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I’m addicted to nostalgic feelings and it only makes me feel worse, I guess.

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  • This topic has 249 replies, 7 voices, and was last updated 1 month ago by anita.
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  • #405079
    miyoid
    Participant

    Hey Anita, I hope you’re having a great week.

    I sometimes see a dream where I have two relationships at the same time. I get nervous about that and I freak out. I just realized that I saw lots of dreams about that in the past months. I also saw another dream last night where I was coming across with a girl I knew online, kind of a persona, she is like a life coach or something. She sometimes shares texts about lots of people asking for help with long texts, without asking first and she hates that. I don’t even know her, but I saw her in my dream. I was preparing a letter for her, like the ones I write to you, diligently trying to express what happened and how I feel. After I get where she is, to give the letter, I realize that my letter started to melt. My letter was on an ice, in a small container. I see the water and remnants of my melted letter and I feel bad about it. Now I have to write all of that all over again, let alone putting my thoughts in an order. So much work! After a while, I realize that it was the right thing to happen, since it was rude for me to put all of my stuff there for that person to help me. How selfish was that? I was scared of that girl’s boundaries and I was grateful that my letter was melted. I don’t see my own boundaries here in this dream. All these years, I saw others’ boundaries and I acted accordingly. This doesn’t sound fair.

    Sometimes I see quotes on “being scared is the worst thing you can do, it’ll happen” and so on. I think of double-slit experiment and I worry that the stuff I’m afraid can happen if I don’t put my thoughts in order. You probably know the experiment, but it shows that if a detector observes the photons, they behave differently compared to when no observer is present. It creates an idea that the possibilities of a situation is endless, but when the observer is present, a possibility manifests. If the observer wouldn’t be there, no possibility would manifest. I guess this experiment paves the way for the ones that think their thoughts actually shape the reality. This sounds like a strong distortion to a scientific theory. I’m not religious at all, but I am not familiar with safety enough to be able to be free from those superstitious thoughts. I am not a person with strong opinions, I can reject this idea at a dinner table and then doubt myself the next day. I wonder what strong or not strong opinions you might have on this…

    #405080
    miyoid
    Participant

    Just checked some of the old topics I’ve started and I found your reply from June 7, 2019.

    Your future partner will have his own problems to work on. The two of you will help each other learn, identify problems, experiment with different solutions and always treat each other with respect.

    Made me smile, I didn’t realize I posted here so much since.

    #405084
    anita
    Participant

    Der miyoid:

    I will be able to read and reply to you in about 9 hours from now.

    anita

    #405087
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    I think of double-slit experiment and I worry that the stuff I’m afraid can happen if I don’t put my thoughts in order“- if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it (that is, no one is there to observe it), does it make a sound? Depends on how sound is defined:  if it is defined as a mechanical wave of pressure originating at the location of the fall, and moving through the air away from the location, then yes, it makes a sound.

    If you define sound as the reception of a mechanical wave of pressure(ex., by an ear), then no, it does not make a sound.

    I worry that the stuff I’m afraid can happen if I don’t put my thoughts in order … (that) thoughts actually shape reality. This sounds like a strong distortion to a scientific theory… I wonder what strong or not strong opinions you might have on this“-

    – unlike the analogy of the falling tree, the only possibility for your thoughts to make a sound/ to shape reality is if there is a reception to your thoughts. The only way for there to be a reception is if you communicate your thoughts to someone else (1) with words, saying or writing/ typing words for someone to hear or read, or (2) with facial expressions and physical acts.

    For example, you can think in regard to a particular person: I hate him! You can even say it out loud, but if you are alone and there is no one to hear your words, then nothing happened. No reality was shaped. If you have this thought when in the company of others, but you don’t communicate it (you don’t say it, you don’t yell, you don’t hit, you don’t look someone in the eye, move your eyebrows close together and expose your teeth… then nothing happened. No reality was shaped.

    Your thoughts are your private domain, your private matter. Organized or not, orderly or messy, nice or not- your thoughts are your business and no one else’s. They are a matter of no consequence unless communicated.

    I was preparing a letter for her, like the ones I write to you, diligently trying to express what happened and how I feel. After I get where she is, to give the letter, I realize that my letter started to melt…After a while, I realize that it was the right thing to happen, since it was rude for me to put all of my stuff there for that person to help me“- what an interesting, fascinating imagery, the melting letter… I don’t want your letters to melt. I want you to keep posting here and to courageously express yourself to people in real-life.

    I found your reply from June 7, 2019… Made me smile, I didn’t realize I posted here so much since“- it made me smile that you looked back to what I posted for you more than three years ago. Thank you for my first smile of the day!

    anita

     

    #405099
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    After submitting the post above yesterday, I realized that there is a lot more to the question you brought up: Do “thoughts shape the reality”?

    1. Superstitions and OCD: you mentioned “superstitious thoughts“. A superstition is an irrational belief (no evidence to back it up) that an object or an activity can shape reality. An example of believing that an object can shape reality is hanging a horseshoe on the door of one’s house so to attract good luck and wealth. An examples of believing that an action can shape reality is crossing fingers so to attract good luck, or scare away bad luck.

    Superstitions are often motivated by fear that in reality, something bad is about to happen. The objects and activities are supposed to protect the person from bad-things-happening aka bad luck (and to make good things happen, aka good luck).

    Problem is that Obsessive Compulsive Disorder (OCD) is about taking superstitions too far. For example, every time a person sees a horseshoe, or imagines it, he or she HAS TO TOUCH IT (or an object that represents it), or touch it in a certain way, or do something with it (ex., turn around 3 times while holding it), otherwise- so it feels- something bad will happen.  As a person who suffered from OCD myself, I remember that when I had a thought of something bad (ex. that my mother will die), I was afraid that the bad thing will happen because I thought it. Therefore, I lived in terror of…my own thoughts.

    Superstitions and OCD obsessions, compulsions and rituals do not shape reality in the ways the sufferer fears (ex., my mother did not die), but the fear driving the OCD shapes the reality of the sufferer and of the people around who are affected by the sufferer’s condition.

    2. Thoughts and Actions: actions (facial and bodily physical expressions, tone and volume of voice, words articulated, physical actions) when done to another person or in the presence of another person communicate things to the other person, and that communication can shape the reality of that other person. Examples: if I hit someone, the person I hit will feel physical pain. If I yell and articulate abusive words to a person, the person will feel emotional pain.

    But thoughts by themselves, when you think them when you are alone, or when you think them but do not communicate them in certain ways to another person-  still have power because overall, our thinking habits do get communicated. For example, if a person is habitually angry, it will show in the person’s face and attitudes, and it will affect some other people’s realities, as well as the angry person’s own reality. Basically, we do affect other people and we do shape reality every day, in some ways.

    Key is to FIT our thinking to reality so that there is a match. The greater the fit between my thinking and reality, the better my mental health and the better I affect other people/ shape their reality and mine. Thing to remember though is that another person with a poor fit (between his/ her thinking  and reality) may perceive me not in the way that I am and therefore be affected not by me, but by his/ her distorted view of me.

    Does any of this helps you in any way, miyoid?

    anita

     

    #405971
    anita
    Participant

    How are you, miyoid?

    anita

    #406236
    miyoid
    Participant

    Hi Anita, I hope you’re great and having a nice day.

    I realized something and I wanted to write it here. I felt a bit bad about something he said this morning, and then I reacted calmly. I said it was rude, and he replied by “it shouldn’t be rude?”, I resisted. The way you’re saying it is rude, maybe you should’ve expressed it in a different way. Then I stopped talking, waited a bit and then prepared myself, my stuff to be ready to go to my house leaving him at his home.

    This was not “old me”. I used to accept that “it shouldn’t be rude.” and ignore my feelings in a way so that the communication would go smooth. I wouldn’t react, reacting to something was never my thing. The only reaction from me I remember was crying or being really sad when the person did something or said something upsetting to me. I thought about what I’ve done in the past, but maybe I was willing to leave him there alone, and go away with my slightly upset mind and wait for him to correct the mistake, even if there was not a mistake. I wanted him to put it together, behave better. He didn’t do anything bad though, but I was feeling a bit neglected.

    I am now realizing that all I did in the past was giving every chance I can to the person in my life to correct their mistakes. I just try harder than them, for them to correct anything. Because I know that everything can be resolved if someone wants enough, and I put so much effort into giving the chances, the time and the understanding. But this have never worked in the past, maybe it has given me more time with the person but in the end, it resolved badly, as you know. I guess as I started to work on myself, I’m learning so much.

    When I was preparing my bag, he saw it. He saw that I was getting prepared to go out, leave him maybe. He also started to put on some clean clothes and asked me if we can go out and have a coffee. He has spent hours and hours with me afterwards and then he left to see his sister. I don’t know if this is right. I am not sure if he felt guilty and did this because of it, or if he really wanted to spend time with me. I guess it’s best if we can just miss each other for a bit so I’ll give him some space.

    As for your wise replies, you’ve replied to my double-slit experiment ideas in such a rational way. I guess I expected a more spiritual approach from you but I don’t have any idea how you think about those stuff at all.

    Key is to FIT our thinking to reality so that there is a match. The greater the fit between my thinking and reality, the better my mental health and the better I affect other people/ shape their reality and mine. Thing to remember though is that another person with a poor fit (between his/ her thinking  and reality) may perceive me not in the way that I am and therefore be affected not by me, but by his/ her distorted view of me.

    Yes, this made it very clear. Although I try to think better than my reality, which I might’ve failed to do so but I’m hoping that it’ll have an effect.

    #406242
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    My Saturday morning is definitely nicer for reading your post!

    I felt a bit bad about something he said this morning, and then I reacted calmly. I said it was rude.. This was not ‘old me’. I used to… ignore my feelings… I wouldn’t react, reacting to something was never my thing. The only reaction from me I remember was crying or being really sad when the person did something or said something upsetting to me“-

    – you were assertive with him (and you did it appropriately: calmly, fairly, respectfully).  This is an amazing testimony of personal transformation: from  passive, weak, emotionally-dependent miyoid,  to =>  assertive, strong, emotionally-independent miyoid!

    The following is true to you and to me, in our separate lives: we are not completely or perfectly strong and emotionally-independent, neither will we ever be (because we are human). But we are way stronger and more emotionally independent than we used to be.

    I am now realizing that all I did in the past was giving every chance I can to the person in my life to correct their mistakes. I just try harder… But this have never worked in the past, maybe it has given me more time with the person but in the end, it resolved badly, as you know“.

    Yes, I know. Regarding the past, back in June 7, 2019 (more than 3 years ago), in your first post, you wrote: “I haven’t got a clue about what I want in life and in a person/relationship and that is exhausting because of my fears about the future“- now, you do have a clue: you want to have a say in what happens in your life and in your relationship;  you want to be an active, reasonably-powerful part in your life and relationship, not a passive and hopeful observant. The stronger you become in your own life, the less exhausted you will be, and the lesser your fears.

    I guess as I started to work on myself, I’m learning so much“- I am smiling right now, reading this. You are indeed learning so much, and I am impressed!

    I am not sure if he felt guilty“- it is the massive, out of proportion and invalid kind of guilt that is a problem. A little bit of guilt is a healthy emotion because it motivates a person to correct a behavior that needs to be corrected.

    I expected a more spiritual approach from you but I don’t have any idea how you think about those stuff at all“- if you want to know how I think about any particular spiritual thing, ask me and I will be glad to answer.

    I try to think better than my reality, which I might’ve failed to do so but I’m hoping that it’ll have an effect“- I didn’t understand this sentence.

    The sun just came out from behind the clouds (11:04 am) and in an hour, I will walk and spend a few hours outdoors. It is 9:04 pm your time. I hope you have a restful night, and again, a pleasure to read and communicate with you!

    anita

    #406407
    miyoid
    Participant

    I can see clearly now, maybe because I am older, I cannot ignore most of the things I used to ignore in the past. However, I guess I should be able to sit with the not-comfy feeling and just be alone, observe, go on with my life. I think I try to run from that feeling, when I am not fully safe, in terms of emotions, I always try to run from it with either psychological readings, or spiritual stuff to make me feel better, hope for the better. I don’t like to sit and be pessimistic about anything, it just doesn’t make me feel any good, why do that? Therefore, I don’t sit with the bad feeling and I try to make it better by either manipulating my mind or trying to make the situation better.

    And yes, regarding what I want, I always wanted to be happy and accepted, understood like everyone else. I do have a clue about what I want, but when a slight problem occurs like my partner being in a weird mood and behaving a bit differently to me, I start to feel unsafe and that affects me a lot. My motivation towards life just start to vanish. When I’m not able to feel safe with the love I have (Not sure about the expression but I’m hoping you’ll get me), I lose interest in the hobbies I like, I never want to read anything, do anything productive. I just go on with my life with the lowest effort and hope for better. It’s like my hobbies, my job, anything I like, all the things mentioned are not as important as being safe with the partner I have.

    Having fixed stuff helps a little I guess, that’s something I’ve experienced in the past year. I’ve always did yoga after my breakup last year even though I felt suffocated, even though I cried during. Having at least one stable thing in your life helps, so I started yoga again, the streak is now over 30 days, and I’ll continue no matter what. I need that in my life, one thing I can count on.

    I am telling here that I don’t like pessimism but I guess I am acting a bit pessimistic. It’s just when I am not safe with my feelings, I hardly see anything to be grateful about in life, that seems like the problem here. I have other stuff I’m working on to be grateful about.

    You want to have a say in what happens in your life and in your relationship;  you want to be an active, reasonably-powerful part in your life and relationship, not a passive and hopeful observant. The stronger you become in your own life, the less exhausted you will be, and the lesser your fears.

    Definitely, I should read these words often.

    As for the spiritual thing question, I don’t know if I mentioned before but I wasn’t brought up with a religion. My parents were not religious and they have never thought me anything about it besides the need to respect others about it. So in my teen years, I considered myself as agnostic and never was interested in religions, and I was even thinking it was lame. Maybe it’s lame to follow something you are thought without questioning it, yes. But even though it did seem lame, I needed something in my life that would fill up that space. Maybe that’s another reason I have this obsession on being safe. I was not safe as other kids because I never believed in anything that would protect me. But as I grew up, I realized that I needed something but nothing persuaded me. I tried to talk with some people that are strongly religious, but when I listened to the so-called miracles they heard and saw as the reason to believe in their god, it was never enough for me.

    The only thing I could see a little bit more persuading is the effects of meditation, and then again, I guess these can be explained in science as well. So I try to do my yoga and expect to be more stable, healthy and maybe have a slight effect on my “spiritualism” as people refer, so that I can be more happy. It’s like helping others at this point, or it’s like buying a bracelet to have more luck. So this is what I try to fill up this void. Doesn’t feel enough, but maybe since this is not enough, I put great importance to my emotional state and when that shatters, I am lost in that void without any will to live.

    #406419
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    I have this obsession on being safe. I was not safe as other kids because I never believed in anything that would protect me“- this is the sentence that stood up the most as I read your recent post. It brought me an image of a 1- 2 year old miyoid walking unsteadily, not yet mastered walking very well, dragging a safety blanket behind her (also called a security blanket that toddlers carry with them for comfort).

    I try to think better than my reality…  I try to run from that feeling (of being) not fully safe“- another image comes to mind and this one is about me, maybe 5 years old, maybe a bit older. I was home, a tiny apartment, there was a fight between my mother and father, loud voices. It was night time. My mother cried and yelled with a voice that sounded so very out of control: I am going to kill myself!  And then, she left the tiny apartment.

    In my brain, it all meant DISASTER. I cried and yelled for my mother. My father tried to silence me with a belt. Next, I remember being alone in the apartment and believing that my mother is out there in the night, dead. So I gathered courage and walked outside the apartment, alone, and down the stairs- imagining that I was an actress in a movie, being filmed. My fear was replaced for a while with a kind of wander and magic about being in a movie.

    Down the stairs, I walked through the path leading to the street; I looked to my right and to my left with every step, or every few steps, looking for my mother’s dead body. I finally arrived at the street, there were people there, standing in the night, talking, my mother was one of them. (I imagine all the screaming caused neighbors to come out to the street). When I saw my mother alive, I was overjoyed. It was the happiest moment in my life: MOTHER! I screamed in delight and immense relief, YOU ARE ALIVE!!! I ran to her, ran to her, ran to her to take me in her arms.

    But she didn’t. Instead, she was angry at me, her face was angry, disapproving, and so was her voice and her words…what is wrong with you, anita, why are you not at home?

    She didn’t take me into her arms, didn’t hush me, didn’t calm that fear. In her harshness and coldness, the fear was cemented into my childhood separation anxiety disorder. Of course, I didn’t know the term as a child (and it is a made up term, one that belonged in a book, not in a 5 year-old’s mind). For years after that night, I prayed to this and that star in the night’s sky: please keep my mother alive!? Please… I developed OCD (didn’t know this term either) and performed all kinds of compulsions and rituals to keep her alive. I spent my childhood and adolescence at home, afraid that she will die in my absence. That fear infected my muscles, so to speak, with motor and vocal tics (and again, I didn’t know the terms tics, the words motor or vocal).

    I try to run from that feeling (of being) not fully safe“- no wonder you try to run from that feeling, that fear. When I feel it, it feels like an eruption inside of me, something that’s about to erupt and destroy everything.  The fear in me still is not fear of a real-and-present danger such as climate change, it is the same fear it always was: GOD PLEASE DON’T LET MY MOTHER DIE!

    This fear, a childhood fear of separation from the primary care taker (aka childhood separation anxiety disorder) took over my life. You are in your early 20s. I don’t want this fear to take over the rest of your life, like it has taken over mine.

    ” I guess I should be able to sit with the not-comfy feeling and just be alone, observe, go on with my life. I think I try to run from that feeling“- I think that dealing with this fear includes both things: sit with the fear and run away from it… sit with it and distract from it, a little of sitting with it, a lot of staying away from it. Eventually, the fear is not as strong as it was, eventually the storms are not as strong.

    I do have a clue about what I want, but when a slight problem occurs like my partner being in a weird mood and behaving a bit differently to me, I start to feel unsafe and that affects me a lot“- this is the fear/ storm in the inside you being strong, a lot,  following a small provocation.

    I start to feel unsafe and that affects me a lot. My motivation towards life just start to vanish… I lose interest in the hobbies I like, I never want to read anything, do anything productive. I just go on with my life with the lowest effort and hope for better…. all the things mentioned are not as important as being safe with the partner“- the child that I was that night, believing that my mother was dead outside in the darkness of night… that child was not in the mood to stay in the apartment and play with toys. All she cared about, all her motivation was focused on finding her mother alive.

    Having at least one stable thing in your life helps… one thing I can count on“- makes me think again of the safety blanket a toddler carries around. The blanket is the toddler’s one stable thing, one thing to count on.

    I guess I am acting a bit pessimistic. It’s just when I am not safe with my feelings, I hardly see anything to be grateful about in life, that seems like the problem here. I have other stuff I’m working on to be grateful about“- the lesser fear (fear of separation), the more optimistic, motivated and grateful you can be.

    I wasn’t brought up with a religion. My parents were not religious…  I never believed in anything that would protect me… I tried to talk with some people that are strongly religious, but when I listened to the so-called miracles they heard and saw as the reason to believe in their god, it was never enough for me“- yes, you mentioned not being religious. I tried to be religious myself and it was never enough for me either because I never forgot how often I prayed to god by looking at the night sky and picking a star, and god did not help me. I prayed for what seemed like eternity, year after year of living with a suicidal mother… and no help.

    In my mind’s ear, I hear someone (not anyone in particular) say: but god kept your mother alive. My answer to no one in particular: it would have been better if she died like she said she would- that way I would have no longer lived in fear of the anticipation of her death.

    The only thing I could see a little bit more persuading is the effects of meditation, and then again, I guess these can be explained in science as well. So I try to do my yoga“- like you, I rely on science rather than religion. I start each day with some yoga stretches, particularly chest opener stretches. The chest opener stretches make me feel courageous, more able to face fear than before.

    I put great importance to my emotional state and when that shatters, I am lost in that void without any will to live“- in between running away/ distracting yourself from fear, sit with it for a moment here, a moment there. Face your original fear, the one cemented in childhood, and break it bit by bit by bit. Watch it crumble, hear it crumble, feel it crumble.

    anita

    #406913
    miyoid
    Participant

    I cried reading this, and I couldn’t write an answer afterwards. I guess I wasn’t in the right state to say anything. Thank you for telling me about this, and I don’t know what to feel about it. I feel sad, maybe I am trying to be empathetic towards you even though I know this is much more powerful and hard comparing what I’ve been through. I was never scared of my mom killing herself or anything, she was in depression when I was 1-2 years old but afterwards she got better. She started to ignore the stuff that hurt her till she can get rid of those stuff. You praying all the time is so cruel to a kid coming from the world. I know there are lots of cruel stuff happening to kids. But I feel a bit weird. I started to feel resentment towards the situations, the people that made us feel that way in such an early age. For instance I feel a bit of an anger towards my dad for using me for his own needs, he used to tell me about his miserable loneliness just to make me go whine to my mom. He was using me to reach out to my mom, and maybe make her feel bad again hoping that she would accept him back. She resisted, thank god. But I was in the middle, getting emotional all the time thinking that my dad is in a bad condition. He was alone, he was sad.

    He was not an easy person to be around, and he was strict. So I didn’t like staying with him, only me and him. It’s harder when you’re the only person around that one hard person. Maybe it was easier in the past with my mom or sister being around. But alone, not being able to communicate properly, and actually I had to think of what I’ll ask over and over again. I used to ask him about the computer years ago. I used to want to play it, but I cannot open it myself like I did at my mom’s place. I had to ask for permission, but I used to rehearse what I’ll say in my head, only after that I could ask. I didn’t feel anger towards him much in the past, I always felt sorry for him cause he created that feeling inside of my head. But I do feel it now, he is still like that. Maybe after he saw that he couldn’t get into my mom’s head, with all the guilt because of the past, he started to get sick after the divorce. Months of medicine, different diagnosis trials and then he was diagnosed with cancer. Then he managed to make everybody feel sorry for him again. It took years for him to get better, and now whenever he feels the need, he just gets a bit sick again. Sometimes it’s his waist hernia comes up, and as mom says hernia always prevented him to do heavy stuff. Mom always did the heavy stuff around the house. This seems pathetic to me, but I feel resentment, anger. And whenever he makes me feel bad on the phone, for having pain or being alone just for one day because stepmom visits her family, he annoys me and upsets me at the same time. I feel bad for him, but I just don’t buy it and I get angry. I don’t reflect the anger though, I just hold it in and try to ignore my dad’s attention seeking words or voices.

    #406916
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    I cried reading this… Thank you for telling me about this, and I don’t know what to feel about it. I feel sad, maybe I am trying to be empathetic towards you“- you are welcome. Whatever you feel, and whatever you don’t feel about anything is okay with me. I know that you are a good person no matter how you feel at any moment.

    I know this is much more powerful and hard comparing what I’ve been through“- when I shared with you about my childhood, I did not at all think that my childhood story is harder or more powerful than yours. I can tell how hard a person’s childhood was by how much subjective anxiety and sickness are passed on from one’s childhood into adulthood rather than by the objective details of the childhood.

    I was never scared of my mom killing herself “- but you were scared of something, and I believe that the extent of your fear was comparable to mine. I told you my story because in my mind, although our stories are objectively different, our childhood (and ongoing) anxiety has been similar.

    “I feel a bit of an anger towards my dad for using me for his own needs, he used to tell me about his miserable loneliness just to make me go whine to my mom. He was using me to reach out to my mom, and maybe make her feel bad again hoping that she would accept him back. She resisted, thank god. But I was in the middle, getting emotional all the time thinking that my dad is in a bad condition. He was alone, he was sad“- here in boldface is your experience as a child. What is not in boldface is your later-in-life interpretations of your childhood.

    When a child sees a parent “in a bad condition”, the child fears that the bad condition will get worse and result in … the parent being incapacitated or dying, isn’t it? You went to your mother, scared and whining because you were afraid and you wanted her to fix his bad condition, make him better.

    He was not an easy person to be around, and he was strict. So I didn’t like staying with him, only me and him…  I had to think of what I’ll ask over and over again… I used to rehearse what I’ll say in my head, only after that I could ask“- maybe you were afraid that if you ask him for something, or if you ask him the wrong way, his bad condition will get worse…? Maybe you were afraid to contribute to his bad condition.

    He started to get sick after the divorce. Months of medicine, different diagnosis trials and then he was diagnosed with cancer“- so your fear that his bad condition will get worse came true, didn’t it?

    And now whenever he feels the need, he just gets a bit sick again…  he makes me feel bad on the phone, for having pain or being alone just for one day because stepmom visits her family.. I get angry“- so he keeps your fear ongoing, maintaining your fear, is what I am thinking. You feel anger but underneath the anger is the same old, same old fear that he will die, is it? Maybe you are so used to that fear that you don’t feel it as such….?

    anita

    #406917
    miyoid
    Participant

    maybe you were afraid that if you ask him for something, or if you ask him the wrong way, his bad condition will get worse…? Maybe you were afraid to contribute to his bad condition.

    I was never capable of hurting him, at least that was what I felt. I was afraid for myself, he was not a good communicator and he got angry real fast. He used to use violence on me, my sister and my mother. Actually I am the luckiest among them, my sister and my mom had faced much more violence than me. He got better as the divorce went on, so the physical violence ended there. But the emotional violence has never ended, was always there. His way of living is kind of violent I suppose, he know admits that he has done so many wrong stuff to my sister and my mom. But since I didn’t get that much physical violence after I was 10-11 years old, he doesn’t think that about me. He thinks that he’s done a better job with me. But the thing is I don’t bite him, I don’t fight or argue with him that much. He thinks that I am okay just because I act okay, and he is not aware of the emotional abuse he made us go through. So I wasn’t ever thinking that my question or anything I would say would ever hurt him. I didn’t have that kind of a power. I was just afraid, cause he didn’t have any soft sides I can be free around. He was a good teacher in the school, and he was my teacher at the school for years as well. He was even an amazing teacher to so many people, but that was all he is.

    He was also a teacher at home. I remember my mother feeling sad that we didn’t get the chance to have a fatherly father, a soft, loving person at our house that we could count on. But he was like a stranger, from who I could get a tiny bit of attention when I acted like a good student around the house. I could never cry in front of him, and he was never open about it. Sometimes he tries to get emotional since he is old and maybe he thinks about death these days, I mean in the last 5 years. But I am never gonna be comfortable around him to be able to understand that emotional state. I will just nod and try to seem understanding, but I would never lose myself cause if I do, If I couldn’t hold it in and just burst into tears, I would also speak and I would really hurt him this time. He would face stuff that he would never be strong enough to face. So I just wont, hurting him wouldn’t make me feel. I know that it’s a bit complicated now but simply my dad would use whatever he could find. When he can use his power, he uses violence. He cannot use it now since he is old and it’s wrong to do so in 2022 of course. But in the past, he could do it. When violence is obsolete, or he cannot use it, he shouts, argues. If that doesn’t work, he manipulates or uses your emotions and makes himself the victim. He should be used for a research on narcissism I think, that would be really insightful. I’ve learned a lot trying to get better.

    I don’t remember fearing that he would die, even though he was so close to dying, I felt so strange. There were his former students coming from different cities, crying and crying in front of me like he was their dad. I could never cry like that, he was more of a father to them than he was to me.

    It’s the first time I’ve told so much about my dad here, and I feel like I wrote these words with resentment. But trying to be understanding to him all those years and never putting the blame on him has ended I suppose.

    #406920
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    I was never capable of hurting him…  I was afraid for myself… he got angry real fast. He used to use violence on me…  the emotional violence has never ended, was always there… I wasn’t ever thinking that my question or anything I would say would ever hurt him. I didn’t have that kind of a power“- I thought that you were afraid of hurting him because he often expressed to you how miserable he was, and that was what my mother did too: expressing a lot of misery. I was afraid of hurting her and adding to her misery.

    But in your case, you were not afraid of hurting your father. You didn’t feel capable of hurting him, being that you were a child and he was a big, angry and violent adult.

    In my case, although my mother was big, angry and violent as well, I felt very capable of hurting her: she kept accusing me of hurting her, she used to talk at length about how (she said that) I intended to hurt her feelings, that I said X and did Y for the purpose of hurting her feelings and adding to her misery.

    I assume that your father never accused you of hurting his feelings and adding to his misery (?)

    I would never lose myself cause if I do, If I couldn’t hold it in and just burst into tears, I would also speak and I would really hurt him this time. He would face stuff that he would never be strong enough to face“- so, currently you are afraid of hurting him?

    When he can use his power, he uses violence. He cannot use it now since he is old and it’s wrong to do so in 2022 … When violence is obsolete, or he cannot use it, he shouts, argues. If that doesn’t work, he manipulates or uses your emotions and makes himself the victim“- similar to my mother, only she did 2-3 of these things all at the same time.

    I don’t remember fearing that he would die, even though he was so close to dying, I felt so strange. There were his former students coming from different cities, crying and crying in front of me like he was their dad. I could never cry like that, he was more of a father to them than he was to me“- I imagine that his students thought that you were so lucky to have him as your father, not knowing how he behaved in his own home vs school. Their emotional response to him being close to dying was appropriate to who he was with them, and your emotional response was appropriate to who he was with you.

    Trying to be understanding to him all those years and never putting the blame on him has ended I suppose“- good thing. Better give him the blame that belongs to him because that’s where it belongs. It is like organizing a messy room: if you have a pile of dirty laundry in the middle of the room, better place the pile inside the laundry basket where they belongs. Otherwise, it’s in the way.

    anita

    #406935
    miyoid
    Participant

    Dear Anita, I hope you’re okay and having a great, peaceful time.

    Yes, my father have never accused me of something. He just didn’t treat me right, but I only felt guilty because I wasn’t with him all the time leaving him alone from time to time. I felt responsible because I could choose to be with him, but I wasn’t able to choose it all the time. I was never responsible of his misery, but I felt like I did have the strength to help him by at least being with him more, for his own good. However, whenever I feel sad for him and decide to go, he did something that would upset or harm me. He would either make me cry, or behave badly, or neglect. I remember going to his place just to make him feel better but then when I’m there, he was leaving me alone and going outside to be with some other people. It was weird, I wasn’t the one he wanted I suppose. But I know that if mom did accepted him again, he would do the same to her. His opinion of love was more about “having someone”, “having them as a supply” and when the supply is there, he just continues to be himself. This is the most selfish love I’ve experienced, even more selfish than the partnerships where I was cheated on. Even now, he wants me to take care of him so that he is not alone in the house. When I manage to go there, and stay with him, just after 5 hours he argues, even fights me over something stupid. The aim is to make me feel bad and be there for him, but after the aim is accomplished, I am trash to him.

    I am still not afraid of hurting him, I am afraid of the confrontation because I know it’s so hard and maybe it’s ten times harder for him. I know that I wouldn’t hurt him, there’s no point. I’ll be the one getting upset about it afterwards.

    I imagine that his students thought that you were so lucky to have him as your father, not knowing how he behaved in his own home vs school. Their emotional response to him being close to dying was appropriate to who he was with them, and your emotional response was appropriate to who he was with you.

    Yes, you’ve seen an important point there. I don’t know how you guessed it. Other students thought that I was lucky. Some might even thought that I was privileged. But this was never the case, I know a girl who hates me over just this. Years and years ago, my father had dropped me off to a before-school course, just one time. He never did those sort of things, it was too much work, but I guess there was something different that day. And we’ve came across to that girl there, and he was jealous. I know it now. And after that day, that girl always tried to hurt me over different subjects. Years later I went to uni with that girl’s older sister, and then I saw that the girl is actually much luckier than me. She had a family, a connected one which I don’t. She has an older sister who loves her, supports and takes care of her when she needs it, which I will never have. I even have to protect myself from my own sister, she is toxic and never happy about my successes or friendships, she would enjoy that she’s better if I lose at something even though she is 11 years older than me. No compassion from her whatsoever. She might have grudges towards me since I had a slightly easier childhood, less violence. That girl has a father she can hug with, be emotional around and she can even lay with him hugging, talking about physical contact here.

    Years ago, when father just moved out of the house we were living in, he didn’t have a spare bed for me to stay. So I slept in the same bed, which was the most natural thing I think for a child. When I was sleeping, I just moved my leg towards him and touched him casually, then again, I think a child must be able to touch parents when sleeping, or not. It’s your child, for god sake. Right after that, he just took my leg with his hands and moved back towards myself, away from him. This was the reaction I got. I ignored this then, but never forgot about it. When I look back now, this hurt me as well.

    And that girl was financially stable as well, she was able to spend her father’s money comfortably. I never had this chance, always struggled even when we had the money. He just never liked giving it, so he never did. Not to me, my mom. Seeing that the girl had wrong reasons to hate me, I see how that’s unfair. She was a mean kid, I had my reasons to hate other children but I was never mean like that.

    I feel an emotional transformation. I’ve been questioning some stuff especially about how I behave in the relationship. I realized that when something bad happens, not related to me at all, the other person gets upset. That’s totally normal, but I feel responsible. I feel uncomfortable, I feel like I am the reason for that bad thing somehow. I know that I am not but my mood suddenly changes, and I don’t feel safe anymore. I get even more unsettled than the person going through that little bad thing. After realizing it the other day, I tried to control myself. Even though my partner was upset, not related to me again, I tried to keep myself calm and comfy, as the problem was not mine. A problem about the trash, being tired or something with job upsets him, then he doesn’t smile or says anything good to me. I start to feel like I am not wanted there, I feel like he doesn’t like me anymore. This is the reaction I create in my mind and I believe in it, change my mood according to it. I am so skeptic about the love I receive, If I don’t receive it for 10 hours, I just get lost in my dark thoughts. Not nice.

    The real transformation, however, happened yesterday. I know that people say things like “be nice to the kid inside of you” and so on. I never did that because I am still that kid, I feel like that. I feel vulnerable most of the time. Last night I was with my own friends, and he was with his own friends. After their meeting ended, he wanted to come to my meeting. I’ve sent a location and waited for him, and apparently the location was faulty and he accidentally went into somewhere he shouldn’t around the place, and had a little argument with the security. He was drunk.

    I found him in the street and he was angry at me, about the faulty location I’ve sent. Since I’ve been questioning these days, I just didn’t accept him being angry at me, as we went inside the place I was calmly explaining and asking. “Why did you get angry with me, did I do something wrong? No. Why then?” Asking this 2-3 times sobered him a little and he accepted I was innocent, he was like a little cat owning up, calming down and accepting what I say. He obeyed what I said. It was like I had another “myself” in me who protected that little kid. This has never happened like this before, I thought about this a lot before I slept yesterday. I felt different. Although I was wearing my goldstone earrings and some say it brings confidence, so maybe that was the reason. Or believing that it brings it can make me behave better, why not…

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