January 11, 2017 at 7:30 pm #125085
Reads to me like you have been quite depressed for some time (stopped exercising, neglecting personal grooming, thought suicide… unmotivated, procrastinating, bingeing on TV, resumed bad habits, some things you are too ashamed to tell your wife, social isolation…)-
best, if possible for you, is to attend competent psychotherapy.
I wonder about the origin of your serious depression. I still believe the story of the console is very significant, and I do believe our childhood experiences have a lot to do with our experiences as adults. You wrote your wife has a big heart, but you are not close with her, I understand.
I don't know where to go from here, let me know if you have an idea…
anitaJanuary 12, 2017 at 1:18 am #125089
Thanks for replying back so clearly and promptly. Before I can comment on the other areas of your message, I must say I was rather intrigued by work related issues in particular.
The first thing that comes to my mind is what you mention about your dependance on manuals or role models for accomplishing a task. This indicates two things to me :-
1. A lack of self confidence and risk taking
2. A fixed mindset
1 means that you are used to taking a safe well-defined route or atleast need to have someone who has charted something remotely similar.
This means that you are afraid to fail, prefer the safe zone,
which in turn leads me to conclude point 2, that is a fixed mindset signifying a very fixed notion of your capacities.
The procrastination makes sense here actually – you put it off as far as possible, not sure what to do, Google isn't helping either and then finally because you have to send something, you somehow send some random stuff.
This ironically looks like carefree but does nothing for growing your confidence in your own inherent abilities, Which was somewhat fine for college still.
Clearly not for a profit targeting organisation that requires a more clear, innovative approach.
Now I am not suggesting you can't do your job.
Surely you can. That's why hired you.
Can you see though how your fear of facing possible failure is setting you up for failure anyway? which in turn reinforces your negative core belief about yourself?
Now the question of what is required in your work situation:-
Good, hard numbers which requires-
a) Basic concepts
b) A knack for seeing patterns
c) Analysis, strategies, ability to connect dots
d) People skills – (i) Colleagues (ii) Superiors (iii) clients
e) Initiative, working individually
f) Out of box thinking
In which of the above do you feel you are lacking? Is there any specific area outside these four items where you feel like you lack ability?
Please do correct me if I am getting it wrong somewhere 🙂
NinaJanuary 12, 2017 at 3:43 am #125095
“maybe my suffering will end when I jump down but nowadays i will shake out that mindset more easily than before, because I do not want my wife to be hurt”
Be noted that your suffering is NOT going to end by doing something like this (giving away your life). Your soul will take another body and the same patterns that you are going through now will be repeated again and you will encounter the same issue in the upcoming lifetime(s), until you are fully “healed” of your issues either by facing/going through the situation (painful) or by overcoming the situation by practicing any of the ‘life healing methodologies' (not painful). More about these life healing techniques below.
“But, how to do so when I have subconsciously and consciously closed myself up and have zero confidence to do anything now?”
Good that you brought up this question of yours which allowed me to understand that you are already aware of having a “closure” at the (subconscious/conscious) mind level.
It seems to me that no amount of willpower to do anything is working for you? Is this correct? In fact you are not even getting that ‘will' to do anything.
If so, that (willpower) won't work because of internal resistance (typically subconscious) which we won't even know. This resistance causes a constant state of internal (unconscious) stress, as soon as we think of doing something. (As a quick example lots of people feel like exercising to lose weight but cannot after some time)
It could be from childhood memories or even generational ones brought down to you long before. These unconscious/subconscious memories are stored at the cell level and requires “healing” so that once done you do things in an effortless way (without exerting any conscious/deliberate willpower).
Of course if you know of any process that does exactly this then please follow that. But from what I know this can be done through the Love Code (formerly called as Beyond Willpower).
– At first go through the below link. If you do not have the motivation to read this then do this for one last time.
– Go through the FREE video series on this page
– If it interests you then you can get to understand more about the concept and/or the tools/exercises through the book at the below link
The book also has a separate chapter which takes the reader through a step-by-step practical 40 day program of practicing the Love Code.
The Love Code would bring you long term healing. Until you start practicing it, a short term process would be for you to “live in day-tight compartments” (something similar to what your beloved wife tells you to do by taking small steps). Take one day at a time. Make plans for the upcoming days/months. But only do what is required to do for that particular day. If “a day” is too overwhelming for you then consider just the next 1 hour. Look at your watch. If it is 9 am then say – “Ok. From 9 am to 10 am I am going to think and do only that is required during this 1 hour. If thoughts about getting overwhelmed and NOT wanting to do things come, then say to yourself – “Anyways, I only need to do this till the next hour, so never mind, let me continue doing what I was doing.” Then look at your watch and do the same again between 10 am to 11 am. If you prefer, reduce it even to the next 30 minutes. Just make an intention to live fully in the present moment for the next 30 minutes of your life as best as you can, by acting upon things required to be done only for those 30 minutes. You mentioned “When I’m at work, I try to think about what I wish my life to be” -So just “BE” in those 30 minutes and do not go into your past or your future. While doing work, wishing about life is going into the future. Even if you go, bring your attention back to those 30 minutes. To make your life even more peaceful and harmonious, you can go even further by reducing the 30 minutes to just thinking and taking action only for the present moment- The Now.
Use the below excerpt from Eckhart Tolle's “The Power of Now”
“For example, if you were stuck in the mud somewhere, you wouldn't say. “Okay, I resign myself to being stuck in the mud.” Resignation is not surrender. You don't need to accept an undesirable or unpleasant life situation. Nor do you need to deceive yourself and say that there is nothing wrong with being stuck in the mud. No. You recognize fully that you want to get out of it. You then narrow your attention down to the present moment without mentally labeling it in any way. This means that there is no judgment of the Now. Therefore, there is no resistance, no emotional negativity. You accept the “isness” of this moment. Then you take action and do all that you can to get out of the mud. Such action I call positive action. It is far more effective than negative action, which arises out of anger, despair, or frustration. Until you achieve the desired result, you continue to practice surrender by refraining from labeling the Now.”
“Let me give you a visual analogy to illustrate the point I am making. You are walking along a path at night, surrounded by a thick fog. But you have a powerful flashlight that cuts through the fog and creates a narrow, clear space in front of you. The fog is your life situation, which includes past and future; the flashlight is your conscious presence; the clear space is the Now.”
So your job is to just think/act/be in that clear space (of the above example). That's it.
If your friend calls you to meet or if you feel like going to your favorite game of weekly soccer but do not have the motivation to do so, then just take one moment at a time. Say to yourself “I will just enjoy one moment at a time. I do not need to worry about the whole end result”. Stop seeing things as a means to an end. Just focus on reaching to your car keys, then enjoy the drive to the place where you see the soccer, then just focus on saying hello to someone at that place, then bring your attention back to watching the match, enjoy your drive back to home. One thing at a time, giving up all expectations and end results. Use the same thing in your job situation and watch things changing for the good.
Keep practicing these concepts and of course the Love Code and do share your progress in life.
VJJanuary 12, 2017 at 6:56 pm #125132
I was referred to a psychiatrist by an acquaintance in 2011. I had started work in mid 2010 and I was bustling with energy and extremely motivated. However, during the first quarter of 2011, I started to have doubts over my capability and started feeding negative thoughts to myself. Over time, I spoke less to my colleagues | I kept my thoughts to myself | I ate alone | I went home after work and laid down to watch TV or sleep without having my meals or washing up until the next morning | I stopped exercising | I put on weight. Finally, the last straw came when I had to organize an event. I was so preoccupied with and overwhelmed by my thoughts of screwing up, how people will not cooperate or turn up for the event – I procrastinated …… and procrastinated …… to a point whereby I could no longer take it anymore- I decided not to turn up for work without informing anyone and I was uncontactable for more than one week. Eventually I decided to return home, after reading some messages from my loved ones.
At that time, my family thought it was crucial that I received help and also probably as a means to provide a reason for my disappearance – hence I think that was why the referral to the psychiatrist.
The visits were at times helpful, at times I was there to request for medical leave because I still suffer from breakdowns every now and then. After 2014, I have decided to stop seeing him because his charges are too high for me to afford now, given my reduced monthly income, and probably my mindset was not right. Even as I am saying this, I am tempted to revisit him for a consultation so that I can get a medical certificate and be excused from an unpleasant activity.
I have not fully recovered, or perhaps I should say that I probably have not learnt much from these episodes, since my mood is like a cycle of emotional highs and lows and my go-to safe place is to escape whenever it's an unpleasant and uncomfortable situation. I don't think I should continue living like this. I figure now will be a good time to start helping myself again, since I am given some space to sort myself out and I wonder what my next step should be.
I daydream about doing a life plan, about being motivated to start each day knowing what I was going to do but there is a very strong internal resistance. I question the effectiveness of a life plan – I question the effectiveness of exercise – I question if thinking positively will help me lead a better life. I am very skeptical.
I want to break out of this cycle – and then as I start to brace myself, I noticed that there are certain events in my life which I would still like to “escape from” – social activities etc but I have no choice but to go through them and then I start getting unhappy all over again. My life seems to be in a mess and I have no idea where to start.
Maybe like what @VJ said, death will not solve anything. My vicious cycle will repeat itself with me in another body until I face up to my issues. Another problem I have is being very stubborn as well – For example, my wife will suggest that I at least take a small step to greet my colleagues in the morning but I find it very tough and weird after I have gotten used to keeping quiet. Maybe they are also used to me being like that.
I think how we can move on is perhaps to revisit my relationship with my parents and/or my siblings? As I'm typing, some memories came back in bits and pieces. And I think I have to continually remind myself that I need to help myself.
Sorry if my thoughts are jumbled up.
DanielJanuary 12, 2017 at 7:52 pm #125135
I was diagnosed at one point with Major Depression. I do know I was depressed since childhood. These are my suggestions:
1. Have no expectations for yourself. Afraid you don't meet other people's expectations of you? Accept that you don't and stop being afraid of what already happened: you failed their expectations, and so, let it be. Be gentle with yourself, you are not well and so, no expectations. Have room to breathe relief.
2. Set the smallest goals for yourself: get out of bed is one such goal. Congratulate yourself if you made it; if you didn't- go to number one.
3. If you achieve a small goal, set a second small goal. if you made it, congratulate yourself; if you didn't, go to number # 1.
4. Revisit those Formative Years, aka our childhoods. You wrote above: “some memories came back in bits and pieces”- best do that in competent psychotherapy (sliding scale, low fee, no fee?); a support group (in the U.S. Depression Anonymous is such group meeting in person. You can also share your memories here. Unfortunately we don't “grow out of” serious childhood injuries. The past never disappears unless we examine it and take on the Healing Path, as I call it.
anitaJanuary 12, 2017 at 9:04 pm #125140
Hi Nina Sakura,
Can you see though how your fear of facing possible failure is setting you up for failure anyway? which in turn reinforces your negative core belief about yourself?
My fear of failure, combined with my choice/decision/inclination not to participate in unpleasant/undesirable tasks/projects, and also a belief that “if doing this is not going to guarantee me a 100% success rate, why do it at all?” is creating a strong inertia internally. The cycle of me giving up before the battle is fought or consistently crumbling under pressure has indeed reinforced my negative self belief and contributing to reducing levels of confidence.
I remember two statements that my father made vividly when I was young:
1. “I cannot believe that he is the top student in his school!” When I was 12 years old
2. “I cannot believe that he can be a leader in the army!” When I was 19 years old
I cannot be sure if he really meant it, or he was just using another way of expressing that he is very proud of me. But, I always get a sense that he is more proud of my sibling's achievements than myself, which sometimes makes me jealous. But I don't remember telling my dad about the effect his words had on me. Perhaps because of fear of getting scolded and also the age gap, other than being the typical young playful kid, I don't remember being very outspoken in my family – more of an observer or spectator.
Regarding what is required of my work situation, thank you for putting a list together. Based on your list given,
a) Basic concepts (Profit = Revenue – Expenditure) Strong
b) A knack for seeing patterns Average
c) Analysis, strategies, ability to connect dots weak
d) People skills – (i) Colleagues (ii) Superiors (iii) clients weak
e) Initiative, working individually average
f) Out of box thinking very weak
January 12, 2017 at 10:13 pm #125145
- This reply was modified 9 months, 2 weeks ago by daniel.
Thank you for your response. Will need some time to go through your links! Will keep you posted of any updates or questions that I may have!
I like the part about enjoying each moment without seeing things as a means to an end!
DanielJanuary 13, 2017 at 5:14 am #125158
I believe you should be recovering well since your last diagnosis. And like many others before me, I appreciate your time and effort in conversing with me.
For now, I would prefer to share my memories here because I'm currently unable to afford the cost of psychotherapy.
Where should I begin with my revisitation of my memories? Will it be better if you asked me questions and there's a back and forth?
With regards to suggestion:
1) There is a company gathering next week, and I will meet my superior whom I have been avoiding g for the longest time, because I feel very pressured by him. I imagine the awkwardness and embarrassment I would feel on that day and it stresses me out and how I wish that I could be excused but too bad I can't. Any suggestion how I could cope with this?
2/3)I wonder if I should be more focused on my goal setting – like targeted at my fears for example? Otherwise, my goals could be another Avenue for me to avoid my issues.
4) I will consider your suggestion of joining a support group in my country.
DanielJanuary 13, 2017 at 5:33 am #125161
Your soul will take another body and the same patterns that you are going through now will be repeated again…..
I agree with this statement. By choosing to avoid my problem, it may provide short term relief but some point in the future, it will come back to haunt me when a similar scenario arises.
For example, how long can I stay hidden and avoid the people or situations that are unpleasant or undesirable? I really dread the upcoming company gathering but since I have to go, I will attempt to put your advice about enjoying each moment into practice.
In fact you are not even getting that ‘will’ to do anything.
In brief, my avoidance from doing undesirable/challenging tasks at work have transferred into other parts of my life, and all I want to do all the time is watch TV. Recently, I have started exercising with my wife. Though it hasn't really solved my work issues, I feel fitter and it gives me a bit more confidence. Will continue to exercise.
As to your suggestion to live in day tight compartments, I will think about it over the weekend and work out a plan for next week. And see what happens.
DanielJanuary 13, 2017 at 5:53 am #125164
Yes please practice being in and enjoying the present moment as best you can and by giving up all expectations and end results.
I do have something to suggest to you on your upcoming gathering but can you elaborate what are you dreading about it?
VJJanuary 13, 2017 at 6:37 am #125165
I dread seeing my boss, the one I have been trying very hard to avoid. He is a partner of the company but he has another day job outside of the company so I don't see him in the office, only occasionally. I did not perform up to his expectations so I feel awkward.
I also dread that I have to stay for the BBQ in the evening, which means I have to mingle and interact with people – I have been avoiding social activities for a very long time – at least half a year – only hang out when my wife's family comes over for family meals. Even then I'm pretty quiet and seldom talk.
– DanielJanuary 13, 2017 at 8:58 am #125177
I think it is not productive for you to communicate simultaneously with three individual respondents who may hold different beliefs and ways of thinking (it is confusing to me…), so I will withdraw from your thread at this point. If in the future you extract all the help you can from your other correspondences, and if you would still like more of my input, post a note addressed to me and I will respond.
anitaJanuary 13, 2017 at 8:47 pm #125213
Do this everyday till the day you have your company gathering (of course you can mentally do it during the gathering too).
Start doing it mentally (or loudly in a locked room) at your home towards your boss or anybody else who you may think you are uncomfortable with.
Do it a couple of times and see how you feel.
VJJanuary 16, 2017 at 2:42 am #125380
Hi VJ, thank you for your sharing!
Hi @anita, if you are still keen, I would still like to continue our conversation and pick up where we left off.January 16, 2017 at 11:19 am #125432
I spent some time reading the great majority of your posts on this thread. These are my thoughts currently:
You are or were motivated at times, these are the emotional highs, like when you were motivated to get that console. These are the “highs”.
Most often you are afraid to get scolded. You were scolded by your parents, and that is was when and where this fear was established. For a long time, there is a voice in your head scolding you. This voice is your internal representation of your parents. This voice continues the scolding.
So you live with little hope for reward (starting with the non-actualized console promise), and lots and lots of internal scolding. Living in such a mental state would not motivate ANYONE. It is no wonder you are not motivated.
Unlike what the person told you, that you are not willing to do the hard work- I believe that it is not that you are not a hard worker, or lazy- I believe that when difficulty arises, your internal voice, this inner-scolder, I will call it, raises its voice and is giving you a hard time, saying something like: “You can't do it right! You are not capable! You are…
So, you escape, so you procrastinate, trying to not get into trouble. Only you are already in trouble, because what you are afraid another person will tell you (that you are not capable, etc.), you are already telling yourself.
What do you think so far? Will take it from there (from your response).