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anitaParticipantDear Laven:
Wow! What a read, Laven!!!
No one writes like you. You have a unique, intense way of saying things that make your words penetrate my brain and leave me dumbfounded.
“I loved her.. but I never know how to be appropriate with love and affection. I don’t know how.”- what an honest, bare honest expression.
And how could you be appropriate with love and affection when you never received those outside abuse?
I mean, when a person abuses you, harms you with zero consideration for your mental-emotional health, and that person sometimes expresses affection or touches you softly.. the latter does not erase the former. From my experience- not at all. Any softness or seeming affection in between abuses only complicates things, makes everything twisted and confusing.
“I view myself as an contagion. It is better if people stay away from me. I am a ruin. A ruined artifact. I am a lost civilian of Pompeii. I am the eruption. I am the encasement. I am the display. I am decay. I am grim. I am a reaper… I am the monster”-
(I used to think of myself as all those things- although I didn’t have these words in mind, I wasn’t as articulate as you).
I view you, Laven, as an intelligent, talented writer with a unique way of experiencing and expressing yourself, a way that touches deeply.
There’s a term, Adverse Childhood Experiences.. experiences that harm a child. You had too many of those. They didn’t make you a bad person, a person who doesn’t love.
Back to the quote I started this reply with: “I loved her.. but I never know how to be appropriate with love”-
You loved her. You still do. This doesn’t make you a monster. It makes you human, a person who- against all odds- did not lose her capacity to love. And.. I thank you for that 🙏
I am looking forward to reading part 2.
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear Going Through Life:
It thrills me to know that on the other side of the world, a real-life GTL submitted a post for me.. exactly 8 minutes ago 🙂
My day so far has been, as usual, being in front of the computer, here in the forums.
So Love Marriage vs Arranged Marriage- is it up to you, your choice?
My point is, you desire a loving relationship, and I am wondering if you can take a more active role in making it happen..
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear Peter:
Good to read from you again 🙂
“What if the soul’s freedom is not found in escaping gravity, but in learning the dance between flight and return?… the longing to transcend and the inevitability of return…
“And Layla understood: The soul is not meant to conquer gravity, nor to abandon flight. It is meant to awaken in the rhythm of both, to find the Beloved in ascent and in return.”-
Beautifully written, Peter!
Your post today reminds me of the fantasy movie The Never Ending Story” (1984). I wonder if you saw the movie or read the novel (same title)?
In the movie, Fantasia is a magical world made up of human imagination, dreams, and hopes. Every creature, land, and story in Fantasia is born from the collective dreams and fantasies of humanity. It has no fixed geography or limits — it constantly changes because imagination itself has no boundaries.
Fantasia is ruled by a childlike empress who symbolizes purity, guidance, and the source of Fantasia’s vitality, and is threatened by the Nothing. The Nothing is a force of despair and emptiness that takes over when people lose their imaginations, hopes and dreams.
Talking about “The Mirror of the Moment:- Fantasia isn’t just a fantasy land. It’s a mirror of the human spirit.
When people dream, Fantasia thrives. When people give up hope, Fantasia dies. The story shows that imagination isn’t an escape from reality, but a force that shapes and sustains it.
A couple of quotes by Gmork, a wolf-like creature, the helper of The Nothing:
“Foolish boy. Don’t you know anything about Fantasia? It’s the world of human fantasy. Every part, every creature of it, is a piece of the dreams and hopes of mankind. Therefore, it has no boundaries.”
“Because people have begun to lose their hopes and forget their dreams. So the Nothing grows stronger.”
Having watched it back in 1984, I soared with the characters and scenes into incredible imaginations, conquered gravity (literally getting on a plane and flying across the world for Freedom to be and experience anything I dare to dream and hope for, all inspired by the movie.) The Fall.. well, Falls from the heights of hopes, dreams and imaginations were devastating. I kept recovering somewhat, less each time, until I didn’t anymore. I was depressed and felt hopeless. I Survived but I no longer Soared.
Fast forward, I am back to hoping and imagining and soaring but in the way you described, Peter: Falling isn’t failure; Rising isn’t escape. The soul finds its home- not by rejecting limits or chasing only freedom, but by reconciling both — seeing them as part of one whole, “For in the dance of flight and return, the soul remembers its home.”.
🕊️✨🦅🌤️ Anita
anitaParticipantDear me:
My guess is that she was hurt by the push-pull theme behind your behavior with her, and hurt people sometimes turn angry. Angry, she withdrew. Maybe she is trying to make you care by staying quiet (I don’t know, of course).
It occurred to me yesterday, and I refreshed my mind about the topic this morning (I am curious about what you think about it) that the pattern of push and pull fits the anxious-avoidant (also called fearful-avoidant) attachment style, sometimes called disorganized attachment. It’s a style rooted in both yearning for love and fear of being hurt.
In general, Key Features of Fearful-Avoidant Attachment (online source):
* Push-pull dynamic: You crave intimacy but feel overwhelmed when it gets too close, leading to withdrawal.
* Fear of rejection: Even when someone shows genuine interest, you struggle to believe it’s real.
* Emotional ambivalence: Oscillating between wanting love and fearing it, creating hot-and-cold behavior.
* Difficulty trusting: Past experiences often make you scared of being vulnerable, so you protect yourself by pulling back.
* Longing for connection: Despite the fear, the desire for closeness never goes away, which fuels the cycle of returning after withdrawal.
I wonder if you ever thought about attachment styles..?
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear Tee:
“Sure, I’d never refuse a heartfelt gift (provided that it doesn’t involve potentially self-harmful actions, such as climbing tall mountains with bad knees 🙂 ) Picking wild flowers on gentle slopes is much more acceptable 😂 😊”-
I officially withdraw my offer to climb a mountain 😂
Thank you for your concern and sense of humor (an early first smile for the day). I’ll reply further later.
❤️ 🌻🌹🌷🌺 ❤️, Anita
anitaParticipantHow exciting, Laven, that you posted again!
I will read and reply tomorrow.
Anita
anitaParticipantHmm…GTL: I want to understand better.. What are your real-life options in regard to finding a love-partner- where you’re at, at this time? (will be back to the computer in about 10 hours)
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear Friend Going Through Life:
Late Wed eve here (W.USA)- not where I was born, btw; Thurs morning where you’re at (India..?)
Women still bound by arranged marriage, trying to find a bit of freedom before bound to .. being arranged.?
Anita
anitaParticipantDear Miss L Dutchess:
“in college I’d try to polite and friendly but never genuinely clicked with anyone… At work my colleagues are 20 years older than me and are very different in terms of personalities and interests so we’re cordial but will likely never be close”-
I am close to 40 years older than you, and way.. way removed from college, but you and I can still genuinely click, I have no doubt about it. I am willing. Are you?
I was so disconnected and lonely.. and resentful over it, when I was your age.
Can you and I connect? It can be a healing type of thing, just to share and exchange our individual, genuine, real-life experiences..?
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear q:
The past is a no re-entry zone, as you already know (to one extent or another).
We are in the positions we’re in, and NOW what?
Have mercy on q, sh…sh…Calm that brewing..
Before you move forward- be okay first, be okay with where you’re at.
Q, a human being; Anita, a human being.. No god-perfection among us, us humans..
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantFor whatever it’s worth.. I like you me, I always did.
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantHi.. Dear Alessa 🙂:
I am fine, just posted above. Thank you, Alessa: You are not intruding!!!
Wishing you well.. I really do!
❤️ Anita
anitaParticipantDear Tee:
I read your recent message first thing this morning
“That’s sweet of you to say, but I suggest you better spare your knees – you want to have them working smoothly for decades to come 🙂 But thank you anyway, you’re a sweetheart ❤️”-
This is the first time you referred to me as a “sweetheart” and it brings the first smile to my face today (and it’s almost noon).
Actually, I read that walking uphill is very healthy for the knees because it strengthens the muscles you suggested I should strengthen. Therefore, as if it’d be a win-win, I will climb a mountain for you, and a tall one. just give me the word 🙂
I wrote: “I see the Hope for a New Story. A story breaking away from the old story.” and you replied: “So happy to hear that! ❤️”- In the new story, Tee, I get to be the main character.. huh, and ❤️ is the theme!
“Another inspiring verse from the song: In your hands- The birth of the new day
“A new day, free from the false narrative, embracing the truth of who you really are, not who you mother conditioned you to believe you are… I’m happy that you’re seeing the prospects of that new day and the new story unfolding before you ❤️”-
Yes, Tee, ad reading your response right above strengthens me.
“I just thought slave as in you were her possession, she did with you as she pleased.”- Correct. Zero agency= enslavement.
“I guess I’m not surprised that she hasn’t expressed any concern for you either as a fetus, or as a baby or beyond (specially not something that would indicate a mistake on her part, a lack of care for you). But I’m sorry that no one else mentioned anything, or at least not that you know about it, e.g. your father, or perhaps one of her sisters (although it would be no surprise if her older sister, the one who abused her, didn’t show any concern…).”-
Again, it feels like you were there. your attention to details, what I consider to be your superior intelligence, your insight, your empathy.. All these make me feel this way, that you were there and that I was alone there.
“I guess she grew up in very deprived conditions, with no maternal (or paternal) care. Her older sister – who became her caretaker after the orphanage period (if I remember well) abused her, so again, she received no care and empathy there either.”- You remember correctly.. although I don’t think her oldest sister was a caretaker in any way.
“And so she didn’t have it in her: she didn’t have the capacity for empathy, neither towards herself (which is visible from starving and hating her own body), nor towards others, including her own children.”- correct.
“Oh I see, there was no predictability and no comfort in any aspect of your relationship with your mother. There was nothing to hold on, so to speak, nothing safe. So for you, venturing out to the US wasn’t such a scary idea at all.”- yes, venturing out to the U.S. was running away from the biggest threat I’ve known= the mother.
I’ve said it to myself countless times during the years and decades: I have come across selfish, abusive, heartless people but none- in my personal experience- as threatening and abusive as she has been to me.
Remember the image of her cutting her head off photos? She had cut my head off so many, many times (the relentless, no boundary shaming, humiliating me. She had some discipline in regard to the physical beating (not breaking my bones), but no such discipline in regard to the WORDS she used against me. So, no.. nothing remotely comfortable about being with her.
“I believe a part of it may be that you were a bit dissociated, so you didn’t even think of what might go wrong – you just bought the ticket and off you went, hoping for something better, better than what you had at home, I guess?”-
I was very dissociated. It’s only in the last couple of months or so, that I noticed.. a lack of dissociating. What a relief! The feeling that I wasn’t there, that nothing was happening to me.. that derealization, I think it’s called.
I wrote: “She shot daggers of shame from her eyes to my heart, a big ouch every time.”, and you responded: “Yep, that’s familiar… 🙁”.
She shot daggers at you too.. Covert daggers (the indirect kind), Overt daggers? I am sorry, Tee.. Daggers Hurt, particularly from “”mother””.
“Oh okay. Yes, you said that after she went home (and already during her stay), you felt horrible and fell into despair. You left NYC (and I guess your new husband) and flew to New Orleans, ‘for no particular reason other than hoping for a relief.’ And you stayed there for a while. I guess that’s when he decided to ask for annulment, right?”-
Yes. I don’t remember the extent of my communication with him before or after. It would have been the perfect time for me to have therapy, still in N.Y. That idea never came about.
“Yeah, unfortunately another proof that you could never please her, that you’re never enough, no matter what you do.
“A covert narcissistic mother cannot really accept gifts – she cannot accept an honest gift from your heart – I think because she would need to open her heart and receive your love (a gift being an expression of your love). And she cannot do that: she has to believe that you don’t love her and that it’s only her who loves you. In her twisted mind, she is the one who gives, who loves, while you are the faulty one, the undeserving one, whom she nevertheless ‘loves’ and provides for.
“She gives, you receive, because she believes you’re unable to give, you have nothing to give. That’s I think the twisted reasoning behind the covert narcissistic mother rejecting our gifts. Not sure it’s true, but it might be..”-
As I read this, I remembered.. I REMEMBER, I collected wild flowers for her. I was somewhat excited, looking at the beautiful, multi-colored flowers, anticipating handing them to her and her being happy.
I remember somewhat.. I remember the hit of her anger, her disapproval as I handed her the flowers. She reacted as if I insulted her. What did she say (It was so, so very long ago.. but I vividly remember the flowers sparkling under the spring sun above).
What did she say? .. Something about those flowers meaning nothing because there were so many of them all around, that she could have picked them herself, on her own.
See, Tee, what I mean by it’s like you were there.. You make me REMEMBER.
“I’m glad my experience is helping you ❤️ It took me years to understand this dynamic, it was so insidious. I’ve only started to understand in the last couple of years.. Aah, I feel heavy just thinking about it. But okay, it’s much easier once you understand it and don’t fall for their pity party to easily..”-
Did you give her flowers too.. a gift, gifts.. and she..?
“That’s because I’ve experienced such situations, not in interpersonal relationships, but in everyday life, when I start catastrophizing and thinking of the worse, when there could be a number of other, more benign reasons why something is happening. But fear blinds us to other, more trivial or more benign possibilities, and we only imagine the worst.”-
Even asking the above, I was/ am worried, imagining my questioning would offend you, intrude on you, leading to you withdrawing from me.
“Wow, that’s bad that no one even tried to tell her to calm down. They just took their yelling and screaming without saying a word. What was it that she was upset about? Maybe there was some truth in what she was saying (and that’s why the music teacher felt intimidated?), but the way she was saying it was completely inappropriate.”-
The best I figure, the music teacher- during class- made fun of me, calling me “auntie” (as in me being too serious, too “old” for my age, I figure). Svika, a boy in that class ran the short distance, to tell the mother. She walked there, getting the teacher out of the classroom, while all pupils, all teachers, standing outside, watching.
.. “Mother” should have bonded with the music teacher over making fun of/ humiliating me.. But “Mother” wanted all exclusive rights to humiliating me.
Following the whole fiasco, “Mother” didn’t comfort me, of course.. She was offended by being overshadowed by the teacher..?
“But it can also be that many decent people don’t know how to react in such situations (when they are verbally attacked), and they are kind of shocked and taken aback, and can only gather their thoughts later.”- I imagine there were decent people there.
But none to take me away to safety. Maybe safety was too scarce back then.
“Oh that’s horrible. I think that’s an example of coercive control, which Copilot mentioned in its analysis. She controlled your behavior by threatening to kill herself. She forced you to behave in a certain way by threatening suicide… appalling 😕-
Yes, coercive control, bullying. Cruelty, heartlessness.. Huh, she cut her head off the photos.. Her heart was cut off long before, as in literally No Heart 4 Me.
This is why your “❤️ 🫶 ❤️”, particularly you being a WOMAN means so much for me.
I am forever grateful, never will switch to suspicion and distrust, not when it comes to you, Tee. For sure!
If I brought you 🌼🌻🌹🌷🌺, I know You’d gently take them off my hands, and with a smile, you’d bring them up to your face, smell them, and I’d see your smile extending.. And I’d know I’ve done something good (tears in my eyes).
🌼🌻🌹🌷🌺 Anita
anitaParticipantDear Going Through Life Friend:
Somehow I missed your recent message. I would have answered earlier.
“I have grown very dependent on my friends… including you dear Anita.”- like a song I know says: we are People who Need People. That’s our nature. W are born that way. We can’t help it.. and we shouldn’t try.
Practically, how can you meet a potential romantic partner, GTL? Online dating perhaps? It could be like an interviewing process for you, communicating online with different women, investigating compatibility of goals, values.. before meeting anyone in-person. What do you think?
The 🌞 is shining her, unusually.. I will probably be out and about in an hour or so.
🤍 Anita
anitaParticipantDear q:
I feel like reaching out to you, through this computer screen and hushing, calming the Stressed and anxious q.
“I feel like giving up even though idk what giving up means.”- how about giving up on any and all the pressure you (and others) have placed on you, allowing yourself to just be.. To not earn the right to be calm and in peace, but to just take what’s always been your right: to be calm, to allow yourself peace of mind.
You deserve it, q!
🤍 Anita
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AuthorPosts
Though I run this site, it is not mine. It's ours. It's not about me. It's about us. Your stories and your wisdom are just as meaningful as mine. 