Home→Forums→Spirituality→Real God and Ultimate Truth
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EvFran.
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September 2, 2025 at 5:39 am #449175
James123ParticipantThe reason Being, God or Godhead cannot be claimed is simple: the so-called Godhead or God is total disappearing. There is no “me,” no experience, no awareness, no being, no life, no consciousness, no body, no universe, no state, no enlightenment, no mind, nothing at all exists there.
What I used to call Being, pure consciousness, or Allah etc… These words are only pointers, guides toward It. They are not It itself.
This is the so-called Godhead: not a state, not an experience, not silence, not presence, only total disappearing. Nothing has ever appeared, nothing has ever disappeared.
It is the recognition that even life itself has never truly taken place, as before so-called physical birth, now, and after so-called physical death. You can even disseappear while walking to kitchen as below.
There is no one there to claim, see, talk, write, answer, or witness anything.
Complete dissolution.
This is the Ultimate Truth.
Best Regards,
September 2, 2025 at 7:51 am #449182
anitaParticipantDear James123:
“Complete dissolution”… – How does it feel to hold that truth? Is it a kind of relief—knowing that one day there will be no pain, no attachment, no grasping… nothing?
Does it soothe? Does it ache?
Warmly, Anita
September 2, 2025 at 9:02 am #449188James123ParticipantDear Anita,
İt is what You really are.
İf you do not think Now, it is Now.
Actually, it is nameless.
But, if i can name it, it is absolute freedom (neither positive nor negative).
September 2, 2025 at 9:34 am #449192anitaParticipantDear James123:
The kind of freedom you are referring to is not the kind that comforts (positive value). It’s the kind that dissolves (neither positive nor negative).
Anxiety (negative) can be dissolved then, worry can be dissolved, fear.. anger, at least for a moment.. and then, for a longer and longer moment.
Thank you!
Anita
September 2, 2025 at 11:38 am #449193
PeterParticipantHi James and Anita
Like Anita, I also wonder if such radical nondual insight into total disappearance truly soothe?
Noticing my own tendencies I must also ask if this vanishing is a connection to Life or an escape from it? To soothe, to escape to engage… all desires…“The Buddha said: If you say the Buddha has spoken the Dharma, you slander him. In truth, not a single word has been spoken.
I realize that to engage in such questions at all is to leave the nondual space… begging the question whether asking the question already answers it… perhaps with another question: “Who is asking?”
Still when not held as a philosophy but as a inner realization that arises naturally, I know such nonduality can be liberating… As I explored the nondual space, I noticed how the inner narrator sustains identity, and how moments of wordless presence reveal a deeper truth of a state not so much as silence, but the absence of all “scaffolding”.
I wonder if what we call “self” is not a fixed entity but a linguistic construct. Language gives shape to experience, measures it, judges it, and in doing so, creates the illusion of continuity. Without words to name or narrate, the self dissolves through the quiet absence of description.
“Without language to describe the self, there is no self.” In this sense, disappearance is not a metaphysical event, but the natural result of language falling away.
Joseph Campbell once said, “The ultimate aim of the quest must be, not to see, but to be. And that being is not a being with a name, but a being beyond names.” Even this reflection is a paradox of language trying to point beyond itself.
The question I’m left with is whether language is not merely a tool for communication, but THE medium through which the self is constructed and maintained. Here I’m reminded of the call “not to judge” and I wonder if this call wasn’t a call to silence language itself?
How much, if not all the suffering we create for ourselves, and others is a matter of holding on to words too tightly?
September 2, 2025 at 11:56 am #449195James123ParticipantHi Peter,
Language and thought are only tools of communication. They arise and fall — just like the body, life, and the universe — within the Unnamable.
When attachment to thought takes root, it gives birth to personality, and with it, the illusion of a separate “person.”
Yet body and life unfold on their own, with no one in control. In the same way, thoughts arise and fall within the Unnamable, as effortlessly as breathing or the beating of the heart.
For the “me,” there was much suffering, until it reached the point where holding on was no longer possible. I completely let go.
And in that letting go, not even ashes remained of “me.”
September 2, 2025 at 12:27 pm #449196PeterParticipantHi James
Language and thought are only tools of communication. They arise and fall — It true all things arise and return – sound arises and return to silence, motion arises and returns to stillness, time arises and returns to the eternal, which isn’t a measurement of time or a measurement at all.
Still, I don’t feel language is only a tool. Language arising from the eternal is what gives birth to the sense and illusion of self. Without language, there is no self to describe, no continuity to uphold. In this way, the “me” is not just a bundle of thoughts, but a structure built from words. When language loosens, the scaffolding collapses. No language, no self.
“The central point of the world is the point where stillness and movement are together. Movement is time, stillness eternity.
Realizing the relationship of the temporal moment to the eternal — not moment, but forever — is the sense of life…
Realizing that eternity is right here now, that it is within your possibility to experience the eternity of your own truth and being, then you grasp the following: That which you are was never born and will never die.” – CampbellAt this point in my life I don’t feel the radical nondual disappearance as a path, while learning to hold words lightly has… soothed my soul. We are unfortunately limited to language to speak of what can’t be spoken. In the end we find the words that suit us and then let them fade away.
September 2, 2025 at 12:34 pm #449198James123ParticipantHi Peter,
Body and mind works perfectly. İt doesn’t need a “me” function. While, heart beats, liver functions, or mind chatters, it doesn’t ask “me”. Therefore, this is not non duality nor no self. This is living as Truth within so called human body.
However, the identification with the body as person, inevatibly creates suffering. İf one choose to suffer then why not, just be attached with the body or mind, as considering the mind chattering as “me”.
Total disseappears will come at the so called physical death.
That’s it.
September 2, 2025 at 2:02 pm #449201
AlessaParticipantHi Peter
I wonder if both radical acceptance and holding our thoughts lightly isn’t just the same thing, but different ways to describe it? I have been thinking, it is interesting that people have different ways of getting to the same conclusion. There is more than one way to skin a cat. I wonder about where the methods meet… ❤️
September 2, 2025 at 6:20 pm #449210
Thomas168ParticipantHello James123,
“However, the identification with the body as person, inevatibly creates suffering. İf one choose to suffer then why not, just be attached with the body or mind, as considering the mind chattering as “me”.
Total disseappears will come at the so called physical death.”
Okay, let us say that attachment to the body causes suffering. Then what is the alternative? One lives in the body. One has memories which create the self. The body retains the scars of trauma past. Those things were real. Thoughts or no thoughts, the self still lives inside this body. A person can recall their memories of things that happened that shaped their minds and their feeling. Some things leaving scars. All happened while we live in this body. So, what are you saying? That if We do not identify with the body then all our suffering will disappear?
It seems to me that what you are saying might be true in the sense of a being living on a different level. But most people do not live that way. Spouting truths that belongs to someone who has attained enlightenment helps no one because no one can relate. Talking about a person has no real self doesn’t help the person who suffered trauma at the hands of their abusers. It isn’t the same level. Anita and Alessha and Peter and Silvery Blue and others reach real people. And they help them out of their suffering by lending a compassionate ear. While there is truth in your words, the audience doesn’t understand the meaning. The toughest part about enlightenment is whether to share the truth and how to share it. Wisdom and compassion must come first. Not just Preaching.
Don’t get me wrong. I am not saying you are wrong. Or what you say is not true.
Note: I do not know why I always stick my foot in my mouth.
September 2, 2025 at 7:32 pm #449211anitaParticipantThomas/ Tommy: 😊❤️ Anita
September 2, 2025 at 9:48 pm #449213AlessaParticipantHi Everyone
Interestingly, I have a friend that has dealt with most of his issues through Buddhism. All he has left are attachment to this world and his body. He is working on that with death meditation.
He doesn’t suffer much, is happy and enjoys life. ❤️
I believe that suffering occurs in degrees, often with multiple causes. It is possible to deal with them individually and lessen suffering. I feel like that is why people take different approaches to get to the same destination. Different things work for different people. ❤️
As for radical acceptance and negative thoughts. There is nothing wrong with negative thoughts if they are seen for what they are. In my experience, most of the time they are a lie that keeps us trapped even though it feels real.
Identifying with the negative thoughts was a big issue for me. With trauma, we absorb the experiences we receive. Who does it sound like? Technically, it is just more self abuse. It is painful to hold memories of these people inside us. To mistake them for ourselves is to suffer. ❤️
There are other parts of ourselves to nurture. Now, I am more light than dark. More good than bad. These things change. These things change over time with practice. Don’t worry and judge yourself for what cannot be controlled. ❤️
Personally, I’m enjoying the conversation. Thank you all for contributing! 🙏
September 3, 2025 at 12:19 am #449221James123ParticipantHi Thomas168,
I fully hear what you are saying. It is true — speaking of “no self” to someone who is carrying deep trauma can feel like dismissing their pain. That is not my intention. What you say about Anita, Alessha, Peter, Silvery Blue — about meeting people with compassion, listening to them, holding space — that is deeply valid. Wisdom without compassion is empty.
At the same time, when the so-called self dissolves, something different happens. The body and the universe are no longer two. In that, there is no cold detachment — the body inevitably becomes an instrument of Love. Compassion, care, listening, and presence are no longer choices of the ego, but the natural action of Life itself.
And the reason I say this is because after the physical body dies, there is complete disappearing. Nothing is carried beyond. That is why it matters to live fully here — to meet every moment as if it is the first and the last. When life is lived this way, only love remains. Such love carries no regret, because nothing is left undone.
So yes, the memories, the scars, the stories remain in the body, but without identification they don’t rule the being. They are seen, felt, and even shared with tenderness, yet not carried as a burden of “me.” It might appear as though “I” am responding, but in truth, the body is simply moved by Love. Some call that God moving through the body.
September 3, 2025 at 1:05 am #449223
silvery blueParticipantHello!
Yes, I like the conversation and different points of view, too. 😊
There are two truths in Buddhism: relative and universal. Buddha used the Five Remembrance to show the relative truth:
1) I am of the nature to grow old. I cannot escape growing old.
2) I am of the nature to have ill health. I cannot escape having ill health.
3) I am of the nature to die. I cannot escape death.
4) All that is dear to me, and everyone I love, are of the nature to change. There is no way to escape being separated from them.
5) I inherit the results of my acts of body, speech, and mind. My actions are my continuation.It wouldn’t be wise to deny relative truth, because we are huma beings. We have bodies and a body grows old and gets ill and dies in the end… the same truth applies to our beloved… and what we do with our bodies (how we think, speak, treat ourselves and others, …) affects us and others, as well. It wouldn’t be wise to say that this truth doesn’t exist.
Buddha used the tools of relative truth to help us to practice … The relative truth, the Five Remebrances, is taught in order to cultivate gratitude and appreciation for the life we have been given here and now. But of course, his deepest teachings are about no birth, no death, the universal truth… In my opinion without understanding and mainly practicing and living the relative truth, it isn’t possible to reach universal truth…
BUT, please bear in mind that I am only a lay buddhist… I am still learning… This is how I understand this now. I might be completely wrong. 🙂
September 3, 2025 at 6:04 am #449227silvery blueParticipantHello James,
I think I understand you. Maybe not exactly in the right sense of Buddhist teachings, but I relate…
I had difficulties and the way I thought about them really helped me heal…
In short, I appeared in the world, at some time, in some place… and everyone did what they could, what their understanding at the time allowed them to do… and maybe it wasn’t always entirely good or right… but by not perceiving my experience as “me” or something that defined me, I believed I healed faster…
It is just a human experience… nothing else… it doesn’t define “me”…
It is a form of detachment. I think. But the good detachment… because I don’t cling to the suffering that was done to me…
I think it is a bit different from what you were describing, but I think I understand what you are trying to say here. 🙂
🦋
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