a great expanse of water. As he stood on the shore, he realized there were dangers and discomforts all about. But the other shore appeared safe and inviting. The man looked for a boat or a bridge and found neither. But with great effort he gathered grass, twigs and branches and tied them all together to make a simple raft. Relying on the raft to keep himself afloat, the man paddled with his hands and feet and reached the safety of the other shore. He could continue his journey on dry land.

Now, what would he do with his makeshift raft? Would he drag it along with him or leave it behind? He would leave it, the Buddha said. Then the Buddha explained that the dharma is like a raft. It is useful for crossing over but not for holding onto….

I agree with Tommy’s concern with the word ‘seek’  as we tend to see the world as we are not as it is, thier will be a tendency to find what we expect to find.

Note however that Seek does not stand alone in the formula. The seeker seeks, knocks and waits.  Note how the knock (not passive) creates vibrations…. and puts into motion… as we wait the ripples pushing aside that which may cloud our vision, the water better able to reflect what is…..

Here is a riddle for you. When does a seeker become a finder?

If one is open to love then is one seeking love? If one is open to love then will one find love?

I use love as an example cause I find love to be real. Where as, hate or anger is not real. When hate or anger comes up, it comes at first as urges and then get supporting thoughts to bolster its stay in the mind and body. Love just is.  There is no need of thoughts to supports its stay in the mind. Is love desires or wants? Personally, I do not believe true love is. But, have seen many levels. Maybe I am just a wishful thinker.

Note: Have not had much sleep lately. So please do not cross examine me upon these words I posts. Just a sleepy man.

• This reply was modified 2 years, 10 months ago by Tommy.

Monks would spend much of their time sitting in meditation. Thinking this is the way to enlightenment. Then to be enlightened, would remove them from suffering. Bodhidharma would take a roof tile and start to polish it. The monks asked him what he was doing. Answer was polishing roof tiles to become mirrors. One’s mind can not become enlightened. No more than one can polish a roof tile into mirror. The thinking reinforces the world we live in. Oops, sorry, rambling again.

Buddha once related a story of a village of the blind. Rumors were that the next village would attack with elephants. Not knowing what an elephant was, they had someone bring them an elephant to discover what is an elephant. Three blind men went to discover what an elephant truly was. One man said it was like a big flap of cloth as he felt the ear of the elephant. And, another said it was like a rope as he felt the tail. The third man said it was like a heavy column as he felt the leg of the elephant. Enlightenment is like discovering an elephant. First glimpse, of the truth is not the whole truth. And enlightenment has many depths. Like shining a flash light into the deepest dark space. It only illuminates that which it shines upon. There is much to discover. Bliss is not the goal. Stepping into the dog poop is part of Karma when one is part of the cycle of life, death and rebirth. Sorry, think I read this somewhere??

• This reply was modified 2 years, 9 months ago by Tommy.

Dear Tommy:

I wish to read more from you. I followed your recent communication with another member, and I hope that it did not discourage you from posting again. It happens sometimes that a member will start threads not for the purpose of considering the input in replies received, but for the purpose of trapping members who sincerely try to help, using a thread as a spider web, if you will, and then proceeding to “prove” a point they, and even to abuse members and feel better for it.  Sad, isn’t it?

anita

Dear Tommy:

You are welcome and thank you for your kind words. Unfortunately, I am not that smart. I am smarter than I used to be, that’s all. Hopefully, I will be smarter tomorrow than I am today.

“One cannot convince a person of something they wish not to listen to or not to believe in” – and therefore, one should stop trying to convince. I wasted decades of my life reaching out to a person (my mother) who never wished to listen to me. More recently, I reached out multiple times to a casual friend who similarly never wished to listen to me. When I realized this dynamic, I finally stopped reaching out to him and my policy now is that IF he reaches out to me, then I respond to the extent that matches his effort of reaching out to me.

There is a strong, enduring thirst in me to be seen/ heard by those who won’t. I need to contain this thirst.

“I know that I can only change myself. Hopefully for the better” – same here, for the better!

anita

Dear Tommy:

I read that small kidney stones pass spontaneously through urination. I hope that it passed by now. There are teas and supplements advertised as “Herbal support for kidneys” and “stone breakers”- maybe these can help you?

“Surprisingly, waiting there, the pain slowly went away” – if you went to the bathroom while waiting, maybe a kidney stone was passed and as a result the pain went away.

“My notion of truth was pain and suffering are a great motivator. I realize I do not have a lot of time on this earth. And if there was anything to bring meaning to this life, I hope it would be to become more open minded, more mindful, help others and be good to my family and friends” – wouldn’t it be a very good thing if all of us saw humanity as our family and friends; do no harm to no human, help any human we come across, if we detect a need, however we can, mindfully, open mindedly.

Good to read from you again, and please, do post again at any time you want to post, reading from you is valuable to me.

anita

Dear Tommy:

I understand now about the pain having to do with the stone moving. I didn’t know that a 3 mm kidney stone is quite large. But it is possible for a 5 mm stone to pass naturally, your doctor said. And here is one more reason to drink more water (I don’t like to drink water and I don’t drink enough): to prevent the formation of kidney stones.  Just the other day, someone told me that her doctor told her that drinking more water prevents some (minor, I am guessing) muscular injuries and pain. I wonder if drinking more water can help with your back pain.

So, you are drinking more water and the next thing you expect to happen is… more pain as the stone moves and is passed? I hope to read from you soon that it passed and at least, this issue has been resolved!

anita