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  • #358980
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    Good to read that you felt a little bit sad, because you want to be aware of your feelings. I remember that the question: how are you, or how are you feeling? angered me because I didn’t know how to answer it; I wasn’t aware of my feelings.

    I want to tell you were I used to live in the middle east. I am a bit scared though, because it is a public forum and I don’t want to be judged by readers based on where I was born (I feel okay though, I suppose, to say that I am generally from the middle east). Do ask me other questions.

    anita

    #358993
    Murtaza
    Participant

    ok i understand. i want to ask you about my fantasy.

    in the fantasy its never me its someone looks like me because if i be in it i cant fantasize about it. the woman is always older and bigger then me (not physically) more like superior to me. and im just pathetic and weak in her hands.

     

    i was fantasizing about it the other day and i just realized this sound like a mother and a child relationship. its bothers me to think that but i feel im re creating something from the past when i was a child. something i needed and didnt have. although my mother was very loving. or maybe there is other reasons

    what makes me think\feel this way is. i feel like (in the fantasy) i need her just as the child needs his mother. to nurture me and give me her love and affection and to cuddle me. in the fantasy i am never in a relationship with that person im just someone who she cares for and like. i actually never fantasize being in a relationship. i just fantasize about this. and i feel very vulnerable and weak and i really like that.

    perhaps im wrong and i just like to feel weak and pathetic in front of someone i love because i like them when they feel sorry for me (at least in the fantasy) cause (in the fantasy) they give me more love and attention. and i also like to feel sorry for myself.

    #358994
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    If only I could change the way you feel about yourself, you will not feel inferior to anyone! I know how it feels, I felt inferior most of my life and it was a terrible feeling. And it was not true: I was not inferior even though I felt that way, even though I believed it.

    “the woman is always.. superior to me”- what if you knew that no woman is superior to you..?!

    “this sounds like a mother and child”- adult romantic relationships very much parallel parent-and-child relationship. The parent, usually the mother-child relationship, sets the pattern for adult romantic relationships.

    “It bothers me to think that but I feel I’m re-creating something from the past when I was a child”- this is most often the case, not unique to you.. nothing you invented, nothing bizarre or abnormal.

    “something I needed and didn’t have”- we develop a craving for what we needed so desperately and didn’t get enough of, as children.

    “in the fantasy.. I need her just as the child needs her mother, to nurture me and give me her love and affection and to cuddle me.. someone who she cares for and likes”- I can very much relate to your fantasy. Nothing sweeter, nothing more fantastic than a child (who is naturally weak), to be liked and protected, held and loved by someone strong.

    “I also like to feel sorry for myself”- there is nothing wrong with feeling empathy for yourself, someone should feel empathy for you, might as well that somebody be you. I feel empathy for you too. It’s not a feeling of viewing you as inferior, as in: poor her, it must be terrible to  be her. No, it is a feeling of: I know how it feels to be alone and lonely, and believing one is inferior. I know how it feels, and I wish you didn’t suffer this way.

    I will be away from the computer for about an hour and a half, hope to read from you when I am back, or anytime you want to write back to me. I want to read more and more from you.

    anita

     

     

    • This reply was modified 5 months, 2 weeks ago by anita.
    #359000
    Murtaza
    Participant

    If only I could change the way you feel about yourself, you will not feel inferior to anyone!

    <p style=”text-align: left;”>I don’t know if i feel inferior to others because i don’t think there is freewill therefore we are all the same. If someone is better then me its just because he had better environment/parents/genes. But that just my opinion. But i might still feel inferior because people always look small of me.</p>
     

    what if you knew that no woman is superior to you..?!

    Then i wouldn’t be able to fantasize. I want to think that there is a women who is stronger then me. Cause im weak and i don’t know anything about life tbh. Its just so attractive to me to see a strong independent woman. I guess i used the wrong wording (sorry not very good at English).

     

    I guess its something has to do with my old relationship with god. Since im an atheist now and i heard that people who leave religion maintain this relationship they had with god. I feel like i have a small pieces. Maybe im overthinking. But i always wanted this kind of person who i would listen to. To be “good boy” to. Maybe its the effect of being the good kid in my childhood. Im sorry if im mixing btween topics

     

    I can very much relate to your fantasy. Nothing sweeter, nothing more fantastic than a child (who is naturally weak), to be liked and protected, held and loved by someone strong.

    I always felt so selfish for wanting this because what about the woman. What she gets ? And this is really hard to find especially in a place like the middle east. I can’t imagine having this in real life or anything near this.

     

    there is nothing wrong with feeling empathy for yourself, someone should feel empathy for you, might as well that somebody be you.

    I always thought that. That im the only who cares about me enough to feel sorry for so why is it so bad when people talk about it.

     

    I feel empathy for you too.

    Thank you. You are a very beautiful person

    #359002
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    And thank you for saying that! I read your recent post, and see where you explained what you meant by fantasizing about a superior woman, superior being a good thing, in the context of your fantasy. I am not focused enough this later afternoon, so I want to return to your thread tomorrow morning, which is in about 14 hours from now. Please be good to yourself.

    anita

    #359042
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    “I don’t think there is freewill therefore we are all the same”- I don’t understand this sentence.

    When I refer to human equal worth (vs superiority and inferiority), I don’t mean that every person is the same. Some people are taller than others, stronger than others, wealthier than others, etc., etc., etc. What I mean is that every person has the same human value, that every person (regardless of physical look, physical strength, skin color, race, ethnicity, gender, wealth, etc.) should be treated respectfully and fairly,  and not as a person being worth less than another/ deserving less than another.

    You wrote that in your fantasy you need to see a woman who is stronger than you, superior to you in strength, “a strong independent woman” while you are “just pathetic and weak in her hands”, and she cares for you, gives you “more love and attention”, and guides you in this life.

    You wrote that you are an atheist and that maybe you long for that strong and independent woman as a god, needing her to guide you in this life because you need to be guided. You want to do what she says, and be a “good boy”.

    You wrote earlier: “even if I find the woman (which in the middle east gonna be really hard).. there is 100 things that will come between me and the fantasy”, and yesterday you wrote about your fantasy woman, “this is really hard to find especially in a place like the middle east”-

    – you mean that it is very difficult to find a strong and independent woman in the middle east, that all young women where you live are weak and dependent?

    There is  nothing wrong, Murtaza, for a boy or a man to feel weak. Boys and men are not different from women: they feel fear just the same, they feel weak just the same. It’s just that society disapproves of boys and men showing fear and weakness. But approved or disapproved, every boy and man on the face of the earth feels fear and weakness.

    anita

     

     

     

    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by anita.
    #359061
    Murtaza
    Participant

    “I don’t think there is freewill therefore we are all the same”- I don’t understand this sentence.

    because i dont think there is freewill and we are determined by the cards we have such as (parents\environment\genes etc). so no one is better then the other, we are all the same. we just had different cards, i was just unlucky to have such life, its not either my fault or my parents or anyone really.

     

     and not as a person being worth less than another

    i understand. i always get treated like that. because i have this lifestyle (not having a job). people treat me as less. this is one of the reasons i don’t like people. i just don’t want anything to do with people anymore.

     

    you mean that it is very difficult to find a strong and independent woman in the middle east, that all young women where you live are weak and dependent?

    not all but most of them. at least from what i saw. but i didn’t mean they are weak and dependent, they just have the basic idea of  relationships. the one where the “man” have to be a man. the one that society tells them about. and to be honest i just hate it. i hate society and everyone that follows it. perhaps hate is a big word. but i just want nothing to do with this society and its people. i just hate the fact that most females doesn’t like me. in fact i feel they would feel Disgust when they know me. and  i dislike when i see a weak females not because she is weak but because i know i cant fulfill her needs. just telling a female that i don’t have a job she would respect me less. in fact she wouldn’t respect me at all.

     

    this is not just insecurity. i like myself i think that im good person. im weak and its fine. i actually like being weak for some reason. this is just the truth. at least from what i see. i always try to be truthful to myself. even when i do hate myself sometimes i still know the truth. that i am an all right person understanding and nice. if there was the right person i think we might get along fine.

     

    There is  nothing wrong, Murtaza, for a boy or a man to feel weak. Boys and men are not different from women: they feel fear just the same, they feel weak just the same

    i know that. its just frustrating to know that i cant be who i am. the part of me that only lives in the fantasy.

    #359069
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    You believe, if I understand correctly, that we people do not have free will, that what happens in our lives is determined only by our genes, the parents we happen to be born to, the environment, etc., and not at all by our choices.

    “no one is better than the other”, means that we are all automatic reactions to our environment, we choose nothing, and therefore we are all worth the same as automations, automatically reacting to circumstances outside our control.

    And because we are all automations, no one is at fault for anything (“I was just unlucky to have such life, it’s not either my fault or my parents or anyone really”).

    You wrote that you like yourself, that you think that you are a good person, that you are okay with being weak, that you even  like being weak. What you dont like, and even hate, is that other people think of you as an inadequate man because you dont have a job, and women think of you as an inadequate man because you like (the idea of) being weak and acting weak in the company of a woman.

    Am I understanding you correctly?

    anita

     

    #359077
    Murtaza
    Participant

    You believe, if I understand correctly, that we people do not have free will, that what happens in our lives is determined only by our genes, the parents we happen to be born to, the environment, etc., and not at all by our choices.

    i dont believe that. i think that. based on prove and evidence based on logic and Science. of course i might be wrong. but i just haven’t seen any prove that free will exist. of course i dont use the non existing of free will as an excuse. i was always a truth seeker i guess. but i feel like im boring you about that freewill thing. it wasnt my intention to talk about it in the first place i know its a sensitive subject.

     

    You wrote that you like yourself, that you think that you are a good person, that you are okay with being weak, that you even  like being weak. What you dont like, and even hate, is that other people think of you as an inadequate man because you dont have a job, and women think of you as an inadequate man because you like (the idea of) being weak and acting weak in the company of a woman.

    Am I understanding you correctly?

    yes.

    by the way i know nothing about you and i feel like i cant ask because you arent comfortable to share about yourself but thats alright

    #359078
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    The topic of free will is not boring to me. We can talk about it, and you can ask me questions about myself. I do have .. the free will or free choice to answer your questions or not.

    And you have the free will and choice whether to ask me or not, whether to answer my questions or not.

    Isn’t this proof that indeed we have free will?

    (I will be back to the computer in a few hours from now).

    anita

    #359079
    Murtaza
    Participant

    Isn’t this proof that indeed we have free will?

    well no. thats the illusion of free will. but thats my opinion really.

     

    and you can ask me questions about myself

    i dont know what are you comfortable sharing

     

    I want to ask you about something. why do you think i like to act weak and pathetic around a woman ? . i asked myself that and the only answer was because its lovely

    #359107
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    You wrote: “why do you think I like to act weak and pathetic around a woman? I asked myself that and the only answer was because it’s lovely”-

    – if I understand correctly what you mean by “lovely”, then you like to act weak an pathetic around a woman because if feels good to you. You wrote earlier that your fantasy (cuddling with a strong woman) makes it possible for you to sleep at night, meaning the fantasy relaxes you and makes you feel good enough to go to sleep.

    I wish you felt relaxed and good more often than you do; I wish you believed that you have some freedom of choice (not all the freedom because, like you suggested, there is a whole lot about our lives that we don’t choose).

    anita

     

    #359127
    Murtaza
    Participant

    I always felt shame in my life for different kind of reasons. I don’t now (i guess a little about being unemployed). It was strong before tho. I guess im used to it. So i just want to feel shame with someone i love i want her to hurt me in someway so i can be helpless with her and need her more. I fantasize sometimes about being fucked by someone i love. Its not sexy but rather satisfying. Just to the humiliation that a woman fucks a guy comforts me. I guess because i always was in a battle to be a man and act like a man. Its like i can finally let my guard down. And just be who i am. I weak helpless guy. Who crave for love and nurture. Maybe i want to feel shame because i want to recreate it and have someone with me this time to comforts me. What do you think? I don’t know to be honest about a lot of stuff.

     

    I wish you felt relaxed and good more often than you do

    I do. Im very chill person actually. i just sound like i am in pain where actually i live very comfortably. I just like to talk about those stuff because i feel vulnerable. And its also my favourite thing to talk about. Besides philosophy. I have an ok life and im fine with it.

     

    I feel bad because im wasting your time to be honest. I know im not gonna do anything about these stuff and im just taking your time and energy. I like talking to you cause you really pay attention to what i say. You also sound very wise and i like that.

    #359152
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    “I feel bad because I’m wasting your time to be honest. I  know I’m not gonna do anything about these stuff and I’m just taking your time and energy”.

    Yes, is quite evident to me that you don’t plan on doing anything about anything. You expressed it before: “I’m 20, I live with my family… I have no job and I was student and dropped out. I actually dropped out living as a whole.. cause I simply don’t like life. I lived it and saw nothing worth living or fighting for.. I got my father’s retirement, so I don’t need money.. I don’t think I will ever change my mind about life.. I don’t care about myself to try to ‘fix it’.. either way I’m going to die so why  not make it an easy life for myself.. to suffer less till the end.. not doing anything”.

    You also wrote: “what woman will ever love a person like me?.. I can’t make people love me… they (women) would feel Disgust when they know me”.

    About your fantasy, you wrote: “I feel like.. I  need her just as the child needs his mother, to nurture me, and give me her love and affection and to cuddle me.. I’m just someone who she cares for and likes”.

    Here is a very telling sentence that you wrote earlier: “I don’t think I will ever change my mind about life, unless I see something worth living”-

    – it is clear that the “something worth living”, for you, is to be loved, that’s what your fantasy is about. Yes, it is also about shame and vulnerability and whatnot, but in its core, your fantasy is about “love.. affection.. someone who cares for” you, just as you worded it yourself.

    So, are you wasting my time? I don’t know. Lots and lots of my time was wasted, most of my life was wasted, really. We have that in common: you are wasting your life now, at 20, and I wasted way more than 20 years of my life!

    anita

    #359232
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    Please do what it takes to get away from and protect yourself from people who hurt you, and please, do all that you can to be a good person, good to yourself and good to other people. Please move away from the attitude of hating all people and selectively, turn toward love and away from hate.

    anita

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