Home→Forums→Emotional Mastery→Being better at accepting depression
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September 9, 2018 at 10:09 am #224805AnonymousGuest
Dear noname:
I am looking forward to reading your recent post attentively and replying to you when I am back to the computer in about 18 hours from now. I read very little of your post of a little while ago. “I hate myself so much..” you wrote; please think well of yourself! I do hope you feel better very soon.
anita
September 9, 2018 at 10:56 am #224813nonameParticipantThanks Anita I will try my best. I notice that sometimes I get exhausted with taking care of myself, and that’s when I fall into despair. It’s 2pm and I haven’t eaten or gotten out of bed. I feel paralyzed by a lack of motivation and purpose.
September 10, 2018 at 3:04 am #224967AnonymousGuestDear noname:
I woke up this very early morning thinking about your post of yesterday. I asked myself what happened since two weeks ago when you felt pretty good. I thought that maybe you started feeling bad then panicked and felt worse. I thought that “Being better at accepting depression” may be about accepting the bad, sort of holding it in your hands, before it grows bigger, before it escalates into depression. Much like one is to do when feeling fear, before it escalates into a panic attack.
Following these thoughts I turned on the computer and spotted the word panic in your 8/27 post. Here it is italicized: “I’m doing well right now… more confident than ever.. I feel or the first time in my life that I love myself… I’m not panicking in the absence of intimacy as I have in the past.. Before when I disliked myself, the panic to find some kind of love and approval felt unbearable, as if I was separated from the pack and left to die. Now … I’m not panicking as much”
Notice your fear, “as if I was separated from the pack and let to die“- fear is very much part of your depression, sort of the primary feeling, the root feeling underneath the depression and it is the force that escalates the sadness/beginning depression into an overwhelming depression.
Yesterday you wrote: “Without any particular reason or event, I find myself slipping back into depression.. I have been feeling disconnected from people again… Specifically the friend I see the most I’ve come to realize doesn’t ever ask about my life…he doesn’t even ask me how I’m doing when he sees me.”
I think the particular event that happened is that you had a thought about that friend, something like: he-doesn’t-ask-me-about-my-life, and that thought was associated with the fear of being separated from the pack and left to die. This fear was in the center of the new storm.
Next came other thoughts and the escalation took place: “I think it’s exhausting for me pretending to be in a good mood for people… could mean I get kicked out of my program, so I have to be on guard….not raise any red flags about my ‘questionable character’ since I’m on thin ice .. for cussing out my supervisor twice”
See the escalation? It all started from a thought about your friend that activated your fear of being alone, of being separated from the pack and left to die (your dominant feeling-experience in childhood, the pack being your family).
As the escalation continued, thoughts about your work with the traumatized kids came into the storm and then you went back to the eye of the storm: “Lastly I’m just lonely”, the feeling-experience of separation.
I think that you need to learn to pay attention to separation-from-the-pack/loneliness thoughts occurring in your brain and hold them in awareness before they escalate into panic, before other thoughts rush in and are added to the mix with more fear, sadness, anger, desperation and so forth.
This is a separate issue from your obvious need for meaningful interactions. “interactions which reciprocate care and intimacy” on a regular basis for you, having such a reliable relationship is a long term goal, as I see it. The short term goal, what you can make progress at today and every day, is to avoid the escalation, as I suggested in the paragraph above.
anita
September 10, 2018 at 6:02 am #224991nonameParticipantThank you for your thoughtful reply Anita. I think your description of escalation is accurate. When I’m sad I feel scared that there will be no one to care for me. The irony is that 4 different friends asked me to hangout yesterday and I declined all of them because I was feeling depressed. I did talk with one friend about it briefly over the phone though. I think the support is there for me because of the work I put in with my friendships. It’s just the one friend im describing that doesent listen is the friend I see the most because I live behind his house, so he frequently uses my space as an escape from his own life, which is fine, but it’s a one sided relationship and I and other friends of his, and his girlfriend bring up this character trait to him all the time but he does nothing about it. The fear there is that he controls my housing and is about to begin renting the house which I live behind, so I’m afraid of having new random neighbors, even though when I moved in he gave me his word he would be living in the house for at least 2 years and it hasn’t even been 6 months. I’m not terrified of having different neighbors, it’s just frustrating because that’s just another relationship I have to manage for the comfort of my living situation, and It shows me I can’t depend on anyone to keep their word. It’s sad too that whenever I confront my friend about anything he tries to walk away, he doesn’t want to hear any truth about himself no matter how it’s delivered. Which leaves me in a state of resentment that I still welcome him into my apt.
I think my depression is a combination of feeling as if I can’t depend on anyone and a recurring feeling of inferiority compared to my peers due to my difficulty being intimate with women. It’s been 3 1/2 years since I broke up with my first gf and I can’t see it happening that any other woman would ever love me, the frustrating part is that my female friends in particular are always telling me I’m a great guy etc. But those comments only make me feel worse about being alone because they feel like lies to me because I stay without intimacy in my life with no relief in sight. I was In a state of mind a couple weeks ago that I would be ok without an intimate romantic relationship, but the sadness, combined with sexual frustration is starting to take it’s toll on my confidence and motivation. I will try not to panic but I’m reaching a point where I haven’t felt unconditionally loved in so long that I don’t if it’s even possible outside myself.
September 10, 2018 at 6:31 am #224997AnonymousGuestDear noname:
I hope there is something more useful about my previous post, that not escalating practice, I think there is a lot there that can help you if you practice it.
Regarding the friend behind whom you live, part of the reason you are friends with him, or all of the reason is that you live behind his house and he promised you that he will not have other people rent that house in the next couple of years. This reminds me of when you shared, if I remember correctly, that you have to be in contact with your father because you use a car he loaned you, and that you have to be in contact with your mother because your sister lives there with her.
My experience is that unless and until our past is resolved enough, we keep re-living it. Your alone life experience and the compromises you make (above paragraph) are the re-living of your childhood experience where you were indeed very much alone and miserable and you had to live with your parents just as you “have to” be in contact with your mother and your father and the man in the house in front.
anita
September 10, 2018 at 1:56 pm #225087nonameParticipantAnita as always you have good insight to offer me. There is certainly a paranoid escalation that goes on in my mind anytime some difficult event happens in my life. Part of it is a fear that if I experience 1 misfortune that a whole host of misfortunes will stem from that, and my worst fear reactivated which is being alienated and completely alone. Paradoxically when this fear of being alone is activated I tend to isolate from people. I’m not sure what to tell myself to slow this escalation besides the awareness you mentioned? I suppose I could try to rationalize, although I find controlling my thoughts doesn’t always calm my anxieties.
I think I isolate for a couple reasons, 1. If I choose to be alone, I am the one in control of my life 2. I don’t want to burden others with my problems out of fear they will leave me.
This is no way to live especially when people care about me and are vulnerable with me yet I truly am not with them out of fear.
I absolutely see the connection with my friend/landlord and my parents i noticed this a while ago. I have to people please in a way to continue to get what I need until i can be %100 financially independent which is less than a year away.
I’m really unsure to do about my need for sex and touch, it truly is becoming depressing and more and more difficult for me to ignore. I think i might be searching for something that doesn’t exist. It just really makes me feel like shit that i can barely have sex a couple times per year now, and its not that women aren’t attracted to me, occasionally i do go on dates via online means or get a number at a bar. But i almost never follow up with the honest belief that if someone likes me there MUST be something wrong with them.
September 11, 2018 at 8:38 am #225179AnonymousGuestDear noname:
Fear is the most powerful emotion there is, the most distressing. I believe I have experienced fear (and still do), no less than you have so far. When I communicate with you about fear, as I am doing right now, I am working on my own fear.
We misunderstand fear when we confuse the order of things: the emotion and the thoughts. We sometimes assume that we think a particular thing and then we feel fear, when in reality, first there was the fear. And then, to confuse things further, there is fear, then thoughts, then fear connected to the thoughts, and the condition of anxiety is established, unfortunately.
Going to the origin of things: you wrote, “my worst fear reactivated which is being alienated and completely alone”. This fear was already materialized, it already happened for you, in your early life, you were already alienated and alone enough to trigger the fear of death in you. We fear it getting worse, but in affect, it was already bad enough.
“Paradoxically when this fear of being alone is activated I tend to isolate from people”. It is not paradoxical when you look at the behavior of other social animals in nature, or even domestic dogs. When they feel that they are about to die, feeling sick, they do isolate themselves. We are social animals, so we do the same.
“I have to people please in a way to continue to get what I need until I can be 100% financially independent which is less than a year away”- not likely to happen: fear doesn’t go away when you make good money. After all, very wealthy people find their lives unbearable because of the same old same old fear.
It will help you to do what is scary for you to do- to stop people pleasing, to stop betraying yourself because you fear that you can not survive without those other people, or that they will retaliate against you. Every time you betray yourself, that is, you submit to others because you fear them, you hate yourself more and the fear stays as strong as ever. It is now that you need to stop this behavior, not later.
When you build that pride in yourself, you will no longer feel that if a woman likes you, “there MUST be something wrong with them”. Instead, you will feel: oh, they noticed that I am likeable. I noticed too!
anita
September 12, 2018 at 4:24 am #225281AnonymousGuestDear noname:
You wrote: “I have to people please in a way to continue to get what I need until I can be 100% financially independent which is less than a year away”.
I wrote in response, referring to your people pleasing as your behavior: “It is now that you need to stop this behavior, not later”.
More about my position on the matter: if there is to be a situation where you will feel 100% financially independent, then there will be no risk to you to stop people pleasing. No risk-> no fear. In this scenario, you did nothing to overcome your fear, to lessen it.
This is why you have to stop people pleasing now, because there is a risk. This is the time.
But in small bite pieces, a bit at a time. A bit, wait and see, then proceed. It doesn’t mean you fight with the man behind whom you live, for example. But you don’t people-please him either. Having gotten to know you over extensive communication on your thread, it is my understanding that this is the way for you to move beyond your long standing state of fear of people and anger at people.
anita
September 12, 2018 at 5:20 am #225287nonameParticipantAnita
I agree with you in regards to people pleasing, I think after setting and upholding boundaries with my parents and work I began feeling more confident a few weeks ago. I am beginning to stop answering texts or the front door for my landlord/friend after a certain time of day because he intrudes on the time I have to myself, and steals the time I use to care for myself because I let him. However I’m realizing now I have every right to do that and it won’t effect my housing, he needs my income and a trustworthy tenant on his property especially if he began to rent out the house to random people.
Some of my depression I believe is also coming from working in the mental health/non profit industry where the people I serve don’t get what they need because of politics, and unskillful employees who contribute to making people’s lives worse when they should be caring and helping. It makes me sad to think I may have very little options upon graduation except to work in these settings for a number of years before I can start my own private practice or non-profit. I feel trapped by my career choice.
I’m not sure if there’s anything you can tell me to help me with attachment pains, no one has really been able to help me through the pain of feeling alone, and having no one to take care of me (except here). I can take care of myself for a while and then I fall into depression when I run out of hope that I will ever have another romantic relationship. I’m beginning to feel abnormal compared to my peers who are married, or have no problem dating or finding sex. I’m beginning to feel unattractive and worthless, and it’s takes me to a bad place mentally where my will is very weak. I still take care of my responsibilities, but I can’t bring myself to make music, or paint, or exercise when I’m alone. Instead I habe just lay in bed not eating all day, in despair confused as to what I’m doing wrong.
Again I want you to know that although I may not always respond directly to your posts I do read them and ‘re read them before I post here. Just in case I’m being redundant.
September 12, 2018 at 6:11 am #225291AnonymousGuestDear noname:
You are welcome to respond when you feel able and willing. Better not people-please me, I wouldn’t like that. So be true to yourself here, answer if you want to, when you want to. You can share with me how you truly feel anytime.
About the mental health industry being dysfunctional, of course it is. Every industry is dysfunctional. Humanity is dysfunctional. Dysfunction is bigger than the home where you grew up, bigger than that neighborhood. It is everywhere. It is nice when we find ourselves at times in this or that exceptional sanctuary where people are kind and fair and functional.
Expect the dysfunctional condition of humanity, don’t get surprised every time you notice it, and then depressed over it. Expect it, do your best in it, make it a tiny bit better, and you won’t be depressed over it.
Regarding sex and such, you wrote earlier that you don’t want sex based relationships, or hookups, is what they are called. You want a loving relationship. Problem in loving relationships is that you have to get to know a woman over time before getting emotionally too involved (so far you haven’t done that part, as far as I know), and you have to let her know you over time, slowly, gradually.
What happened so far, and correct me if I am wrong, is that you were quite impulsive and fast in this area of relationships with women, and you never really got out of your own way (the deep hurt of childhood, the great anger from childhood) so to allow a process of getting to know a woman and making yourself known to her.
anita
September 13, 2018 at 6:44 am #225523nonameParticipantI think I just need attention at this point. I don’t get to really explain my feelings to anyone. Theres never enough time in therapy sessions, and a lot of it is spent discussing my role as a learning therapist. I just need some relief from the pain.
September 13, 2018 at 7:46 am #225533AnonymousGuestDear noname:
I think the problem is that if and when you find a woman to whom you explain your feelings to, and get some much needed attention, you also get angry.
The anger makes it impossible for you to enjoy attention long enough to get that much needed relief. The anger is strong in you, is my understanding.
anita
September 13, 2018 at 11:45 am #225583nonameParticipantI believe I get angry not upon sharing, but when my feelings aren’t kept in mind, such as when people lie or cheat on me. But in the moments where I do get to share with somebody I usually feel a sense of safety, unless I’m becoming distrusting of the person then I might get angry that I attatched myself to the wrong person yet again. I’m not angry at women in general.
I missed work today because I just couldn’t force myself to go help people today when I don’t believe I can even help myself, or be helped. I’m sure I’ve said that before but it feels true, I don’t think anyone can help me feel like my life matters for anything. I feel purposeless a lot and try to just ride it out and go one day at a time, but during hard times I’ve got no one, or no purpose to motivate me to want to keep taking care of myself and keep doing work. I feel hopeless
September 14, 2018 at 5:33 am #225667AnonymousGuestDear noname:
Unless we heal from childhoods that hurt us a lot, a process that takes a lot of time, we keep living the same life experience that we had as children.
“I feel hopeless” just as you felt as a child.
You feel that you “got no one” and that you have to “keep taking care of (yourself)”, having no one to take care of you, just like then.
“I don’t feel like anyone can help me”, just like then, when you were a child, needing help day in and day out and there was no one to help you, so you gave up, believing help is not possible for you.
“I get angry … when my feelings aren’t kept in mind”, just like then. Your feelings were not kept in the minds of your mother and father.
“I get angry.. when people lie or cheat on me”, just like then. Your mother and father said things to you that weren’t true. First you felt good hearing those things, but you soon found out they were not true.
Just like then, when you were a child, you first feel good, “a sense of safety”, but having been lied to by your parents before, the feeling of safety doesn’t last, and you become distrusting and angry (“I’m becoming distrusting of the person then I might get angry”).
Basically, you keep living your childhood experience while being in a grown man body operating in adult life circumstances.
anita
September 14, 2018 at 6:11 am #225679nonameParticipantI hear you. I acknowledge that none of the things im saying are anything new. I just don’t know what to do about my getting my needs met that involve other people. I’m so sick of myself.
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