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Thomas168ParticipantYes, safe place to vent.
I hope it helped.
Thomas168ParticipantCarry on my wayward son,
There’ll be peace when you are done,
Lay your weary head to rest,
Don’t you cry no more,Once I rose above the noise and confusion,
Just to get a glimpse beyond this illusion,
I was soaring ever higher, but I flew too high,Though my eyes could see I was still a blind man,
Though my mind could think I was still a mad man,
I hear the voices when I’m dreaming, I can hear them say,Carry on my wayward son,
There’ll be peace when you are done,
Lay your weary head to rest,
Don’t you cry no more,Masquerading as a man with a reason,
My charade was the event of the season,’
And if I claim to be a wise man,
Well, it surely means I don’t know,On a stormy sea of moving emotion,
Toss about, like a ship on the ocean,
I set a course for winds of fortune,
But, I hear the voices say,Carry on my wayward son,
There’ll be peace when you are done,
Lay your weary head to rest,
Don’t you cry no more,Carry on you will always remember,
Carry on nothing equals the splendor,
Now your life’s no longer empty,
Surely heaven waits for you,Carry on my wayward son,
There’ll be peace when you are done,
Lay your weary head to rest,
Don’t you cry no more,Kansas,
Lyrics by Paulo Antonio
Thomas168Participant[quote quote=449157]I see bad people like babies. They came into this world completely pure, like clean water, innocent and untouched. Everything they became—their personality, their habits, their ways of thinking—was shaped by their environment, family, society, and life circumstances. None of the “bad” things they do are truly their fault, because they are a product of what surrounded them, how they were raised, and what they experienced.
In a way, they are like a river shaped by the stones and soil it flows over. The person I see now is just the result of everything around them, not something they consciously chose in the beginning. Understanding this doesn’t mean I approve of harmful behavior, but it allows me to look at them without hatred or judgment. I can see the human behind the actions, the innocent child that once existed, and the suffering and conditioning that led them to be this way.[/quote]
I am a strong believer in that people make choices. They choose what to do next. They are not a domino that falls because the previous block fell over. A person chooses to go right or left. When a child grows up, he chooses whether to bully others. He wasn’t taught to be a bully. When I was younger, I had so called friends who took advantage of others for their own .. don’t know what to call it other than their desires or pleasures. When I saw how they did this, I felt repelled and disgusted. So, I stepped away from them.
So, from this I take it as there is real evil in the world. There are some who get joy or reward from hurting others. This doesn’t come from their environment. That is the way they are. It is nice to be able to say that everyone is like a baby. All innocent. But, I stood at the place where the choice was to be made.
A child playing with an animal might accidentally kill the animal. One child might feel remorse and another child might feel power. This is not derived from environmental factors but something inside a person. Evil is real. I wish I had your perceptions and clean mind. To believe everyone is an innocent soul.
So, how to deal with a harmful person? What does society demand? A punishment equal to the crime. Relative truth and Objective truth. That might be for the enlightened mind. I am here just trying to survive.
Thomas168ParticipantHello James123,
“However, the identification with the body as person, inevatibly creates suffering. İf one choose to suffer then why not, just be attached with the body or mind, as considering the mind chattering as “me”.
Total disseappears will come at the so called physical death.”
Okay, let us say that attachment to the body causes suffering. Then what is the alternative? One lives in the body. One has memories which create the self. The body retains the scars of trauma past. Those things were real. Thoughts or no thoughts, the self still lives inside this body. A person can recall their memories of things that happened that shaped their minds and their feeling. Some things leaving scars. All happened while we live in this body. So, what are you saying? That if We do not identify with the body then all our suffering will disappear?
It seems to me that what you are saying might be true in the sense of a being living on a different level. But most people do not live that way. Spouting truths that belongs to someone who has attained enlightenment helps no one because no one can relate. Talking about a person has no real self doesn’t help the person who suffered trauma at the hands of their abusers. It isn’t the same level. Anita and Alessha and Peter and Silvery Blue and others reach real people. And they help them out of their suffering by lending a compassionate ear. While there is truth in your words, the audience doesn’t understand the meaning. The toughest part about enlightenment is whether to share the truth and how to share it. Wisdom and compassion must come first. Not just Preaching.
Don’t get me wrong. I am not saying you are wrong. Or what you say is not true.
Note: I do not know why I always stick my foot in my mouth.
Thomas168ParticipantIt was nice to read you have gotten past the hurt from people in the past. And are making progress toward a life worth living. Keep up the good work. Love to hear more of things getting better for you. Thanks for the post.
Thomas168ParticipantAn excellent beginning to meditation can be the question of “What is the authentic self?”. To concentrate on finding the answer. Or to begin like many do by following breath. Some start by counting breath. In breath and the mind says one. Out breath and the mind says two. Count up to ten and then after ten, begin again at one. At first, the mind will wander and think about other things. Meditation starts by letting go of the other thoughts. Not by stopping thoughts. Just not to follow the thoughts. Bring the mind back to counting the breath.
As the person progresses, the mind may quiet down a little and focus on the breath. The person can then go on to watch the breath go in and go out. The mind say in on the in breath and says out on the out breath. Focus is maintained. As the mind is able to focus steadily, the quiet lasts longer. One remains present and aware. When the quiet is steady and the mind remains focused, the move is to let go of the mind counting or following breath. It is to remain focused and present. When the thinking mind is dropped, this is the setting of the enlightened mind. Emptiness, stillness … the experience brings one to see the truth. 3 things that can not stay hidden. The Sun, The moon and the truth.
Our thoughts make up everything in our lives. It tells us what is real and what is not. It lets us feel and dream and want but keeps us ignorant of the truth. With the truth, compassion and wisdom arises. This is not for everyone although the wish is that all sentient being will be liberated.
If Debbie wishes to learn more then I believe she must find a teacher. There are plenty of places that teach meditation. One can even find it on the YouTube. And there are so many methods. Not every method is for everyone. So, hopefully she can find one that suits her. And, that she will find her authentic self is happy.
Thomas168Participant<cite>@silvery blue said:</cite>
Hello Debbie,If you are into Buddhism, you will soon discover on your journey that there is no authentic self. There is no identifying self. There is no separate self.
People – their “selves” – are made up of different things put together… so, yes, you are “negative, catty, judgmental, angry”, but you are also positive, kind, compassionate, calm, … It only depends on what parts of yourself you decide to cultivate. ❤️
Step by step. 😊
🦋
Presenting “No self” to a beginner will leave the beginner with nothing more than more questions and confusion. Understanding No self will take some time and practice to fully understand the meaning. For a beginner there is nothing more than the self and the suffering. So the talk is more about suffering. Life is suffering. The Truth about the cause for suffering. The possibility to end of suffering. The path to end suffering.
I believe if she is interested in meditation then she would probably want the peace meditation can give a person. Mostly to quiet the mind and all the talking and narration. The Dharma and the Buddhist beliefs may take more time.
Thomas168ParticipantWhen one holds a lit match for too long then one can feel the pain of being burned. If one was able then one would have blown out the natch or dropped the match before being burned. So, can you drop the match? Can you separate yourself from those who are causing these troubles and trauma?
Getting better usually takes time with oneself (not alone). Or with a good therapist. Help to understand what one has gone thru. And the steps to come out trauma with a life worth living. There are people here who have experienced trauma and are helping others. Seek their companionship.
Thomas168ParticipantAlessa,
So sorry for all the trauma you went thru. Children shouldn’t be treated that way, ever. And, it is good to hear you fight back. Shows you are strong at heart. Hope things are better for you now.
Thomas168ParticipantYour post shows great compassion. All you can do is to talk and be there to help if she ask for help. Showing you care, is the best anyone can do at this moment. It will be up to her to get help. Good luck.
Thomas168ParticipantAt first the effort was difficult to raise. To practice everyday. But, as the practice got better. The quiet settled in and I enjoy just sitting. I might wake up in the middle of the night and start practice. And sometimes the birds sing and the sun rises and the light shines into my eyes. Other times I just fall back to sleep. But, I, now, try to sit in the quiet almost every chance I get. Waiting for the bus or at the doctor’s office or just walking down the street.
Meditation won’t change who you are. It just helps one let go of the ideas of what one thinks about oneself.
Thomas168ParticipantBuddhism teaches us a person is all of what one has thought. One is not those thoughts but it is what one believes one to be. And so, the thoughts create a persona that one believes one to be. In essence, one is more than that. Each person is like the splash of water. A drop arising from the ocean. Flying off in its direction. Rise rise high above the waves. Eventually falling back down and returning into the ocean.
Yes, turning off the constant thinking is the way to accept oneself. Meditation starts with watching the breath come in and go out. With letting go of thoughts. Not to chase the thoughts. Not to follow the thoughts. Not to suppress the thoughts. Let them come and let them go. Soon, quiet will arise between the thoughts. That quiet is the essence of self and will last longer and longer. Mindfulness. Dropping off of the thinking mind.
Would you not like your authentic self? I believe that you would need to experience your authentic self and then you would know. As we are now, we create this world with those thoughts. Our senses feed into this idea of who we are. Of course this all seems real.
Thomas168ParticipantAs I read more and more of Laven’s life, I am very sorry for her suffering. And I also feel sorry for all the people around her. Everyone has their own story. Each from a different point of view. I can see that Anita seems to be the leader here to help people. She has much empathy. I read and know there are no words I can give to help. It is totally beyond me. Personally, I lean toward Buddhism because there are the Four Noble Truths. A path to escape suffering. Not to escape life’s pain but the suffering that follows. It isn’t an easy journey. And some never make it any further than a simple desire to get away from suffering. But, I do have good wishes and hope things will get better for Laven.
Thomas168ParticipantSorry, I have not read her complete story. It appears I have made a mistake being here. Can’t jump in the middle and know everything. Well, what is the answer to help her? Just listen to her go over and over her story? Show compassion? Never understood therapy. 1talk about problems and trauma. Cover it and go up and down everything. When does the healing begin? Yeah, this is beyond me.
Thomas168ParticipantCompassion for another person is a wonderful thing. But, it needs to be paired up with wisdom. It is obvious that most of the people here who answer are very compassionate people. Lots of sympathy and empathy. This is not to say that the person writing for help is wrong. This is not to say pull yourself up. This is not to assign blame. But, I ask what do you want from this post you made? One post of something bad in your life. Then another and then another and then another. What is it that you wish to get from them? If one dwells upon the bad things then life is nothing but suffering. There will be nothing but suffering. But, if one stops dwelling upon the second arrow then life can improve.
Alessa, sorry. Do not mean to call you an enabler. Wrong of me. I do not know you.
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Though I run this site, it is not mine. It's ours. It's not about me. It's about us. Your stories and your wisdom are just as meaningful as mine.