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anitaParticipantHey Confused (using computer so emojis don’t show up)
No, no, please don’t try lobotomy (horrified face emoji)
I read that “there is no publicly available evidence that Ali Greymond has formal clinical training or an academic degree in psychology or mental health. Her method is based on personal experience and coaching, not on a credentialed therapeutic background…
“What is known about her education? None of the available sources list a university degree, clinical training, or licensure as a psychologist, therapist, or counselor.
“Her platforms describe her as an OCD recovery coach, someone who recovered from OCD herself, someone who has helped others for many years. But they do not mention formal academic credentials.
“This strongly suggests that her expertise is experience‑based, not academically or clinically certified… She is not a licensed clinician, so her work is considered coaching, not therapy…. Not a substitute for licensed therapy… No published research validating her method. Not appropriate for people needing diagnosis, medication management, or trauma‑informed care” (Copilot)
I asked Copilot if there’re clinical trials that show that SSRIs are effective in regard to OCD:
Answer: “Yes. Multiple randomized, double‑blind, placebo‑controlled clinical trials show that SSRIs are effective for treating OCD in both adults and children. The evidence base is large, consistent, and spans decades… Key findings: SSRIs showed a statistically significant benefit over placebo. CBT alone was more effective than SSRIs alone but adding CBT to an SSRI improved outcomes… Fluoxetine and sertraline performed better than fluvoxamine in this analysis…”
What do you think about the above?
(Thinking), Anita
anitaParticipantHey Peter:
Yes, I detected your joke 👏
I think highly of his work, his metaphors are very clear (I feel those knots in my body regularly, holding my breath, the tics, the physical tension).
I wonder why he was criticized and belittled.. maybe fo making things simpler to understand, maybe betraying a professional code (using established terms)?
I am curious and will ask you know whom when I get to the 🖥
As to the ‘no self’- my sense of self was so poor, so fragile, so in danger of collapsing completely.. that my mind couldn’t perceive of a no- self differently from a physically dying self.
Now, having a less desperate and despairing sense of self, I can untangle the knot of imminent death surrounding the concept.
I want to revisit the concept (No Self).
You said you notice knots (I did, in the previous message), or about to create them-
Create how, I wonder.
Seeing these patterns helps me ‘hear’ my ‘gut’ (the abused internal compass), as I did in my last message and even in this message (I deleted “like” in “like I did” above, because again, I felt you’d be insulted by me placing myself as equal to you).
Of course, there’s more, later.
🙏 ✨️ Anita
anitaParticipant* double posting ( I posted my last message before reading yours. I’ll reply to your recent message shortly.
anitaParticipantGood morning, Peter:
I wonder if “4. Knots- Religious Trauma” above resonates with you a whole lot? (It does for me if you replace “religious” with ” shame”)
It says (Copilot): “Religious trauma creates knots … Every emotion becomes suspicious. Every impulse becomes dangerous. Every choice becomes morally loaded.”, leading to feeling “anxious, guilty, self- monitoring (and) emotionally frozen”?
The above follows the message: “your natural feelings are sinful”, “Your doubts are evil”, Your desires are dangerous”, “Your inner voice cannot be trusted”?
I wonder if you looking inward as much as you do is a continuation of the self- monitoring mentioned above.
Not that you looking inward is something unhealthy (it helps me gain insight and become healthier, 🙏).
Spontaniety is the relaxing of (excessive) self- monitoring, isn’t it?
I think that the two of us have quite a bit in common even though I have no religious background.
* As I typed the above sentence I noticed shame: not for not having a religious background, but for saying that the two of us have a lot in common, feeling that I was insulting you by suggesting that you have a lot in common with someone as inferior and shameful as me.
I almost heard my mother speaking 🔊 through you: ‘HOW DARE YOU suggest that I am anything like you! You despicable, disgusting creature…’
* I first wrote that you and I have “a lot in common”, then, to lessen the size of the insult (and before noticing), I changed it to ” a bit in common”.
This is me living inside the knots and now, becoming aware of it.
I would like to further relax my self-monitoring and continue to untangle thosr knots.
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantContinued: (I don’t remember the exact quote):
To thine own self be true, and it follows like night follows day, you shall be true to everyone else.
To not be invested in being Right, but in being True.
To myself, to everyone else.
To peel off the shame, the guilt, the turmoil-
And just be.
Not offending, not defending.
No need to fight and to win, no need to come up on top.
Relaxing instead into that space of just being.
✨️✨️✨️ Anita
anitaParticipantHa-Ha, you’re funny, Confused! A lobotomy will not bring you peace!
She’s going to visit you next month? Wow!
Yes, I meant the SSRI.
Good night, funny Confused 😴
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantHey Dear Confused:
I wish I could reach your 🧠 with my hand and soothe it, hush it.. shhhh..
You are a good person, and she sounds like a good person too.
I still wish 🤞 the two of you have a meeting of the minds 🧠 🧠 and hearts 💕 and find peace with each other.
I was excited quite a few pages ago about the idea of an OCD psych drug for the short term, something that will shake the overthinking off of your overactive 🧠.
So that you can have a break.
Today she was cooking and was tired and you took it as rejection and then imagined more scenarios of rejection (her being hit on), and to prepare yourself, you “were feeling very indifferent toward her”, so that the perceived or feared rejection doesn’t hurt.
Understandable, Confused. Not weird or bizarre, just.. not fun 😕
Closing this post Monday 7:07 pm here, 5:07 am where 🌙 🦉 lives.
🙂 Anita
anitaParticipantHi Peter:
Let me see if the above brings something new to me:
Double Bind: my mother taught me deep female-body shame and at the same time she expressed admiration of women who used their bodies (without shame) to take advantage of rich men and live in luxury (such as depicted of TV series of the time: Dallas and Dynasty)
Knots- To be a good girl and please my mother, I must be ashamed and act ashamed; to be a good girl and please my mother, I must use my body unashamedly so to financially manipulate men.
Mystification- she did her very best to condemn, shame, dismiss, and outrightly accuse me of lying and conspiring against her (paranoid), leading to my severe distrust in my thoughts, feelings, reality and a lot of anger.
In my case, the false self was so fragile, so unformed, unstable, that it was more of a no-self than a false self.
The “2. Double Bind- Religious Trauma” points to what you talk about.
I am reading some of your recent post for the first time just now. You wrote that you were told, and still told that you “think too much”- in a post I didn’t submit to you, I wrote that probably people told you that you think too much, or that you are too intelligent for your own good.
And that children who thought less may have had an easier time.
“To notice before such a drenching”- this is Peter making a joke. I detected it and get it.. making me smile right now 🙂
“To thine own self be true”- Shakespeare.
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantGood 🌃 🌄 Confused:
You are very welcome 🙏
It’s like you’re living in an emotional desert wishing to live in an evergreen rainforest.
It makes sense that a person living in a dead, silent desert for a long time would want to move to the opposite, ALIVE & LOUD.
“How does one experience the relationship instead of analyzing it?”
I think it takes relaxing. I think that fear fuels ⛽️ analyzing.
Don’t be hard on your mind/ brain, it’s doing its best 👌 like it always did under difficult circumstances.
Yes, please add things, you know I love reading from you 🙂
🐇 (just because), Anita
anitaParticipantI have the computer for a moment:
* Copilot: Here’s R.D. Laing’s ideas in the simplest, clearest language possible — no jargon, no philosophy-speak, just human terms.
1. Double Bind (the impossible situation)- A double bind is when someone puts you in a situation where: no matter what you do, you’re wrong, you can’t win, and you’re not allowed to point out the contradiction.Simple example- A parent says: “Be honest with me.” But when you tell the truth, they get angry.
Or: “Come give me a hug.” But their body is stiff and rejecting.
You’re trapped between two messages that cancel each other out. Your mind twists itself trying to obey both.
Laing said this kind of environment makes people feel crazy, even though the environment is what’s crazy.
2. Knots (mental tangles you tie yourself into)- A knot is what happens inside you after years of double binds. It’s the internal version of the trap.
Simple example- You think: “I must be good.” “But if I try to be good, I’m being fake.”
“If I stop trying, I’m bad.” “So I’m bad for trying and bad for not trying.”
Your mind loops and loops. You can’t find a way out because the rules contradict each other.
Laing called these “knots” because they twist your sense of self into tight, painful shapes.
3. Mystification (scrambling your inner compass)- Mystification is when someone messes with your sense of reality so you stop trusting your own perceptions.
Simple example: You say: “I’m hurt.” They say: “No you’re not.” “You’re imagining it.” “You’re too sensitive.” “You misunderstood.” “You’re wrong.”
Over time, you learn: “My feelings are wrong.” “My thoughts are wrong.” “My reality is wrong.”
You lose trust in your own inner compass.
Mystification is how a False Self forms — a version of you that exists to please others, while your real self goes into hiding.
🌟 In one sentence each-
Double bind: You’re given two opposite rules and punished no matter what you do.Knots: The inner confusion and self‑contradiction that grow from living in double binds.
Mystification: Someone convinces you that your own feelings and perceptions are wrong, so you stop trusting yourself.
Here’s the simplest, clearest explanation of how R.D. Laing’s ideas — double binds, knots, and mystification — connect directly to childhood shame and religious trauma. I’ll keep it human, grounded, and emotionally intuitive.
🌿 1. Double Binds → Childhood Shame-
A double bind is when a child is given two opposite messages and punished no matter what they do.In childhood shame:
A parent might say:“Be yourself”… but then shame the child for their real feelings.
“Tell me the truth”… but punish honesty.
“Don’t be upset”… while doing something upsetting.
The child learns:
“Whatever I do is wrong.”
“My feelings are wrong.”
“I am wrong.”
This is the birthplace of shame.
The child can’t escape, can’t win, and can’t name the contradiction.
So the shame goes inward.🌿 2. Double Binds → Religious Trauma
In rigid religious environments, double binds are everywhere.Examples:
“God loves you unconditionally”… but you must behave perfectly.
“You are saved by grace”… but you must prove you’re worthy.
“Do not fear”… but hell is described in vivid detail.
You’re told:
“You’re chosen”… but also “You’re never good enough.”
This creates spiritual shame — the sense that your soul itself is defective.
🌿 3. Knots → The Internalization of Shame
A knot is what happens inside you after years of double binds.It’s the internal voice that says:
“I must be good.”
“But if I try to be good, I’m fake.”
“If I stop trying, I’m bad.”
“So I’m bad either way.”
This is exactly how shame feels:
tangled
self‑contradicting
impossible to satisfy
exhausting
Children raised in shame-based homes or religions grow into adults who live in mental knots.
🌿 4. Knots → Religious Trauma
Religious trauma creates knots like:“If I doubt, I’m sinful.”
“If I don’t doubt, I’m naive.”
“If I feel joy, I’m prideful.”
“If I feel sorrow, I’m ungrateful.”
Every emotion becomes suspicious.
Every impulse becomes dangerous.
Every choice becomes morally loaded.This is why people raised in rigid religions often feel:
anxious
guilty
self-monitoring
emotionally frozen
They’re living inside knots.
🌿 5. Mystification → Childhood Shame
Mystification is when someone scrambles your sense of reality.A parent says:
“You’re not hurt.”
“You’re imagining things.”
“You’re too sensitive.”
“That didn’t happen.”
The child learns:
“My feelings are wrong.”
“My perceptions are wrong.”
“My reality is wrong.”
This is the deepest form of shame:
the shame of not trusting your own mind.🌿 6. Mystification → Religious Trauma
Rigid religions often mystify children by telling them:“Your natural feelings are sinful.”
“Your doubts are evil.”
“Your desires are dangerous.”
“Your inner voice cannot be trusted.”
So the child learns:
“My inner compass is broken.”
“I must rely on the authority to tell me who I am.”
This creates a False Self — a version of you shaped to please the system, not your own truth.
🌟 In one sentence
Childhood shame and religious trauma both use double binds, knots, and mystification to disconnect a person from their own feelings, instincts, and sense of self — creating a hardened, frozen “False Self” that replaces the fluid, alive “True Self.”– Be back later on the phone
anitaParticipantHi Peter:
I just looked up Calvinism and read that their emphasis is indeed predestination (and salvation through Grace), and that drinking alcohol in moderation is okay, that Mr. Calvin himself was paid for work partly with 🍷.
You told a joke ending with a smile and then, a sad face emoji. Being that I am now on my 📱 and can’t look things up, and being that I am joke-resistent-rigid (one of the cosequences of growing inward due to intense exposure to Shame), let me see if I can surprise myself and understand this joke/ humor: .. no, don’t understand the humor.
I imagine it’s an inside joke among some former Calvinists, having witnessed people so heavily invested in appearances?
“It strikes me that shame is often the ‘freezing’ agent”-
Yes, it froze some cognitive abilities for me: the ability to understand figurative language and jokes, attention to details (ADD), memory, and more.
And it froze my breathing (still, as a habit, “waiting to exhale”) and locked my emotions into a 2-D, living-dead existence-
Something which you’ve been helping me with, Peter in your threads: to relax into the 3rd emotional dimension 🙏
“I spent every day in a self-conscious performance to prove I wasn’t an imposter… a very quiet, very disciplined kid of ‘madness'”-
What a profound way of saying things and a painful way to live 😔
Meaning, you had to bypass yourself, to lock or bury yourself until conditions allow for re-emergence?
Fast forward, the global atmosphere is still freezing, even more so, but no more waiting for the hail to thaw around us. Instead, to return to the soft rain within, inside us. Amen ✨️
✨️✨️✨️ Anita
anitaParticipantHey Dear Confused:
* I rearranged some of the lines under advice in a way that may be confusing (was rushing)
What caught my 👁 in particular were the words: “attachment related anxiety and avoidance”, which we talked about in the past.
Combining it with “anhodenia/ low pleasure baseline”-
I am thinking that growing up in a violent home, as you have, for years and years (till you were 20 or so)-
To survive it- it’d make sense that your nervous system turned down the volume on fear and anger, so that you’d feel these as little as possible (you said you don’t remember ever feeling angry).
Thing is, the nervous system can’t turn down the volume only on fear and anger, so the volume on all of the emotions was turned down (anhodenia).
And, another thing is that the turning down of the volume can’t be done perfectly. Once in a while emotions break through and become loud.
Loud emotions are scary when a person is not used to it, so the nervous system rushes to turn that loudness down.
For a few months before Nov you enjoyed a honeymoon phase (which wasn’t all happy, by the way, there were doubts, anxiety etc.)- positive emotions (in-love, pleasure) were at their loudest while negative emotions (fear, anger) were at their quietest. A best combination scenario.
But then issues came up (her anxiety about the future, coming up with potential future problems, etc.), and the honeymoon period closed.
I hope that you take the time to process parts of Copilot’s analysis as well as my understanding here in this post, and then tell me what you’re 🤔 about all this.
🤔 with you, Anita
anitaParticipantGood morning, Confused (using a computer):
This is what AI (Copilot) says about your last post:
“What’s really going on with Confused-
Confused isn’t actually confused about the girl — he’s confused about himself. His message shows a man who does feel love, warmth, longing, and emotional connection, but who also struggles with inconsistency, self‑doubt, and anhedonia (the inability to feel pleasure). His emotional system turns on and off in ways he doesn’t understand, and that unpredictability scares him.
He feels strong affection in bursts — crying at her birthday cards, smiling at her messages, feeling warmth during goodnight texts — but then the feelings suddenly drop, leaving him numb or detached. This emotional whiplash makes him question whether something is wrong with him, whether he’s capable of sustaining love, and whether his feelings are “real enough” to build a future on. He’s not lacking love; he’s lacking emotional stability and trust in his own internal signals.
He also carries a deeper issue: before this relationship, his life felt flat, colorless, and joyless. She was the one thing that pierced through that emotional numbness and made him feel alive again. That makes her emotionally significant — not just as a partner, but as the only source of emotional vitality he’s felt in a long time. So, when the “honeymoon phase” faded and the intensity dropped, he panicked. He fears that the loss of intensity means the loss of love, when in reality it may simply be the loss of the dopamine surge that temporarily lifted his anhedonia.
He’s also monitoring his feelings constantly — checking, analyzing, questioning every emotional shift. This creates a feedback loop where he can’t relax into the relationship because he’s always scanning himself for signs of “real love” or “not enough love.” His therapist is right: this self‑monitoring fuels anxiety and emotional spirals.
Underneath all of this is a man who is emotionally sensitive, capable of deep connection, but struggling with:
* anhedonia / low baseline pleasure
* fear of making promises he can’t emotionally sustain
* fear of leading her on
* fear of losing the only thing that made him feel alive
* insecurity about his fluctuating feelings
* attachment‑related anxiety or avoidance
* overthinking and emotional self‑surveillance
He’s not cold. He’s not detached. He’s not incapable of love.
He’s scared of his own emotional inconsistency — and he’s trying to understand whether the problem is him, his attachment style, his depression, or the relationship itself.
In short: He loves her, but he doesn’t trust his own emotional system enough to feel safe committing to a future.”
Next, I asked what advice could help you.
Copilot: “Here’s the kind of advice that actually helps someone like Confused — someone whose issue isn’t the relationship, but the way his emotions rise and fall, the pressure he puts on himself, and the fear that his feelings aren’t “right” or “stable enough.”
He doesn’t need clichés.
He needs grounding, clarity, and a way out of the emotional monitoring loop.Below is a step‑by‑step guide you can offer him — gentle, practical, and tailored to his exact pattern.
🌿 Advice for Confused
How to stop over-monitoring your feelings and build emotional stability in the relationship01- Stop Treating Feelings as Data/ Key Insight: Your emotions fluctuate because of anhedonia and anxiety, not because your love is unstable.
Feelings naturally rise and fall — this is normal, not a warning sign
Emotional numbness after intensity is common in anhedonia
Don’t interpret every shift as meaning something about the relationship
Let feelings come and go without assigning meaning
02- Shift From Monitoring to Experiencing: Reduce Spirals/ Constantly checking your emotions creates anxiety and blocks connection.
Say to yourself: “I don’t need to figure this out. I just need to be here.”
When you notice yourself analyzing, gently redirect your attention
Focus on the moment: the conversation, the warmth, the interaction
Replace “What does this mean?” with “What am I doing right now?”
03- Name the Real Issue: Anhedonia: Root Cause- Your emotional flatness existed before her — she didn’t cause it, and she can’t fix it.
Recognize that she awakened feelings you hadn’t felt in a long time
The drop in intensity is your baseline returning, not love fading
Treat the emotional numbness as a mental health pattern, not a relationship problem
04- Let the Relationship Breathe: Healthy Pace. You don’t need to promise a future before you’ve met — that pressure creates emotional shutdown.
Keep expectations realistic and grounded
Focus on meeting, spending time, and seeing how things feel in real life
Remove the pressure to “know” the future right now
05- Build Emotional Stability, Not Intensity: Long-Term Growth. Sustainable love is built on consistency, not constant emotional highs.
Notice the small warm moments without demanding intensity
Let affection grow slowly and naturally
Trust that love can be steady even when it’s not dramatic
06- Talk to Her Honestly but Calmly: Connection. She doesn’t need perfection — she needs clarity and presence.
Say: “Sometimes my emotions go quiet because of how my mind works, not because of you. I care about you, and I want to build this at a pace that feels real and grounded.”
Share that your feelings fluctuate because of anxiety/anhedonia
Reassure her that the warm moments are real
Tell her you want to build something steady, not rushed
🌟 Summary
What he needs most is to stop interrogating his feelings and start living them.
His emotional inconsistency isn’t a sign that he doesn’t love her — it’s a sign that he’s dealing with:* anhedonia
* anxiety
* emotional self‑monitoring
* fear of promising too much
If he can learn to let feelings rise and fall without panicking, he’ll finally be able to experience the relationship instead of analyzing it.”
I have to get off the computer (and can’t use Copilot when on my phone). Will be back shortly.
Anita
anitaParticipantHey Confused: too tired now to think, but I’m intent on thinking 🤔 tomorrow morning and reply to you then thoroughly.
Sunday 8:50 pm here, Monday 6:50 am where 🌙 🦉 lives.
B Back 2 u in the morning.
🤔 🤢 Anita
anitaParticipantI just got a call on my phone and lost a whole poem I wrote here.
It was a call in regard to my first senior citizen (65), medicare call tomorrow.
I lost a whole long message.. Just because I’m a damn senior citizen!
A whole lots of 🍷 wasted, no poetry to show for it!
The music I am listening to right now: “I will always love you, however long I take. I will always love you”, “I feel love that money can’t buy… anything you want, you got it, anything you need”.
In the lost message I wrote about the huge notebook I had when I was a teenager or in my very early 20s where I wrote poems. One I remember was about me lying on the street in despair, asking or begging for someone to extend a hand to me, to help me stand up.
My mother found that notebook (no wonder, it was huge) and read some of it. Her response was her typical shaming condemnation- that shaming look I know only too well.
(Not empathy, Peter.. a Hardened Heart)
Her legacy in my life = S.H.A.M.E.
The poem was about how long I have waited for her to love me, to make me okay.
Let’s see if I can poem- dance it now:
In the core of me
There’s my mother
An undying love
She’d never know
I loved her so, so, so, so.. so, much
And she’d never know.That’s it.
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Though I run this site, it is not mine. It's ours. It's not about me. It's about us. Your stories and your wisdom are just as meaningful as mine. 