Hi Adam,

you’re welcome!

I almost feel like I’m chasing a high and I would go through those lows just for that high again.

Yes, she had an effect on you like a drug – caused you to feel high at times, but was destructive for you on the long run. Staying with her was ruining your life.

You spoke about being down and daydreaming earlier, I spoke to my psych about a similar thing. I almost enjoy that feeling a bit as it is real pain and it not something I always experience. It’s like I force my mind to really feel the emotions and dig deep to bring it all up at times like this

Okay, so are you saying that without her, you would feel flat, you wouldn’t really feel all that much? And so being on a roller-coaster with her, with emotional ups and downs, is still better for you than feeling dull? Being with her allows you to feel deeply?

I was thinking today how the relationship changed overtime and how it got worse after each break up. It’s like I was punished for being comfortable around her and towards the end I wasn’t comfortable but I still didn’t want to loose her at any time during our relationship.

You were punished for being honest with her, for telling her what you think she should change. She didn’t want to be told what she is doing wrong, or how she is hurting you. You were punished for that honesty, for speaking your mind.

People don’t know what they have until they loose it, I think is the quote. I feel like I knew what I had and that I could loose it very easily.

Well, what you had was a girl with untreated mental health issues. She stopped taking medicine and thought she could manage on her own, but she couldn’t. It resulted in those “horrible moods”, as you called it.

As for knowing you could lose her – well yes, you knew you could lose her easily because she was breaking up with you frequently. She used that to control you.

So you had a girl with untreated mental health issues, who basically blamed you for being upset about her moods, and wanted you to stay silent. And she managed.

That’s the reality of your relationship, Adam. If I may be honest with you: you didn’t have much, and you didn’t want to lose the little that you had.

Considering what some of my friends have said do you think it will come to a point where I am just holding onto nothing and talking about it too much?

Well, you do see it in a distorted way, through rose-colored glasses. You believe you had a lot, whereas in reality, you didn’t. You didn’t lose much either, because if you read the above list, there was a lot of abuse in your relationship. You were getting only bread crumbs. But you were sticking to fantasy of how it might be some day, when she is healed.

She wanted to enjoy life without being medicated as she felt it would disconnect her a bit, I think that was her main reason so I was supportive of that. I understood.

But was she enjoying life? As far as I understood, she was as miserable as ever, frequently getting into those moods, accusing you of not being supportive enough. That’s not a good life, but suffering, both for her and for you.

Everyone is telling me she will grow and mature then come to notice how committed and caring you really were. I think this in itself gives me hope and causes wishful thinking.

I think people try to console you and so they say whatever they think might make you feel better. But telling you that she will grow and mature and you then can be happy together is feeding into your fantasy. It’s not helpful at all.

First, it’s not true because we don’t know if she will grow and mature – she might spend many years trying to “heal herself” but not getting anywhere. You don’t want to keep fantasizing about a day when she will finally get better. You don’t want to make your happiness dependent on her – because that’s what you have been doing all this time, and this is the result. You don’t want to put your life on pause, waiting for her to get better.

I told her myself I would do it all over again.

And that’s a problem. That you would be willing to do it again, knowing how hurt you were this time round.

Don’t get me wrong – I do understand you, Adam. I know how emotional wounds can make us blind and can make us work against our best interests. I know how bad we may want something that is bad for us, believing it will make us happy.

But I think you’d need to work on the reasons of this attachment, this sticking to fantasy, rather than accepting reality. You said you felt alive while on an emotional roller coaster with her, so perhaps that’s something to look into? Perhaps sometimes you feel numb and out of touch with your feelings, and being with her allowed you to feel fully?

Hi Adam,

I’ve seen your second post only after I’ve submitted mine.

I am happy to hear that you’re analyzing your relationship from a more rational, objective perspective, without being swept by emotions.

I think I am finding it difficult with attachment because as an individual she definitely had certain things I liked in terms of a partner.

What are the qualities she had that you cherish in a partner?

The other things making it difficult is knowing I actually did try everything. I changed a lot, I wrote letter, poems, supported her, did things she liked, reasoned with her and put lots of effort in. I am also proud of this just knowing how much I can do for someone is a good feeling. It’s also nice knowing that’s how I am as a person.

Great! So you are reframing this experience not as a failure (“I did everything, but nothing helped”), but as a proof of how good and caring partner you are. That’s the right attitude!

Lastly it just feels bad realizing that she didn’t love me the same way I did to her. But that’s okay because I know I will receive the same love one day.

Also a great attitude! You’re realizing it’s not your fault that she didn’t love you enough, but it’s her own limitations.

I remember one time I picked a movie that was about child abuse in a church. She freaked out straight away and asked me if that’s what I’m into and why I would be interested in a movie like that. So she was basically accusing me of being a pedophile or atleast had thoughts of it because I chose a movie based on the topic.

If she was sexually abused, it would have been triggering for her. But accusing you of being a pedophile is definitely an overreaction and not fair.

Anyway I just thought I would post again to get some stuff off my chest. I’m writing down goals in my notes and I have a good list so far!

Fantastic! I am glad you’re looking towards the future. Just keep posting and sharing here, for as long as you need…

Hi Adam,

Yes doing it alone didn’t help her I think. It put more pressure on me as well to always be there. She didn’t have many friends, her best friend ghosted her a lot and ditched plans. I think this again put more weight on me as I was expected to be there for her when a friend wasn’t despite what’s happening in my life.

I see… so you were the only reliable person in her life, and she relied on you for everything. Not just to regulate her moods but also to spend time with her, whenever she was idling or her friend ghosted her or cancelled their plans.

It was a terrible experience but it was also one where I learned valuable lessons. But I can’t actually think of these lessons I learned right now. Could you help me with writing some of these down? I guess one lesson I learned is I think to be firm, honest and stand my ground regardless of how the other person is feeling or being scared of triggering them.

Yes, I think that’s one lesson you’ve learned: to respect your own needs and not to overwrite them just because someone is expecting it from you or guilt tripping you about it.  So, respect your own needs and boundaries.

Second, beware if the person is possessive and expects that everything in your life revolves around them. This also means that you can’t have hobbies and interests of your own, you can’t do what you enjoy, unless you get permission from the other person. So if you can’t maintain a degree of freedom – that’s a warning sign.

Third and perhaps the most important lesson is not to get involved with someone whom you can’t accept as they are, e.g. with someone who is suffering from depression, anxiety, or addiction, which you expect they will heal from, but aren’t there yet. Don’t get involved with someone with major trauma, whom you then try to “rescue” and “help heal”. If you can’t accept your partner as they are and feel they should heal first in order to function normally – don’t get involved with them.

Fourth, if the person is blaming you and doesn’t want to take responsibility for their own moods, behaviors and life situation – that’s toxic. Don’t allow blame and guilt tripping. Be open to feedback though and willing to correct your own mistakes, but if the only thing you get is blame, that’s not healthy.

Fifth, if the person is telling you one thing but doing the opposite, beware of that. If they give you promises, but with their actions they don’t honor those promises, that’s a warning sign too.

These five lessons is what comes to mind so far. What do you think? Is that something you think you’ve learned?

She definitely did seem more laid back in the beginning. Almost like she was expecting more and more as time went on.

You actually said she was smoking pot when you two met, so perhaps that’s one of the reasons she seemed more laid back? But then she stopped smoking, pretty quickly you said, possibly because she had you as her “mood regulator”? And then her traumatized self began to come out more and more, with more and more demands, frequent breakups, trying to control you etc.

I remember her asking about moving in with me I said not at first but she would still be over a lot, about 6 days. She got very upset. However when I moved out she didn’t want to spend more time together it seemed. She would go home and start arguments about how we don’t spend quality time and other things. However I was always open to doing different things which we did early on. As time went on it got stale and I don’t think she was enjoying life in general so she didn’t want to do anything it seemed like at times.

I am not sure I understood this right: are you saying she got upset when you didn’t let her move in with you? Although you were spending a lot of time together, 6 days in a week. So whenever she would go home, she was complaining that you’re not spending quality time together, and she refused to go to trips together like you did in the beginning. If this is what was happening, it seems she was punishing you for not letting her move in, and so she refused to do stuff together. Instead, she was complaining a lot and guilt tripping you most of the time.

It could also be that her quitting her medication played a role too, and so she became more and more agitated and unable to control her moods. And she mostly took it out on you – so you became her punching bag, as you said.

She had a lot of qualities I admired. She was very Loving at times, spontaneous, had interesting hobbies. Just to name a few. I almost liked how she had highs and lows to a certain degree. I feel when I am my normal best self I am just in the middle ground. Just balanced. I was very comfortable around her at times.

I guess she actually fun and she got me out doing different things. We went camping a lot which I hadn’t done since I was a kid. She was very crafty and made necklaces, collected shells which we would do together. She was a bit childish which I liked and I think she brought out my inner child. Maybe that’s what I liked about her and what I’m attached too.

Yes, this seems like a theme: you admiring her playfulness, spontaneity, childlike nature and passion for things. You told me you don’t know what your passions are… So it could be that you suppressed some of your inner child, and you mostly feel “balanced”. But perhaps this “balanced” is also a bit dull – like not really passionate or excited about anything?

You said you are focused on your job and house, i.e. that you’re working hard, which enabled you to buy a house, right? That’s very admirable and a totally valid goal to pursue. However, maybe in striving for success and being a successful adult, perhaps you forgot to play and enjoy things along the way? Maybe you somewhat suppressed your playful, spontaneous and passionate inner child?

Anyway, this is just an idea…. Let me know if it resonates?

Hi Adam,

I am struggling to not beautify the relationship. I know it was quite toxic, manipulative and controlling. But I just have that feeling within me that I could’ve made anything work with this person. Almost as if it’s meant to be for a reason and we will reconnect.

I know how hard it is to let go when we believe we’re meant to be with someone. That’s the worst. I’ve experienced it myself once and it was devastating. But I’ve learned since that my strong attachment to this person came from my own unmet needs. I believed this person possessed some qualities that I don’t, and that together we can complement each other. And that this will help me fulfill my “mission” in life. So I saw this person as a prerequisite for me fulfilling my mission. And I believed that without them, I would fail. That’s what made it so hard to let go of them, and felt like the end of the world.

So I believe that in the large majority of cases when we feel a strong attachment and believe the relationships is “destined”, it’s actually our deepest longings and fears that drive us. In short, we believe we need this person to be happy and fulfilled. And that without them, there is no way we can be that. That’s what I think is behind the intense longing. But of course, it’s not true. It’s a false belief.

And perhaps for you, this “something” you believe you won’t have without her, and that you’re desperately missing, is spontaneity, playfulness and passion:

I admire those things a lot and do feel like sometimes I am not spontaneous in particular.

I think I look for childishness and spontaneity in a partner as it it something I feel I lack when I’m single and alone.

I adored how she had a real love for her passion.

It could be that somewhere along the way, you lost (or rather, suppressed) those qualities, which are inherent in every child. I noticed you said gaming was the only thing you did as a child:

I think gaming has something to do with my inner child as it’s all I did as a kid.

Would you like to say a bit more about this? Does it mean you haven’t spent much time with your parents, doing fun stuff, but were mostly at home, at your computer? If so, I can see how this is not very conducive to a child developing their passion and interests.

So respect my needs and boundaries. Maintain a degree of freedom. Don’t try rescue. Don’t allow blaming and guilt tripping. Be warned by double standards. Is that a decent summary of the lessons?

Yes, that’s an excellent summary – straight to the point! 🙂

I’m not sure of this third lesson. I feel like I did accept her for who she was. I understood her trauma, mental issues and needs to the best of my ability. It was almost as though she didn’t accept me. Do you mean don’t get into a relationship with someone who isn’t healed fully. I’m not sure if she was even trying to actually heal, I think she wanted too but was actually bottling it all up.

Well, you’ve been nudging her to get a job, seek therapy, get her life in order. You were not wrong for expecting those things from your partner. However, you were wrong in pushing her to become a good enough partner for you – because she wasn’t able to and didn’t show any interest in healing. So you got fixated on her and changing her (or waiting till she decides to change).

That was a wrong approach. You should have realized that you can’t change a person if they don’t want to change. And also, that it’s unhealthy to stay with someone who is abusive and doesn’t meet some basic requirements of what you consider a good partner.

So, to summarize: your desire to have a relatively healthy and stable partner, who isn’t suffering from major trauma, is a legitimate one. However, your attempts to make her into that healthy and stable partner (or the expectation that she would make herself into that partner) was mistaken.

I don’t know if I’ve actually learned these lessons yet and I’m worried I may not.

It could be, because the heart’s longing overwrites what we rationally know. Desire is a potent force. But as I said above, this desire is born out of our own wounds and false beliefs. If you believe she is your destiny, it will be incredibly hard to let go.

Last time we split up she got very emotional 3 weeks later when she realized I was still caring. I am so tempted to show her that I still am but I think it’s just a lost cause… I don’t know why I still do and why I still would want this person even after everything we have spoken about I still feel a strong connection.

Again, I think the explanation is like the one I mentioned above: strong desire born out of your unmet needs and false beliefs. I can tell you that I too had a hard time blocking that person whom I thought I was destined to be with. It was like letting go of something so true and precious… And I was so totally wrong!

So I encourage you to stay strong and not reach out, and to actually unfollow her (if you can’t block her). Because like this, you’re staying connected with her, like with an umbilical cord, and it makes it so much harder for you to start healing.