Dear Nate:

In your original post, you attached a link to a tiny buddha blog titled How to tell when someone needs a friend. I read it: “When I was in high school I was shy, to say the least. I guess a more accurate description would be to say that I was insecure. Painfully insecure… too insecure to ever say hi to anyone in any of my classes… There were even some days when I went through the entire school day without speaking a word. I felt utterly alone and certainly friendless. One day, though, for no discernible reason whatsoever, a kid on my school bus started talking to me..  he seemed to actually be listening to what I had to say, and I felt like someone really cared about what I had to talk about… I’ve tried to model myself after this guy since then. To be a genuinely good listener and to go out of my way to help someone who looks like he or she is having a bad day…  If you know someone who tends to stay removed from groups and conversations, they might simply need someone else to take the initiative. Many people want to talk to their coworkers and peers more—they just don’t know how to start… lonely people tend to spend more time focusing on stressful experiences. People who tend to dwell on their negative experiences—even the seemingly small ones—are likely spending too much time alone…”.

You wrote about the above: “The aim of the article is to help readers identify those whom the article describes. My challenge is that this article describes me perfectly, and it gives no advice to those whom it describes.“- maybe the intended advice is for the lonely, painfully insecure person to look around and identify someone who’s having a bad day, someone who appears distressed and say something to that person, initiate a conversation, and then genuinely listen to what the person is saying. BUT I understand how doing this would be very difficult or impossible for someone who is very shy/ painfully insecure.

I read through the other article that you attached. You wrote that you do the things suggested in the article so to make friends (ex., asking people questions, inviting them to do things with you), but your efforts are not reciprocated,

You shared that you currently live in a standoffish city and you are “quite alone“.  In a few months, you will be moving to a city with a somewhat different culture, and you hope to be “deeply connecting with another person” in the new city.

In my first reply to you, I asked you (I am adding the boldface/ italic feature here): “What kinds of question do you enjoy answering, feeling passionate about answering”, and you answered (to that part of my question): “There are very few questions I won’t answer. I’m an open-book type, I guess you could say. It’s just that the book doesn’t get opened that often“.

I noticed that you didn’t answer what kinds of questions you enjoy answering, or feeling passionate about answering. You answered instead, paraphrased, that you will answer most questions asked. I wonder why.. Is it that you tend to be intellectual rather than emotional?

In your original post, you wrote and asked (again, I am the one adding the boldface feature): “I do get that most people simply aren’t interested in deep relationships… But I am talking about seeking out those still actively seeking… I do get, too, that I may never find that close connection. The point is not to find, because I have no control over that. I just want to be the best seeker I can be. Over that, I do have control. How do I become a better seeker of deep relationships?“-

– Depending on your answer to my above question, the answer may be that you need to seek a deeper connection to your emotional self at the same time that you seek a deeper connection to other people.

I will try to do this here: to seek a deeper connection to my emotional self while, at the same time, seeking a deeper connection with you by sharing this: when I first read your original post, I felt that I am not qualified to answer your question because it is difficult for me to form deep connections with people that last for a long time. Actually, I am quite afraid of such. In my mind, a long-term, deep connection or relationship with someone means pain and suffering, a sense of entrapment. I grew up with a parent in a situation  where my deep connection to her was used and abused. This was my first deep connection experience, and it made me very scared.

anita

Dear Nate:

“People express interest in friendship by asking you questions… How do I become a better seeker of deep relationships?“- I would like to ask you a question for the purpose of seeking a deeper communication with you, if I may:

What kinds of question do you enjoy answering, feeling passionate about answering, and what kinds of questions make you cringe, perhaps, causing you to emotionally withdraw?

anita

Dear Stacy:

I intended but forgot to wish you a Happy Birthday five days ago, Happy Belated Birthday! I remember that when I turned 32 I thought I was old. But then, I was old when it comes to how I often felt: hopeless, aimless, guilty, tired… old.

You shared that you chose to accept the full time job, and that you can change your mind “if it ends up being a huge mistake in the future“, that the ultrasound for the lump on the right side of your neck came back negative for anything concerning, however, a few days later, you noticed an even bigger lump on the left side of my neck, you freaked out and called your doctor. You then happened to read online about a woman who had a mild heart attack because of her emotional reaction to her breakup, and you (about 7 hours ago when you typed your post, at about 2 or 3 am) were freaking out about your panic attacks resulting in a serious medical situation.

You shared that you believe that people (including your ex) have to remove themselves from you because you are “too much for people“, too “neurotic and scared.. all the time“, that people get “annoyed and frustrated” with you because you are too much, and that when you mentioned to your ex a future with him, “he cringed his face in so much discomfort“.

My input: there is a category of Cognitive Distortions called Magnification and Minimization. In the above alone, you exaggerated the magnitude of the possibility that choosing the full time job is a mistake, calling it a HUGE mistake. You exaggerated the frequency of you being neurotic and scared to the that of ALL THE TIME. And I guess that you exaggerated the extent of the discomfort that registered in your ex’s face to be that of SO MUCH.

Look at the title you chose for your thread back on Sept 6: “EXTREMELY painful breakup and confusion”.

From psychology tools. com: “Magnification and minimization is a cognitive distortion in which people exaggerate certain aspects of themselves, other people, or a situation while simultaneously downplaying others. This typically involves magnifying negative elements (e.g., the mistakes they have made) while minimizing positive aspects (e.g., successes or achievements)… It’s like looking at things through a set of binoculars. From one end, your problems seem much bigger and more terrifying. But if you look through the opposite end, your positive qualities look small and insignificant…

“Magnification and minimization is often linked to an ‘inexact labeling’ of events. For example, a client might state that they were attacked by their partner for missing an important date, but in reality, this ‘attack’ might refer to a displeased remark or expression.

“This distortion also overlaps with (the) concept of ‘awfulization‘, wherein the client believes that ‘a bad, unfortunate, or inconvenient circumstance is more than bad, it is the worst it could be – 100% rotten’…

“In other words, magnification often involves exaggerating the unpleasantness of a situation while minimizing actual or potential positive elements.

Back to your today’s post, your last sentence is: “I’m getting super concerned with myself that I’m not progressing AT ALL with this. It will be 4 months on Christmas since the breakup.”- there’s the exaggeration (boldfaced).

Overall, in the past, you negatively exaggerated yourself and you positively exaggerated your ex and his parents, for example: “I have never been chosen or wanted by a guy who I find attractive and impressive. Not until this guy… he was super impressive…this guy from this impressive upbringing and who has had a really impressive life with a ton of experiences with travel and other people, who claims to love me so much thinks I’M impressive? Then I’ve won” (Sept 11).

Personally, from what you shared about him, I am not impressed with him. On the other hand, I am impressed with your intelligence, with how well you use the English language to express yourself.. you sound very educated and kind.. You have significant Positives that you’ve been Minimizing while greatly Magnifying his positives, or alleged positives.

anita

Dear Lou92:

You are welcome!

His childhood & teenage experience with his mother: “She was completely emotionally unavailable… couldn’t show up for him as a mother. They were estranged for years“.

His teenage experience with his step-mother: “She came into his life when he was around 14. She moved into the home my husband and his Dad lived in, they went on to have 2 children together”, “he did move out at the first opportunity he had, which was 18 years old, and he was barely at home before then during his teenage years. He had an overbearing stepmother that ruined the relationship he had with his Dad and treated my husband terribly. He was desperate to get out of there at any given opportunity“, “She was very controlling, and would lose her temper over the slightest thing.  It was a standard sort of idea that she couldn’t accept my husband because he was the child from a previous marriage. There was a big strain on their relationship and she used to go out of her way to make things difficult.  She would ’cause an argument’ with him out of something that was very minor, and then because his Dad wouldn’t join in, it would then cause problems between their relationship. They eventually divorced because the stepmother felt like the Dad wasn’t on her side with a lot of the issues she had with my Husband.”

His teenage experience with his father: “they never saw each other… Because they never saw each other, the Dad never knew what was going on in my Husband’s life and vice versa. They just completely lost touch basically, and it was very sad for my Husband”, “(The stepmother) would ’cause an argument’ with (your husband, when he was a teenager) out of something that was very minor, and then.. his Dad wouldn’t join in“.

My understanding at this point (an understanding that’s developing as I type): younger than 14, his father was positively attentive to him but his mother was not at all: not positively and not negatively. His step mother came into his life at 14 and gave him lots of negative, angry attention, focusing on him and persecuting him, accusing him or wrongdoings, wrongdoings he was not at all guilty for, and greatly exaggerating small wrongdoings. He lived under a magnifying glass of sorts, where everything he said and did, or failed to say and do, was negatively focused on, distorted and magnified by his step-mother, leading to very distressing arguments with her.. while his father did not interfere. For 4 years (14-18), he was barely at home, staying away from home while his father did not interfere.

I will now re-read your original post and following posts in light of the above information (I will be adding the boldface feature selectively to the following quotes): “My husband has suffered from depression since I have known him”- I see his depression as very much connected to the powerlessness that he experienced as a child, particularly during the 4 years of the persecution he suffered by his step mother while his father did not interfere. His anger at his step-mother (and possibly at his father) was so intense and prolonged that it.. crashed into depression.

“If I ever approach him with the fact I am feeling insecure and would like a bit more reassurance and love, he takes this an attack on him and emotionally shuts down, being completely incapable of saying anything whatsoever“- he freezes as a result of fear or anger, or both. I imagine that this is how he reacted to his step mother’s repeated, persecutory attacks: he emotionally shut down and was unable to say anything. Why does he freeze when you ask for .. love, I wonder.

“I still find myself having to ask for his love. Ask for a cuddle, ask for a kiss etc. And when he does do it, I feel it’s disingenuous because…  it.. seems half hearted on his side when he does”- when he freezes, he doesn’t feel affection or love. He freezes when you ask for love.

“I feel like, despite clearly outlining my needs (wanting more affection, more love, more reassurance), that he just seems incapable of giving this to me”- he is incapable of feeling affection and love when he freezes. He freezes when you ask for affection and love.

“That night, before he took the dog for a walk, I had that conversation with him where I was crying, and I told him… I just need some more affection from him to help me through this.  He emotionally shut down, said he was going to take the dog for a walk to clear his head, and then didn’t come back”-

– The question is why he repeatedly shuts down/ freezes when you ask for affection. Someone during his childhood inappropriately asked for and perhaps demanded his affection and love. If it wasn’t his emotionally absent mother (?) or his conflict avoidant father (?), then it could have been his step mother.

* About his mother, you wrote: “He had a terrible relationship with his mother, which therapy has led him to realise is the direct root cause of all of his issues. But she wasn’t overbearing with him. She was completely emotionally unavailable, had severe mental health issues of her own”- it could be that she was not always completely emotionally available. It could be that she was affectionate with her boy at times, seeking affection back from him, approaching him as a substitute spouse.

You wrote about his step mother: “They eventually divorced because the stepmother felt like the Dad wasn’t on her side with a lot of the issues she had with my Husband“- it could be that the step mother felt very lonely in the marriage and that she focused her attention on the 14-18 year old boy (later to be your husband) as a source of affection.. in an emotionally incestuous kind of way.

In real-life, relationships are more complex than what’s depicted in cartoons and some movies, the “completely emotionally unavailable” mother is not always unavailable, and the.. evil step mother is not always angry and hostile. She may be both, at different times: showing and seeking affection and turning against her object of affection.

healthline/ emotional incest: “emotional incest, also called covert incest, describes an unhealthy family dynamic where a parent relies on their child for emotional and practical advice and support. Despite the name, it doesn’t involve physical sexual abuse: ‘Incest’ refers to inappropriate emotional closeness”.

Psychology today/ 3 signs you may have suffered childhood emotional incest: “… Lingering effects in adulthood include fear of intimacy and a flight/fight response to closeness…’emotional incest’ (also known as ‘covert incest’) is sometimes used to describe parents who are unable to maintain healthy boundaries with their children. Such parents may be living with mental illness, substance abuse, an unhappy marriage, or divorce. In essence, such parents feel alone and unloved, and rather than seek support from other adults, they turn to their children for intimacy and care. They may burden children with their own needs, constantly seek their validation, become emotionally or psychically clingy, or try to control the child.“-

-it may be that when you ask for affection, his covertly incestuous childhood or adolescence experience is triggered and he freezes in fear and confusion.

Back to psychology today: “Signs of a Problem in Adulthood: Emotional incest leaves a deep scar on a child’s experience of closeness and intimacy; specifically, they struggle in intimate relationships as adults. Signs of enduring this dynamic include: 1. Difficulty sustaining intimate relationships. Your romantic relationships start strong and may have great honeymoon periods. But they tend to decline quickly as emotional intimacy grows. You start to distrust your partner, feel insecure or trapped. 2. Disassociation, confusion, or taking distance from your romantic partner. You start to pull away without explanation. Sex becomes unsatisfying, even revolting. You may grow inexplicably cold, critical, become quick to find fault with them, or blame your partner for your discomfort. 3. Panicky responses to intimacy such as flight or fight. As fear grows, you may invent a reason to stop seeing a partner or ghost them completely. Sometimes you initiate fights to get a partner to break up with you. Either way, you are in flight from the relationship.”

How do you feel about these possibilities?

Back to your recent post: “Are you a licensed therapist? Or just super good at understanding people’s minds and emotions and actions?”- thank you. I am not a therapist. I have been a very active, daily participant in these forums since May 2015, with a break of about 6 months, to this very day, having communicated with many hundreds of members and learning- through these communications such as here with you- about mental health issues, how we get sick and how we can heal best we can.

anita

Dear Seaturtle:

I was just reading through your post before last and I thought to myself; boy, she (you) is so intelligent! and then I thought: I’ll tell Seaturtle what I just thought, so I just did. I’ll be back to you Wed morning when I am more focused and rested (I woke up too early this morning). Good evening and night, high vibrational/ very intelligent Seaturtle!

anita

Dear Lou92:

“He had an overbearing stepmother that ruined the relationship he had with his Dad and treated my husband terribly. He was desperate to get out of there at any given opportunity“- I ask questions because I am trying to understand and hopefully offer you something helpful:

– At what age and for how long was his stepmother in his life?

– Can you give me an example or two of her overbearing behavior?

– Is she still in his life/ still married to his father? And if so, how did the relationship with his father change from being ruined to wonderful?

anita

Dear Lou92:

Welcome to the forums, I’m glad you are here and I hope that you post again.

“I have been in a relationship for 10 and a half years and got married in a couple of months ago… In the months leading up to the wedding, our relationship started showing cracks.  He suddenly became very close friends (very quickly) with a female coworker, where they were texting excessively, morning and night, despite spending all day in the office together… he has never had a female friend in the time I have known him and is now suddenly very close with on“-

– After marriage became a definite plan and six months before the planned wedding, he did something he never did in the 10 previous years: excessively communicate with another woman.

You shared that the last 5 or 6 years of your relationship with this man were “powerful and solid…  I made him feel like the centre of my world, and he made me feel like the centre of his“. But before the wedding and after the wedding, he is: “appearing distracted at home with me and not being as present in the evenings or weekends“, no longer having you in the centre of his world.

“This experience has affected me because this situation was coupled with him appearing distracted at home with me… has led me to the realisation that I have an anxious attachment style due to my Dad..“-

– I think that any woman in your place, having had an attentive man changing into a distracted man who excessively texts another woman, would be anxious regardless of attachment style.

“He still appears distracted at home, he is still talking to this female co-worker much more than I am comfortable with… I get the bare minimum from him these days, and I feel he gives his best self to his colleagues and friends at work and then I get the leftovers. He barely makes conversation with me… I no longer feel like the centre of his world, more like a spare part that is just ‘there’ when he comes home at night“- he is inattentive and distracted with you but attentive to, and focused on this female coworker, and other colleagues and friends at work.

“He said he was just being there for her as she was going through a difficult time and that they were just friends“- maybe his coworker is going through a difficult time and needs a friend, but the same is true to him: he is going through a difficult time and he needs a friend. Unfortunately (I feel sad to be typing this), you are not the friend that he is seeking. The question is why…?

One night, “he took our dog out for a walk at 7pm and didn’t come home until 4am, after being drunk driven home by a friend“- what made him not want to go home to you that night..?

I don’t think that either his depression nor your attachment style explains, by itself, this change in him. I think that the main explanation for the change is the wedding itself. Seems to me that he felt caged-in with you as a result of anticipating the wedding and then following the wedding. Maybe feeling that the marriage was really going to happen, and then it taking place triggered his childhood experience where he was stuck in his original home with an unpleasant or distressing parent or two, older siblings perhaps. Maybe as a child and teenager, he wanted out of the home for a long time. Fast forward, he wants out of the home he shares with you as his wife.

If the possibility above is correct to a large extent, then he is not seeking you as a friend because he sees you as someone unpleasant from in his past. Let’s say that he sees you as his overbearing mother (just an example, I know nothing about his mother/ original family) because he projected his mother into you once the wedding felt real enough. Next, he is trying to survive living with.. his overbearing mother by distracting himself and focusing on life outside the home.

You’ve known him for a long time. Is the above a possibility, Lou92?

anita

Dear Josh:

(I am adding the boldface feature to the following quote): “For a long time I have wondered what self-control really means…  I consider myself… enslaved to my own (instinctual) emotions and impulses… I can understand, know, recognize and think about how what I am doing is wrong, without being able to stop myself from doing it… I am torn about the reason why I cannot trust myself… I procrastinate heavily, normal household tasks are difficult and more personally, I often indulge into internet pornography. These are things I heavily regret during my everyday life… I do not trust myself that I can follow through on what I think is right. I feel as a slave to my own impulses that overwrite any rational thought that I may have”-

– maybe (?)  when you were growing up, Wrong and Right were confused: what was supposed to be Right resulted in Wrong.  For example, let’s say that you were told by your father that hard work is a very positive value (Right), but then you saw him working hard and suffering for it, getting injured or his health suffering (Wrong). Or let’s say, your mother was passive and submissive and your father considered it to be Right, as in her being a good wife, but he repeatedly cheated on her and she suffered for it (Wrong).

Fast forward, you are not motivated to do what’s considered Right (ex., household chores), and instead you do what feels Right in-the-moment (ex., internet pornography).

Anything like that?

anita