Hi Alessa!

Good to hear from you, hope all is well. 🩷

The situation certainly is unpleasant and has made me very, very anxious the last two months.

The argument unfortunately was quite bad, especially in my husband’s eyes who grew up in a safe and non violent home. When my dad verbally abused him and started to physically approach him that’s when matters got worse. Prior to that it was just loud disagreement.

My husband could have disengaged and he realizes that but because my dad crossed a bigger line and continued to stonewall him, I’m not sure how I can expect my husband to make the first move.

After the incident, my baby girl was more a few weeks later and I wish in that moment my dad chose to just congratulate my husband on being a dad and focus on the baby. However, he chose silence in the hospital too which emotionally hurt my husband even more.

Since then, we’ve had to live here for another 56 days. 56 days of them avoiding each other which because of our house size and their work schedules hasn’t been hard.

My biggest challenge now will be to see how future gatherings will be given this tension. The next one is coming soon, a gathering to celebrate my baby girl..hopefully everyone can coexist and it goes well.

Nea

Hi Anita,

Thank you for sharing that with me. I’m really sorry you had to carry those words from your mother for so many years. Even when we understand something intellectually, I think actually feeling the hurt attached to it can be completely different. What you said about realizing it hurt because you weren’t a “big zero” really stayed with me.

I think for me it has always been a bit of a toxic cycle. When my dad has said really hurtful things to me, including calling me those names, there has usually been anger in the moment, but then shortly afterwards he apologizes, things settle down, and life carries on. And then there are all the other things mixed into it — the financial support, gifts, the house, everything he has done for us — and it can create this feeling that I should just let things go and move on. And honestly, that is usually what I have done.

Today feels especially awkward and heavy because it’s my dad’s birthday and we are all still living under the same roof. Last year everything was so different. We went out, celebrated, had dinner, and it was normal. This year my husband doesn’t even want to wish him happy birthday.

Part of me thinks, it’s just saying “happy birthday,” and maybe doing that would stop the situation from feeling even bigger within the family. But another part of me doesn’t know if it is fair for me to ask my husband to do that when my dad still hasn’t apologized or made any effort with him either. They have now lived in the same house for about six weeks without speaking to each other at all, which is honestly such a strange situation to be living inside of.

So yes, what you wrote about separating the memory from the emotion does resonate with me. I think there are probably things I have learned to minimize or move past very quickly because that was easier than sitting with what actually happened and what it meant.

It’s something I’m still trying to understand.

Nea

Hi Alessa!

Hope you’re doing well. 🩷

I’m so sorry — I didn’t even get a chance to respond to your other reply, but I really did appreciate it. I always appreciate the way you share your own experiences and give me another perspective on things.

To answer your question, my family home is actually really close to where we’re moving — only about 15 minutes away. So my family can still come to our place and help with the baby if I need them, and I can still come here too. My husband has never told me I can’t see my family or that they can’t help me. He’s actually been very clear that whoever I need around me is completely my decision. He’s even agreed to still come here with me sometimes, so he isn’t trying to put a stop to any relationship.

I think the issue was more that it started to feel like people expected him to apologize, say hello first, or make the first effort simply because of the cultural expectation around respecting elders.

And unfortunately, that cultural part is very real. I’ve never really been able to openly tell my dad when I think he’s wrong because I know how badly he can react. Even with this situation, especially while we’ve been living under the same roof, I genuinely didn’t think confronting him directly was a good idea because I knew there was a strong possibility it would just blow everything up again.

So no, I haven’t directly told my dad, “You were wrong and you owe him an apology.” But I have absolutely stayed beside my husband through this, and I think my family can see that through my actions and through the distance I’ve kept with my dad. To be honest, some of that distance was already there before this happened anyway, which is part of why the whole situation is complicated.

And to answer your earlier question about what actually happened, I would describe it more as a fight than a normal argument. My dad started becoming verbally aggressive toward my husband, my husband became increasingly angry in response, and eventually my dad advanced toward him. My husband stepped toward him too, and thankfully the rest of us got between them before anything physical happened.

The frustrating part is that what started it was honestly something so minor. My husband was trying to say/do something and my dad interpreted it completely differently and escalated it from there.

I can acknowledge that my husband could have disengaged earlier and de-escalated instead of continuing once my dad became aggressive. He knows that too. But at the same time, the initial verbal aggression and escalation did come from my dad, and I don’t think it’s fair to erase that and then expect my husband to be the one who apologizes or makes the first move simply because my dad is the elder. That’s really where I’ve been struggling with all of this.

Nea

Hi Alessa , thank you so much for your earlier response. Hope all is going well for you🩷

It was really thoughtful, and I really appreciated you offering to let me email you if I ever wanted to talk through things in more detail. That honestly means a lot, and I’ll definitely keep it in mind.

And thank you as well for sharing that you’ve gone through something somewhat similar within your own family. Even hearing that much helps me feel a little less alone in trying to navigate all of this.

With my husband and my dad, the actual topic that started the argument was honestly very small. I think there were probably other things brewing underneath it. My dad felt my husband had said something he didn’t like, which was actually more in relation to me, and then told him essentially, “When I tell you to stop talking, you stop talking.” My husband responded that he wasn’t going to stop talking just because he was told to, and from there everything escalated.

My dad became verbally abusive and came toward him, and then once that happened my husband also came toward him. So it became a very messy, heated situation, which is part of why I’ve struggled so much with sorting out what happened afterward.

I don’t actually think they were equally at fault. I do think my dad carries more responsibility for how far it went. I think some of my confusion has come from hearing different people around me say that they both need to be held equally accountable, when to me there is still a difference between the two.

And I do think culture plays a role in all of this too. In my family, we’ve never really been the kind of people who openly sit down and talk through difficult things, which I know isn’t ideal. Things have usually just been swept under the rug and everyone eventually carries on.

That’s why I honestly don’t know what happens from here. I don’t really see there being a big open conversation unless something changes. It feels like either everyone eventually just acts normal again without ever addressing it, or the distance and ignoring each other becomes the new normal.

I also think I’ve been so emotionally tied to, and maybe even trauma-bonded in some ways with, my maternal family for so long that coming to terms with things and accepting that the dynamic may have to change is probably going to take me some time.

For now though, I really am trying to focus on my little baby and enjoy this time as much as I can — all the cuddles and these tiny newborn moments that go so quickly. I’m trying to count my blessings and not let everything else take away from what is also such a special time in my life.

Nea

Dear Anita,

Looking forward to reading more from you so I can respond fully\. I just wanted to add some context about the initial incident, as it keeps being framed as though my dad and husband were equally at fault\.

The initial topic was very small, but my dad was clearly carrying built\-up anger, which quickly came through in the way he reacted\. He initiated the verbal abuse and was visibly angry and aggressive\. My husband did not de\-escalate and responded with, “Are you going to hit me?” and “Come hit me then\.” They both moved toward each other, and we stepped in before anything became physical\.

Because my husband didn’t back down, the expectation is now that he should apologize or at least say “hi” because my dad is older\. I don’t fully agree with that framing\. I can acknowledge that my husband escalated the situation, but my dad initiated it, and this kind of behaviour from him is not new\.

Just wanted to add that context\.

Nea

Good morning Anita!

I do understand what you’re saying, especially about how the pressure can end up being placed on the person who is actually capable of being flexible, rather than on the person who is unlikely to change. I think that is part of what has been happening here.

With the “hi” specifically, though, I don’t think my husband is necessarily afraid that my dad won’t respond or that it will start some process of submission. Earlier on, he actually seemed a little more open to simply saying hi and leaving it at that. But as time has gone on, he has become more rigid about it. Now he says, “He can say hi to me first. I’m not going to say hi first.”

His bigger issue is that he feels that if we are ever going to genuinely move past this, there eventually needs to be some kind of conversation about what happened. He has said to me that yes, I was saying things during the argument and yes, he could have disengaged sooner, but that still didn’t make it okay for my dad to verbally abuse him and come charging toward him the way he did. He doesn’t want to behave as though that was acceptable or just sweep everything under the rug.

There are also little things from over the years that he has started thinking about differently now — comments here and there, and things he later found out had been said about him to other family members. So I think this incident has made him reassess some things beyond just that one argument.

Where my anxiety comes in is what this means practically for our family going forward. Right now we live here, but once we move out, my parents’ view is basically that if we are coming to visit their home, my husband should at least be able to say hello to my dad. And culturally, because my dad is older, there is also this expectation that saying hello is such a basic sign of respect that it shouldn’t diminish anyone.

And intellectually I know the obvious response to that is that the same standard should apply to my dad — he can also say hello. I agree. The problem is that I also know he probably won’t. And that is where I feel stuck. If neither one of them will say anything first, what does coming over as a family even look like? Can we ever have a relatively normal visit?

So I don’t think I’m anxious because I need to keep pressuring my husband into submission. I think I’m anxious because I’m looking ahead and trying to understand how any kind of neutral family space can exist if both of them stay completely rigid. At the same time, I can see what you’re pointing out: because I know my dad is so difficult to move, I keep looking toward my husband for the tiny bit of flexibility that might make things easier. And perhaps that itself is part of the pattern I need to become more aware of.

I’m still processing what you said about their relationship before all of this. I’m not sure I can fully conclude that it was performative on my dad’s side, because there were things that did seem genuine to me, but I can understand why, knowing everything else I’ve described about him, you would question how much of that closeness was actually based on mutual connection versus the role my dad liked occupying.

Nea

Hi Alessa,

Thank you so much for sharing that, and for your kind words. It really is such a tough situation.

I was genuinely heartbroken when my husband said that. I’ve tried to understand that it came from exhaustion with the topic, along with all the other stress we’ve both been under lately, but at the same time, it just wasn’t something I needed to hear — especially right now. He did acknowledge that and apologize, but he also asked me to give the topic some breathing space, which I honestly find really hard to do when I’m still living here and my anxiety keeps bringing me back to it.

I’m also really sorry to hear that you’ve experienced something similar in your own family. You absolutely don’t have to share anything you’re not comfortable with, but I’d be curious to know what helped you cope with it. When it’s your own family on one side and your husband on the other, it can feel like such an impossible position to be in.

I think that’s what I’m struggling with most — how do you step outside of all the emotion, look at the situation as neutrally as possible, and know what the right call actually is?

Nea