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Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships

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  • #431541
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    “I realize my strong tendency, in my analyses, to go too much in one direction or the  other, lacking a balanced/ moderate, inclusive thinking”

    – Your realizations and desire to see yourself is why I want your perspective in my life.

    “I was referring to Hitler”

    – My grandma, I call her Oma, which is grandma in German. She was born in 1942, in a bunker in Germany during the war. That is as directly impacted as I have been, at least as far as I am aware. I am thankful for the freedoms we have now.

    “but he didn’t find your overweight middle sister attractive, so he wasn’t afraid that others will find her attractive.”

    – I think that is what her fear was, and what I thought could be the answer but seemed too terrible to say out loud.

    “being in an anxious state and being in a lower vibrational state and lonely are synonymous; being in a higher vibrational state is synonymous with being content when alone..?”

    – Yes I think so.

    ”  Correction to my sentence: “This core experience (loneliness) makes you very sensitive to of normal fluctuations in the level of emotional connection with the people in your life” “

    – It does. I am working towards surrendering to life and trying to stop believing there is a right way for things to happen. Somewhere I get stuck though, is in the case with N. If I am in a relationship, with someone so detached that when I ask him why he reacted a certain way, and he has no idea what I am talking about… at what extent do I just accept the moment for what it was and move on, versus remove myself from the relationship because what is the point of a relationship with someone who is not all there. In my new goals and efforts to surrender to life, I find myself reaching peace to stop controlling situations, but then I also wonder when is the time to act, and therefore control some of the moment in front of me and not just let life happen to me, and consequentially stay in that relationship.

    “an extreme thirst for connection/ to be seen was reborn. This thirst was born with F.”

    When N showed up at my apartment on Sunday, I used this same word “thirst.” During the conversation I went in and out of consciousness… almost like sometimes I felt my words were true, and other times I felt I was cushioning my words to make him less sad. Something true I said was that I was embarrassed I asked him to tell me I was physically beautiful, because I am not my body so that wouldn’t have really done anything. But that my desire for “words of affirmation” came from just how thirsty I was for any sign that he could see me or cared about what I was saying. He seemed to understand this, and that my desire for compliments was deeper than presented. He said he did not smoke that day, the day he came over. But even him saying that means that it is not typical so he clearly still does most days and it is a surprise when he doesn’t.

    “F kept you in a desert of connections, didn’t he:  none with him, too little with others..?”

    – Yes!

     

    “- could be that he is a lost soul, just lost.”

    I think he might just be. I will write in another post, more details on our recent meeting.

    Seaturtle (perhaps one of few left!)

     

    #431549
    anita
    Participant

    Dear one of a few Seaturtle: I will reply after your next post.

    anita

    #431553
    seaturtle
    Participant

     

    The last I had heard from N was that my stuff was gone and I was blocked. After that, I spoke with you of my trajectory to move on from the whole thing and accept I wouldn’t be seeing him, likely ever again. Then last monday I get a text from him in the middle of the day, saying he wanted closure and to talk if I would be willing to get a coffee or “at least a phone call.” I said I was available for a coffee, but that my sister A would be in town until Sunday so I could meet him then, he said ok.

    • After this event, I was flooded with nervous energy. I witnessed my lower vibrational self, solely my sacral and heart chakras lighting up. My thoughts were jumping all over the place from maybe he has changed and we could work.
    • The next morning I woke up clearer, my third eye woke up and my sacral and heart had mellowed down enough for me to hear my higher vibrational self. Realizing it was an illusion that he had changed and the way I would show up to seeing him, would be to give him closure if I could but overall hold to the fact I had no regrets with the breakup and did not want to get back together.

    On wednesday evening he texts me again saying he is not sure if meeting will be good or not because he has nothing positive to say.

    • I was frustrated that I had to see that message right before I was about to go to sleep after a great day with my sister. Why now? I thought, my sister is here and he knows that, how selfish. But then I felt on some level that since I was selfish with ending the relationship, maybe he was allowed to be selfish too. I responded telling him it was up to him, that I had no intentions to blame him and make him feel badly, that my only intention was to grow, and the fact meeting would be so uncomfortable, we both had an opportunity to grow. I also said I did not want to enter a situation where he was only going to show me contempt. He asked me “why didn’t you break up with me a year ago” I began to respond but then erased my reply and said I would talk about it on sunday, it was 10pm and I wanted to go to sleep. He said he wouldn’t show contempt and wanted to grow too and asked me to pick a cafe since I knew better..

    Saturday evening I send him the location of the cafe and say “11:30?” he responds with a long message full of contempt. Saying “actually I’m gonna pass…I just can’t get over how much of a selfish asshole you are”

    • I did my best to relax, so that I did not hold anything in, as I did with the “you have no clue what love is” conversation. I responded as centered as I could, saying “it is fine with me not to meet, I was doing it for you, not for me.” after I said that I realized that it was for me too but I didn’t want to go back. He sent another hateful message, then another. he said “I read your retarded poem a thousand times” I had my sister take my phone and she read another message, I saw her flinch with sadness and she asked “can I just delete this? you shouldn’t read it.” I thought about it then said yes, just delete it all and block him. She did, such an awesome sister right!?
    • The next day I went to the cafe after dropping her off at the airport, and I am not sure if this was a good idea or not, but I unblocked him just long enough to send him one last message, after all those messages the night before that I did not engage in. Then immediately blocked him again so that he couldn’t respond, I had read enough of his hate and held back from saying things I wanted to for him but why?
    • I said: You used another opportunity to just show me contempt, just as you said you wouldn’t. You operate at such a low vibrational level, keeping yourself stuck in this survival world where you create your own torment and push light, love and vulnerability out of your life. The bottom of the pyramid where you insist you need to be, is operated by your ego, which fears growth/change. You require certain circumstances to just be present, you cannot just be, and that is not a life I wanted to live with you. The very fact you don’t have the mental strength and depth to see me today is the true reason I broke up with you. It was a mistake to leave that poem, I should have known you weren’t deep enough to understand at what level of control I was speaking. Ironic you once told me I was uncomfortable with being uncomfortable but really you are. It is harder to be aware of my demons and check my ego. You are so full of sadness and anger and it shows (during and after knowing you). C (his roommate) operated at an even lower level than you and that is why I couldn’t even stand to be near him, and why I didn’t want to live there. In the first year we were together your vibration was higher, but I think that was just apart of your honeymoon phase self, that fell lower and lower as we fell into what real life would be like. Perhaps also contributing is your heavy weed addiction that is spiritually known to bring you to a lower sense of self, blocking out truth. I loved a version of you that will never actually be. I loved you so much but you have dragged me down for the last time. So congratulations you have completely pushed the last bit of love and light out of your life because I am done trying to help you.

    Then I got home from the cafe and he was at my door.

    He began the conversation by flustering me, asking me a money question. For some reason the hospital called him about my surgery, which he was not my emergency contact so I have no idea why. They told him I still owed some of the co-pay and N had previously helped me pay for it so he was asking me all these questions about where the money went. The same sort of questioning as at the grocery store, it makes me anxious when I am questioned and consequentially makes me not really remember what happened. Him showing up at my home and starting the conversation trying to make me uncomfortable is literally all the validation I need I do not want to be with him and I am so happy I am not.

    Things he said in person :

    – I think you want to care but you don’t know how

    – I hope you don’t turn out like your mom, she is a weird lady.

    – he thought my sister calling him by mistake, was on purpose.. me trying to get his attention

    – He cried telling me he would have taken a bullet for me

    – told me his friend, D, the one who I liked and he knows that, told me multiple times that D now hates me.

    – You have alot to learn about the world and that is something I worried about with you cause I can’t teach you everything…

    • I think he was referring to my comment how I am not driven by money and property in this world. And also his ability to withstand physical discomfort… which yes, I am only now seeing the benefits to not try and control a moment, and he was also referring to that.

    – “I think you lack life experience”

    Overall, being in person was strange. We made alot of eye contact, which I am surprised he was able to. I also expected him to come to me with anger and hate… but instead he put up a very sad front. Began the conversation with things like “you just think everything is my fault” just poor me poor me, type of statements. When he did this, it shut me up… it had this affect on me where I didn’t say things that were reasons I didn’t want to be with him, because I felt like he would just say “I told you so, of course it is all my fault.”: In other words I didn’t say truth because he wouldn’t of even heard it and when I don’t think a person will even hear something I just am quiet, what’s the point. I found myself trying to defend the way I broke up with him, that I felt bad it was so quick. But the next day over text I was able to express “it was quick because if you would have had a second to show me your sad self, I would have wanted to make you feel better. Also interesting is after he left, I found myself wanting to want to go after him… like the image of it seemed like it would have made him so happy, but it wouldn;t have made me happy so I didn’t. When I speak with you, my sister, my parents, my roommate, truly most people, I find it natural to raise the vibrations of the environment, stimulating things like growth, deeper conversation and just playful curiosity about the world. These parts of me felt blocked in his presence… I was not able to let my light shine. This is how it was in the relationship as well, I felt dimmed and I couldn’t understand why. I still wonder why I didn’t feel my bright self when he was there, I tried to access it but it didn’t feel accessible and I really want to understand why that is. We had regular conversation about how our families were doing and such, and that made me comfortable and I wanted him to stay. But I still felt like he could not really see me because I didn’t feel like myself..

     

    Over text the next day:

    – he brought up a time he was vulnerable with me, one of very very few, so few in fact I remember it vividly and I didn’t know how to respond, he said he was uncomfortable so I tried to help move the conversation to another topic. He told me I hurt his feelings in that moment. The next day we continued a text thread cause both of us had more to say that being in person didn’t lead to, told him I value exploring myself and he didn’t and he said  “I was also trying to explore myself. it took me two years to tell you something about myself that I’ve never told anyone. I got a pat on the back and it was onto the next conversation” I said that is not what I meant by “journey to understand myself” that “I am talking about all the questions I would ask. Like why do I think this way, why did you react that way, what is the disconnect here?…questions like that was me trying to grow and I feel like you thought my questions were stupid. But like what sucks is I feel that is one of the best parts about me is that I am so curious, and I swear it just annoyed you” and he said “I love curiosity. Maybe I didn’t want to grow” Then he went on to just say I hurt his feelings with my reaction to his vulnerability that one time. He said:

    – “you hurt my feeling sin that moment. You’ve hurt my feelings many times not often, but it did happen. But you always just had “great” excuses. whenever I hurt your feelings my excuses or intentions did not matter and were unacceptable, all that mattered was you and how you felt in that moment” I responded: ” I feel so bad that I hurt your feelings in that moment. I am so sorry” then in another message “When you hurt my feelings it didn’t feel lke you were trying to look at yourself, it felt like you were trying to justify yourself and there is a difference. There’s a difference ebtween taking defensiveness away and being able to pause and consider “why am I doing this?” versus “how do I make this make sense to them.”

    – He replied: “that is a clear difference…I struggle with what does or doesn’t have control over me in this world, and i think there is not way around said situation because “ive been controlled” thus my excuse. realizing i let these things control me was the first step in the right direction.”

    • after I read this I felt confused, not fulling understanding how that related to justifying his behaviors rather than looking at himself… does this message read “lost” to you?

    -He said “when I met you I was at a pretty good place with myself, but we went thru a lot of struggling things and we decided to take on some challenges and I lost myself a bit.” Then he went on to say how quickly I broke up with him was heartless…

    • I need your help here Anita. Because seeing into this conversation is to see into how it was to talk to him in the relationship, it is like he is not fully understanding what I am saying, his responses feel superficial compared to where I am coming from and it is confusing. I feel like talking to him really challenges my third eye to stay open. When he was at my apartment talking I felt blocked in my third eye. How it was in the relationship too, we talk and I feel like he has this gravitational pull about him to come to the more superficial world and it makes me lose what I was saying.

    – I responded to all that, “on the first part, nothing controls you…in the present moment there is not pain, there is nothing but just simply being and life. Any sort of pain is caused by past and present, which don’t even exist they only bring grief and anxiety. Nothing controls you and that’s why life is actually so cool.” He didn’t respond to this portion. Reading it back I think my intention behind saying this was to try and raise the vibration, because his last message was an attempt to drag me down, he went on and on about the heartless breakup and again how I don’t know what love is. I acknowledged his obvious comments, “the breakup wasn’t meant ot be out of love, it was self preservation. Because I came to the conclusion that I didn’t feel seen or protected by you. At the breakup I mentioned the cash at the store and the c-word incident and when you couldn’t apologize for either I felt giving you my heart would have been disrespectful to myself”

    – He said: “Exactly so the c word incident is what I was trying to show you an example of in reference to the first part of your response, why are you letting a little bit of vibrational air have so much control over your feelings that was my whole point in the care ride.. And the cash you actaully might be crazy for that one (two laughing emojis)”

    – my last long reply: Ok you are going down to that lower vibration with this message and I will only tolerate so much of that… the c word wasn’t about the hot air. it was the fact my potential future husband was doing something repettively that made me uncomfortable. who cares if it is valid to feel uncomfortable about it, what matters is why? why couldn’t you just be the one person out of this nasty world not to try to make me uncomfortable. On the cash, the fact you call me crazy on it is the whole issue. You are refusing to look at yourself, there was an undertone of energy there no matter how much you deny it… I can tell when there is more to what someone is saying and you are in so much denial, that is what is crazy”

    – All he said after that whole message was “ok”

    – I then said “he still can’t apologize I’m shocked” “Let’s just end this cycle now and say our goodbyes on a good note” and we did.

     

    A novel by Seaturtle!

     

    #431555
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle the novelist: : I will read and reply to you by Thurs morning.

    anita

    #431562
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    Your realizations and desire to see yourself is why I want your perspective in my life“- thank you.

    “My grandma, I call her Oma, which is grandma in German. She was born in 1942, in a bunker in Germany during the war“- my mother was born in 1942… (this means I am not a Gen-Z, lol).

    I also wonder when is the time to act, and therefore control some of the moment in front of me, and not just let life happen to me, and consequentially stay in that relationship“- with a man with whom you’re compatible, it’d make sense to do both, but with one with whom you are very incompatible (N), do none of these things (better not be in a relationship with a man with whom you’re very incompatible).

    * I hope that you will no longer be embarrassed for being thirsty for compliments, no valid shame for how you feel.

    Last Monday I get a text from him in the middle of the day, saying he wanted closure and to talk if I would be willing to get a coffee… The next morning I woke up clearer, my third eye woke up and my sacral and heart had mellowed down enough for me to hear my higher vibrational self“-  I missed reading/ talking about chakras…!

    “On Wednesday evening he texts me again saying he is not sure if meeting will be good or not because he has nothing positive to say… I also said I did not want to enter a situation where he was only going to show me contempt… He said he wouldn’t show contempt… Saturday evening…  he responds with a long message full of contempt. Saying ‘actually I’m gonna pass…I just can’t get over how much of a selfish asshole you are’… I responded as centered as I could,… He sent another hateful message, then another. He said ‘I read your retarded poem a thousand times‘…

    Then I got home from the cafe and he was at my door. He began the conversation by flustering me, asking me a money question… The same sort of questioning as at the grocery store… Things he said in person: (blah blah blah)… When I speak with you, my sister, my parents, my roommate, truly most people, I find it natural to raise the vibrations of the environment…  These parts of me felt blocked in his presence.. I was not able to let my light shine. This is how it was in the relationship as well, I felt dimmed and I couldn’t understand why

    Over text the next day… He said: (blah blah blah)... after I read this I felt confused, not fulling understanding how that related to justifying his behaviors rather than looking at himself… does this message read ‘lost’ to you?“- an honest conversation is lost on him. I stopped reading what he said from one point on, hence the blah–blah-blah. There is no benefit for me to try see what a closed 3rd eye (his) wants to show me.

    I need your help here Anita. Because seeing into this conversation is to see into how it was to talk to him in the relationship, it is like he is not fully understanding what I am saying, his responses feel superficial compared to where I am coming from and it is confusing. I feel like talking to him really challenges my third eye to stay open“- bingo! I wrote the above before I read this part. What he’s been telling you under the influence of a closed 3rd eye, facilitated by a chronic marijuana use,  has made it difficult for your 3rd eye to stay open.

    When he was at my apartment talking I felt blocked in my third eye. How it was in the relationship too“- this is what I am saying (reading this after I typed the above)!

    “I responded to all that, “on the first part, nothing controls you…“- in his ear, it’s blah-blah-blah.

    He didn’t respond to this portion… All he said after that whole message was ‘ok’“- my point. Your words were blah-blah-blah to him. And frankly, his words should mean the same to you.

    N was meant to be much more than a closed eye chakra and stoned crown chakra. He may be a good person in many ways, an ethical worker perhaps, a law abiding, tax paying citizen, and if he is these things, I greatly appreciate him, I sincerely do!

    It’s just that when you choose a partner for yourself, you need a man capable and willing to engage in honest conversations, it’s a must, it’s not something that’s optional for you!

    anita

     

    #431569
    anita
    Participant

    Added point: he feels, from what he told you recently, and from what he told you in the past (as well as from what you expressed) that maybe you took advantage of him financially, that is, that he worked hard for many hours, days or longer (?) to finance outings with you, to cover rent that a paying roommate would otherwise cover, etc.

    If this is the case, like I suggested before, you might want to send some cash his way, or let him know that you will, as soon as it’s possible for you…?

    anita

    #431590
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    “my mother was born in 1942… (this means I am not a Gen-Z, lol).”

    -The topic of generations is funny for me because I have never felt like I belonged to one. Millennials call me gen Z and gen Z’ers call me a millennial. I didn’t grow up with touch screens, but I am also not allowed to call myself a 90s kid cause I was born in 99, most of my peers being 98. But I guess it doesn’t really matter does it, hahaha.

    “* I hope that you will no longer be embarrassed for being thirsty for compliments, no valid shame for how you feel.”

    -Thank you, I hope so too.

    ” I missed reading/ talking about chakras…!”

    -I think you would really enjoy reading the Author Michael, Singer. He wrote the untethered soul and more books, I think it is the second in the series he really goes in to chakras. It is funny how all sorts of metaphors/conepts have been presented to me in my life, and much more to come, but there are certain ones that sort of stick. The reason I like chakras is because when Michael Singer talks about the energy flow through your stomach, or through your heart/ throat or crown.. I can feel it in each location, it feels very true to me that I have multiple energy sources.

    “an honest conversation is lost on him. I stopped reading what he said from one point on, hence the blah–blah-blah. There is no benefit for me to try see what a closed 3rd eye (his) wants to show me.”

    – It takes me longer to stop listening because my heart still cares, there will be a day it doesn’t anymore and I won’t be able to tolerate his blah blah blah. You know what is so ironic, and also something that just throws me off, I was getting us both water from my brita and he made a comment about it, “water bottles are way better, the fluoride blocks the third eye.” The way he speaks has lead me on many times that he is awake, but then in our conversation, as you witnessed, I don’t even understand what he is saying. In the relationship his closed eye, made me question my opened eye, I wondered “am I sleeping? why is what he saying so hard to understand?” Then he would tell me I wasn’t listening and I really tried.

    “What he’s been telling you under the influence of a closed 3rd eye, facilitated by a chronic marijuana use,  has made it difficult for your 3rd eye to stay open.”

    I have noticed a common thought I have, that I am avoiding engaging in hopefully until it vanishes, it says “he should know that his third eye is closed and yours is open, you can help him open his. Share the books you are reading with him so that he can wake up, if you don’t maybe you just don’t want him to wake up because then you would want him back. You are selfish for not sharing with him what enlightens you.” I am fairly certain this voice is a lie, but I catch myself in daydreams about leaving a book at his door, or writing him a letter that might open his eyes. I think the intention of that voice is to serve my ego… him seeing that I am right. So therefore it must not be a true voice. After thinking about the intentions of that voice I realized I not only want him to see me, but I want him to be proud of me. I thought about this more, I think I care more about men being proud of me than women… My dad’s lack of being proud of me? his conditional love.

    “you need a man capable and willing to engage in honest conversations, it’s a must, it’s not something that’s optional for you!”

    – Exactly. I still think that closure is pretty much just an illusion, since it is perhaps impossible to fully satisfy..? But I am glad that seeing him his third eye is still closed, and I didn’t leave in fear I left because of my gut/intuition. Not sure that I needed that clarity, because I was fine with not seeing him, but at least I didn’t allow him to close my third eye along with his, again.

    If this is the case, like I suggested before, you might want to send some cash his way, or let him know that you will, as soon as it’s possible for you…?”

    -He said with words “I don’t think you owe me anything.” his actions, and undertone behind words says otherwise, I feel. He said the first two months he only thought of me and the only time he wasn’t was if there were numbers in his head and he had to do math. Not sure what the point of that was other than to just make me feel guilt, anyways I asked him what were the thoughts that were coming to his head. He said “I go back and forth between ‘I crushed my flower’ and ‘she’s just a lazy B**** ” I did my best not to react/take personal what he said cause honestly I was asking him for him, not for me, when I asked he was stunned by the question/introspection. Him thinking I was lazy was what I thought he thought. There was 3 months in our relationship where I felt the heaviest as far as my third eye closed, I know he is referring to that period of time, it feels bad to me that after I was fired and going through a depressed state, living off unemployment and just painting all day trying to find myself, that he did not have empathy for me he just thought I was lazy. Then after that 3 months found a job, but still didn’t make enough to buy all the groceries and pay rent, I don’t think he truly understood how little I was making. But yes, if I lived alone I would have had to figure it out, and perhaps I was lazy for not finding a way to make more money. I was so exhausted all the time and part of me thinks it is because my third eye was so tired..?, applying it felt impossible at times and I could sleep for so long. I have debated sending him some money, at least for what he paid for my surgery. But I am afraid to need money… I am afraid that I will send it then my car will break down and I will not have what I need for another. I make enough now to set a little aside, but not enough to have for a car and for him. I really do not like money, it makes me uncomfortable and I would trade my work for goods/services if I could. Although it does always seem to be there when I need it most. I don’t want to live and make decisions based on this fear that clouds my third eye, but it is very much there.

     

    Seaturtle

    #431594
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    I read just a bit of your recent post (about to leave for a walk), but in regard to this: “He said with words ‘I don’t think you owe me anything.’ his actions, and undertone behind words says otherwise“- my idea of sending him cash is good only if you ask him if he thinks that you owe him money, telling him that if you do, you are willing to repay him as soon as you can, and the  he answers Yes, that he believes you owe him.

    If he says that you don’t owe him, regardless of the dishonesty in his claim, then forget it, you don’t owe him any money. More later.

    anita

    #431595
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    I have pondered more on where this tiredness “laziness” came from.

    He probably began to think I was lazy before I stopped working for Verizon, because the reason I was let go was because I took too much time off, and my Christmas break home was the last straw and I chose to go, knowing I would likely get fired. I called out of work a lot while I worked there, when friends came to town I prioritized a lot of things over work, friends, events, my fatigue. The job was draining socially for me, although in Seattle I was able to do the job with a great amount of energy, it wasn’t until simultaneously living with N and working here in AZ that it started to be too much for me. Had my third eye been opened then I would have/should have found a way to find meaning at the job. I don’t think changing my environment was the answer it was changing something in me, but at the time I didn’t know what that was and I was too tired to think about it. I want to avoid getting this tired again and fully understand why that happened. Why was I so tired. Was it the perception of events around me that got me tired? Or is there truth in the idea that being an empath means you take on others energies and perhaps N’s chasing of money and property immediately after arriving here was such a low vibration it dragged me down? I do not want to blame him to bring myself comfort, but I do believe he exhausted me in some way, and I allowed it to happen for some reason… Or maybe it has nothing to do with him and my car getting stolen and incompatibility with my new coworkers was the problem that I brought home, negativity.

    not lazy Seaturtle

    #431596
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    “If he says that you don’t owe him, regardless of the dishonesty in his claim, then forget it, you don’t owe him any money. More later.”

    -I understand and agree. My initial instinct is to wait till a couple weeks since he is out of town, then simultaneously ask him that while asking to come get some of the things that were not thrown away. I didn’t want to be accused of only caring about my things and not him, so I didn’t bring it up when I saw him but he did mention having my ski gear that I might as well go get. There was a painting I left there that I really liked, 3 koi fish swimming in a circle. That was the only thing I asked him about and he literally said “yea I knew you would want that so it is one of the things I threw out” Anger emoji! how rude. His desire to make me feel badly is outside the relationship the same way it was inside of it.

    trying not to be upset about her koi, Seaturtle

    *I must make another better one 🙂

    #431600
    anita
    Participant

    Dear gen Z, Millennial, not lazy 99-Seaturtle:

    he made a comment about it, ‘water bottles are way better, the fluoride blocks the third eye.’“- he talks the talk, but doesn’t walk the walk.

    The way he speaks has lead me on many times that he is awake, but then in our conversation, as you witnessed, I don’t even understand what he is saying… I wondered ‘am I sleeping? why is what he saying so hard to understand?’“- too much fluoride in someone’s water.

    I catch myself in daydreams about leaving a book at his door, or writing him a letter that might open his eyes… I not only want him to see me, but I want him to be proud of me.… My dad’s lack of being proud of me?“- particularly after reading N’s recent talk, I think that he is deceptive, deceiving himself and those who listen to him. When he told you that (he feels or believes that) you don’t owe him anything, that’s the opposite of what he truly feels and believes.

    You want deceptive men to be proud of you..? Or a deceptive men to rehabilitate?

    I didn’t leave in fear I left because of my gut/intuition“- written on April 11, 2024, six months and five days since you chose the title of your thread: Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships, congratulations!

    At least I didn’t allow him to close my third eye along with his, again“-

    – caring for and listening to a deceptive man (“It takes me longer to stop listening because my heart still cares“), makes the lid over the 3rd eye very heavy, heavier and heavier the longer you listen to him.

    Why was I so tired… I do believe he exhausted me in some way, and I allowed it to happen for some reason“-

    – deceptive talk is exhausting, including your own: “He is supportive, he encourages me to do what I LOVE. We are getting better at communication every day“, Seaturtle, July 29, 2023, in her thread “Please help me, my mind hasn’t rested in 8 months”– unrested, exhausted!

    His desire to make me feel badly is outside the relationship the same way it was inside of it”– living with a person who is actively trying to make you feel bad is also exhausting.

    Here are a few quotes on self deception (good reads):

    “Above all, don’t lie to yourself. The man who lies to himself and listens to his own lie comes to a point that he cannot distinguish the truth within him, or around him, and so loses all respect for himself and for others. And having no respect he ceases to love.”― Fyodor Dostoevsky.

    “I lie to myself all the time. But I never believe me.” ― S.E. Hinto

    “Reality denied comes back to haunt.” ― Philip K. Dick

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.” ― Saul Bellow.

    I think that the 1st quote applies to N, and the fourth perfectly applies to you, in regard to not having seen N as he is, 3rd eye having been closed.

    anita

    #431601
    anita
    Participant

    Resubmitted:

    Dear gen Z, Millennial, not lazy 99-Seaturtle:

    he made a comment about it, ‘water bottles are way better, the fluoride blocks the third eye.’“- he talks the talk, but doesn’t walk the walk.

    The way he speaks has lead me on many times that he is awake, but then in our conversation, as you witnessed, I don’t even understand what he is saying… I wondered ‘am I sleeping? why is what he saying so hard to understand?’“- too much fluoride in someone’s water.

    I catch myself in daydreams about leaving a book at his door, or writing him a letter that might open his eyes… I not only want him to see me, but I want him to be proud of me.… My dad’s lack of being proud of me?“- particularly after reading N’s recent talk, I think that he is deceptive, deceiving himself and those who listen to him. When he told you that (he feels or believes that) you don’t owe him anything, that’s the opposite of what he truly feels and believes.

    You want deceptive men to be proud of you..? Or a deceptive men to rehabilitate?

    I didn’t leave in fear I left because of my gut/intuition“- written on April 11, 2024, six months and five days since you chose the title of your thread: Telling the difference between gut and fear in relationships, congratulations!

    At least I didn’t allow him to close my third eye along with his, again“-

    – caring for and listening to a deceptive man (“It takes me longer to stop listening because my heart still cares“), makes the lid over the 3rd eye very heavy, heavier and heavier the longer you listen to him.

    Why was I so tired… I do believe he exhausted me in some way, and I allowed it to happen for some reason“-

    – deceptive talk is exhausting, including your own: “He is supportive, he encourages me to do what I LOVE. We are getting better at communication every day“, Seaturtle, July 29, 2023, in her thread “Please help me, my mind hasn’t rested in 8 months”– unrested, exhausted!

    His desire to make me feel badly is outside the relationship the same way it was inside of it”– living with a person who is actively trying to make you feel bad is also exhausting.

    Here are a few quotes on self deception (good reads):

    “Above all, don’t lie to yourself. The man who lies to himself and listens to his own lie comes to a point that he cannot distinguish the truth within him, or around him, and so loses all respect for himself and for others. And having no respect he ceases to love.”― Fyodor Dostoevsky.

    “I lie to myself all the time. But I never believe me.” ― S.E. Hinto

    “Reality denied comes back to haunt.” ― Philip K. Dick

    A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.” ― Saul Bellow.

    I think that the 1st quote applies to N, and the fourth perfectly applies to you, in regard to not having seen N as he is, 3rd eye having been closed.

    anita

    #431630
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    “Dear gen Z, Millennial, not lazy 99-Seaturtle:”

    hahaha

    “he talks the talk, but doesn’t walk the walk.”

    I am glad to now know what that looks like to avoid it 🙂

    “particularly after reading N’s recent talk, I think that he is deceptive, deceiving himself and those who listen to him.”

    I agree with this.

    “You want deceptive men to be proud of you..? “

    When you put it this way…

    “– caring for and listening to a deceptive man (“It takes me longer to stop listening because my heart still cares“), makes the lid over the 3rd eye very heavy, heavier and heavier the longer you listen to him.”

    -It truly, truly does.

    “I think that the 1st quote applies to N, and the fourth perfectly applies to you, in regard to not having seen N as he is, 3rd eye having been closed.”

    I agree, a waste of energy!

    Seaturtle

    #431631
    seaturtle
    Participant

    Anita,

    I am going to start a new thread on this site, a new beginning to a new journey. I haven’t decided how I should title it or what to start with.

    I want to use my life to be in a path to enlightenment. I do not want a spiritual ego where I ever claim enlightenment, and I want to learn from those ahead of me on the path. Or to learn the different paths. I read that in many eastern traditions, royal families would hire teachers to enlighten them, including Buddah’s family. I recently read/am still reading the origins of Buddah’s desire and approach to enlightenment in “The Essense of Buddah: The path to enlightenment” by Ryuho Okawa. It talks about his desire to seek teachers and ask questions and I have this desire! The book also specifically calls out Michael Singer and Eckhart Tolle for being able to teach eastern philosphy here in the west, and ironic because they are the two authors I have been reading from recently, in seeking teachers I found two. But I would also like to have conversation with people about these things, whether it is one person or a group of collective consciousnesses trying to unidentify with false selves. I want to unidentify with my false selves. I also want to learn what blocks my chakras and how to unleash Shakti.

    Perhaps this is exactly what I should post

    Seaturtle

    #431634
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Seaturtle:

    Before turning the computer this morning and seeing that you posted, I was going to ask you a question. I want to ask it before I read your recent posts. It’s about the “house cleaning” sessions: (1) by using the word cleaning, do you mean that F referred to any sign of you (your words) such as your backpack, your shoes being .. dirt? If not, what did you mean by cleaning?

    (2) If you close your eyes for a moment and think of those sessions, imagining that you are him, with his emotions, saying whatever he’s saying.. can you type out whatever comes out of his mouth..?

    anita

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