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anitaParticipantHi Peter:
“The small self resists this truth, clinging to control and fearing the surrender that freedom requires.”- you said it so perfectly!
“Realizations are not meant to remain as ideas but to sink into us, becoming embedded, becoming flesh. In this way, embodiment is the quiet shift where belief dissolves, and life itself becomes the expression of knowing. Flow”-
I want to surrender to Flow.. but I need not grasp to the wanting to surrender; just humbly, ego-less-ly surrender. Like right now.
It is very difficult because of these Tourette tics. They are in the way of relaxing and surrendering, and I don’t know how to stop them, or if it’s at all possible to stop (for anyone in my place). They’re a half century+ neurological-muscular habit.
Regardless, I am willing to surrender best I can. I think I am surrendering right now. I am hearing the rain (been raining all day).
I am not even following what I’m saying right now, not checking to see if I’m making (ego) sense.. lol.
So, going with the flow, as I hear the rain, and see the total darkness outside the windows. The only light is coming out of the computer screen showing the printed letters I’m clicking..
It feels like the rain is not for me or against me; nether is the darkness, it feels like I am part of the rain and the rain is part of me, and so is the darkness. And the people I interact with on these forums.. no separateness, not really.
.. I just got worried: how do I sound, how do I come across.. Have I just made a fool of myself..
But that’s just ego, is it, Peter?
I am having a feel, a felt realization of non-separateness right now.
Anita
anitaParticipantMy goodness, Gerard, you are a deep thinker indeed, and you’ve done a lot of research on limerence in only an hour, I’m impressed!
So the thinking and feeling about old loves.. is about you longing for youth..? Or missed opportunities, a desire to redo the past?
š¤ Anita
anitaParticipantDear me: You are very welcome! So, it’s adios for this thread… I am looking forward to a new thread.
Take care, me, I am missing you already š
š¤ Anita
anitaParticipantDear Tee:
And I am thrilled to get your message š š š. I read it repeatedly and copied it for my records for keeping. I will reply further in the morning.
š š«¶ š¤ š
anitaParticipantDouble posting, Gerard. I will read and reply to your 2nd recent post in a few hours š
anitaParticipantDear Gerard:
A limerence with a small “l”, funny, the way you say it.
“The real drive is to find new meaning and purpose in retirement… I am a deep thinker, I consider and reflect , seeking meaning and understanding. I know I am becoming spiritual. First, seeking to understand my life, who know where it will lead me”- I am curious as to where your deep thinking and growing spirituality will be leading you.
Would love to continue to witness the process..!!!
Anita
anitaParticipantHi Alessa:
I am feeling emotional- in a good way- about your message right above, it’s so kind, so generous, so.. I feel honored to receive it, fortunate, really! It’s just beautiful š
“If there is anything else at all I can do. I would be happy to. š¤”- thank you, and same here: If there is anything else at all I can do for you, Alessa, if something I say- or how I say it, is a trigger for you, please let me know š š¤
“Checked out another nursery. Iām not sure which one to pick.”- I just asked my AI source (just in case it could possibly help):
“The best way to choose a nursery for a 2āyearāold is to focus on safety, staff quality, environment, and emotional fit ā and to reassure the mother by involving her in visits and decisions so she feels confident.
“Key Factors to Consider- *Safety and cleanliness: Check that the nursery has secure entry, childāproofed spaces, and clear hygiene practices. * Staff qualifications and warmth: Look for trained earlyāyears educators who are patient, nurturing, and genuinely enjoy being with toddlers. * Environment: The space should feel welcoming, with ageāappropriate toys, outdoor play areas, and opportunities for exploration.
* Structure vs. flexibility: At age 2, children thrive with routines but also need freedom to play. A good nursery balances both. * Communication with parents: Staff should provide regular updates, be approachable, and respect the motherās concerns.
* Ratios: Ensure there are enough adults per child (often 1:4 for 2āyearāolds) so each child gets attention.
* Gut feeling: Sometimes the most important factor is whether the mother feels comfortable and senses her child will be happy there….
“Itās natural for a parent to feel anxious about leaving a 2āyearāold in someone elseās care. To ease that:… * Trial sessions: Many nurseries offer short ‘settling in’ visits so the child adjusts gradually…* Trust building: Meeting caregivers and watching them interact with children can reassure her.
“Everyday Example- Imagine two nurseries: One has bright rooms, attentive staff, and children happily engaged in play. Another feels crowded, with staff distracted and little communication. Even if both are safe, the first will ease the motherās anxiety because she sees her child thriving there.
“Simplest Summary- Choosing a nursery is about more than convenience ā itās about finding a safe, nurturing place where the child can grow and where the mother feels reassured. Visiting, asking questions, and starting gradually can transform anxiety into confidence.”
I then asked about the specific concern you expressed some time ago. Answer:
“Here are some general, supportive steps that can help her feel safer and more empowered when choosing a nursery:
Practical Safeguards- Ask directly about policies: Nurseries should have clear safeguarding policies for intimate care (like diaper changes). She can ask how staff are trained, how procedures are supervised, and how privacy and dignity are maintained.
“Check staff ratios and transparency: A good nursery will ensure more than one adult is present in areas where children are changed, or will have open, visible spaces rather than closed rooms.
“Look for accreditation/licensing: Licensed nurseries are required to follow strict childāprotection standards. She can ask to see inspection reports.
“Observe interactions: Visiting during the day and watching how staff interact with children can help her see whether care is gentle, respectful, and professional.
“Communication: Ask how the nursery keeps parents informed (daily reports, apps, verbal updates) so she feels connected to whatās happening…”.
I hope something in the above is helpful.
Your anxiety is understandable, Alessa. I know that you are doing your very best for your son!
š š¤ š š¤ š š¤ Anita
anitaParticipantDear Gerard:
Thank you!
As I read your today’s message, the term Limerence occurred to me for the first time in regard to you. I wonder if this will resonate with you to one extent or another, partly or fully, in regard to your long-gone relationships:
(Online): “Limerence is an involuntary state of intense romantic infatuation, marked by obsessive thoughts, longing for reciprocation, and emotional dependency on another person. It feels overwhelming, often ecstatic and anxious at the same time, and is usually oneāsided… The person of focus is called the ālimerent objectā (LO).
“Unlike ordinary attraction, limerence is driven by uncertainty: Does this person feel the same way?
“Key Features- * Intrusive thoughts: Constant, involuntary thinking about the LO. * Idealization: Irrationally positive evaluation of their qualities, overlooking flaws. * Emotional dependency: Mood swings based on perceived signs of reciprocation. * Longing for reciprocation: The central desire is not just to love, but to be loved back. * Physical/emotional intensity: Can feel euphoric when hopeful, or deeply distressed when uncertain…
“Everyday Example- Someone might develop limerence for a person from their past, a colleague, or even someone they barely know. They replay interactions endlessly..”-
It says right there: “a person from their past”.
What do you think, Gerard?
Anita
anitaParticipantHi Allessa:
“Iām glad to hear that you are feeling calmer today. Enjoy your break from the topic. š¤”- thank you, Alessa. I heard some disturbing news last night but still having a calmer day, reading and processing spiritual principles recently is helping me.
“Yes, I switched to blue hearts for you. š”- I had no expectation that you’ll stop using red hearts in communication with other members. The possibility didn’t even cross my mind once, and when I saw you using blue hearts.. I wondered about the reason. Only later (maybe as late as reading the message I am responding to), did I realize you did it for me!
Actually, I hoped but didn’t expect you (or Tee) to stop using red hearts in communication with me after expressing my feelings about it.
Again, it goes back to childhood. I had about zero experience being accommodated by my mother, so I still don’t expect it, sometimes like with the hearts emojis- it didn’t even register that I was accommodated!
Thank you so much, Alessa!!!
“I donāt like making mistakes. The white ones are harder for me to see when Iām tired…”- It’s perfectly okay with me that you don’t post white hearts because they are difficult to see. Also, it’s okay to make mistakes, Alessa. So, if you post a red heart in a message to me, I will understand. And of course, it’d be okay with me that you post red hearts to other members. In no way do I want to be controlling.
How are you today?
š¤š¤š¤ Anita
anitaParticipantThomas, I just had to tell you that your line “⦠Sorry, lost track of what I was saying. I just had a Senior moment. Where was I ? Never mind. Maybe I should erase this? Ah fudge. Sorry.” placed the first actual smile on my face this morning. You are positively hilarious at times, thank you š
Alessa: I too take things literally, and it was only yesterday- when I did my study on Advaita Vedanta- that I stopped being confused regarding this topic. So, when James said “you actually never did protect your child”, he meant (I hope!) that in the context of the eternal, Ultimate Truth, or Ultimate Reality (pure consciousness, where a body and mind do not exist), you can’t protect anyone.. because there’s no body or mind to protect.
But in the context of the temporary truth, or conventional reality of your every day life, of course you have protected your son every step of the way and will continue to do so best you can š
š¤ š©µ Anita
anitaParticipantAnother double posting, Peter (this time only 3 minutes apart). I am taking a Tao break (just a joke š) and will get back to you later.
anitaParticipantHi Peter:
I submitted the above before becoming aware that you submitted another post (13 minutes before I submitted mine).
Here you are saying that the Tao (the Way, the underlying reality) canāt be captured in words or concepts. Words like āsilence,ā āstillness,ā or āeternalā are just pointers ā they gesture toward a mystery you can only experience, not define.
What feels like ādarknessā isnāt emptiness ā itās a fertile space where new life and possibilities are quietly forming.
Walking the āpathless pathā means letting go of the need for answers, and resting in trust that the mystery carries me forward.
True wisdom isnāt about knowing everything ā itās about being okay with not knowing.
True freedom isnāt about getting everything I want ā itās about being content without depending on desires being met. Imagine a bird flying in the sky: if it believes freedom means owning every tree, every worm, every nest, it will always feel anxious ā because it canāt have them all. But if it realizes freedom is simply the open sky itself, it no longer needs to possess anything. Itās already free, because nothing can take the sky away.
The sky in this example is the Tao (The Way and the ultimate reality in Taoism), the Brahman (Hinduism), Nirvana (Buddhism), and God (Western Traditions).
Back to your message, Peter:
Faith= āluminous darknessā: trusting that even when I canāt see the way, the Tao is guiding me, and so, the ādark nightā isnāt something scary ā itās sacred.
What dissolves when a person is truly free is the illusion of separation ā the false belief that I am a self standing outside the flow. My past chronic sense of separation, confusion, or grasping has been like mist or waves ā decades long appearances (but still temporary) that obscured deeper reality, that of belonging and being part-of the mountain, the ocean, the Tao.
* Grasping (defined): the mental habit of trying to hold onto experiences, possessions, or identities as if they were permanent.
Clouds are real, but they donāt mean the sun disappeared. The illusion is believing that the sun has disappeared; thinking that passing appearances are the whole truth. Tao is the enduring reality beneath them.
“The Way cannot be possessed, only trusted. It is not a road but a rhythm, not a map but a mystery. To speak of Tao is to trace the outline of what cannot be named. To listen for Tao is to rest in the space before thought. To walk with Tao is to trust the pathless path, where dissolving and arising are one movement, and where all that is hidden reveals itself in its own time.”-
Beautifully said, if I may say so. You are a very talented.. Flow Writer.
I would be interested to read more from you Peter about how to trust the Tao, in practical terms.
š¤ Anita
anitaParticipant* Hi Thomas: I was wondering if you read the message I addressed to you 2 days ago (Dec 6) right above? It may be that you didn’t notice it.
Hi Peter:
In your 2nd message yesterday (the one you addressed to everyone) you expressed (I am paraphrasing and will use the 1st person) that peace and flow donāt come from trying harder. They come when I stop forcing, relax, and let life express itself through me. Then rules and techniques donāt disappear; they become so deeply part of me that my actions flow naturally.
Developing my thoughts: your phrase āheaven beneath our feetā is a poetic way of saying that the sacred/ peace/ ultimate reality isnāt somewhere far away ā itās already present right here, in ordinary life. You’re rejecting the idea that heaven (or peace, or enlightenment) is something you reach later, after effort or achievement. Instead, itās always underfoot ā part of each step, each moment.
I donāt āclimb upā to heaven; I simply notice the ground I’m already walking on. Itās like walking in a beautiful garden while worrying about finding paradise somewhere else. The moment I stop searching, I realize paradise is already under my feet ā the grass, the earth, the present moment.
When serious problems arise, āheaven beneath our feetā would mean remembering that peace and clarity are already here. By relaxing into that presence, my actions become more natural, less forced, and often more effective. When facing a problem, I need to remind myself: I canāt fix everything today, but I can take one clear step. And I need to pause and rest so to not make big decisions in the heat of panic.
Rushing to fix is like thrashing in quicksand ā the harder I flail, the deeper I sink. It’s trying to fix everything at once and making decisions in the heat of panic,, being panicādriven and reactive while Flow is calm, present, and allows the next right step to emerge naturally, one step at a time.
And now, to your most recent post. Here you’re saying that Flow doesnāt mean shutting down my emotions or pretending I donāt care. It means to feel whatās already here, but not to pile extra struggle on top. For example: If I feel grief, let myself feel it. But donāt add the mental fight like āthis shouldnāt have happenedā or āI wish I could change the past.ā
Nonāattachment= not clinging to what canāt be changed, not fighting reality.
I can still feel sadness, still care deeply, still honor what mattered to me, and at the same time, let go of the argument with reality/ stop the inner fight like āthis shouldnāt have happenedā or āI must undo it.ā/ stop endlessly resisting what already happened and cannot be changed.
You added that selfāapproval reduces selfācriticism, and therefore, it’s helpful. But if you tie it too tightly to āflow,ā it can become another form of striving ā like trying to score points for being good at flowing. Flow is just noticing feelings without effort, without grading myself.
“For tonight: take one slow exhale. Notice one thing you did today that came naturally. Let your body settle.
May you have a good Tao night of sleep and rest. Amen.”- Thank you for and for the 2 messages I processed in this post and for the excellent advice, will do tonight. Actually, will do today. You are a good Flow Instructor, Peter šššš¤ Anita
anitaParticipantDear me:
I can see that youāre really drawn to her and that you enjoy talking with her. Looks like she sometimes gives you positive signals (like staying longer to chat), but other times she pulls back (like leaving the break room). That mix can be confusing.
Since sheās a coworker, itās worth being careful ā workplace relationships can get complicated fast.
If you feel she only sees you as a friend and you donāt want another friendship, it might be healthier to step back before you get more invested. If she truly wants more, sheāll make that clear in her own way. In the meantime, you can enjoy the connection without any expectations.
What do you think, me?
š¤ Anita
anitaParticipantHi Peter:
I just noticed the message you addressed to me a bit more than 4 hours ago, thank you! I will answer Mon morning. I do hope to have a Tao night..
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Though I run this site, it is not mine. It's ours. It's not about me. It's about us. Your stories and your wisdom are just as meaningful as mine. 