Dear Nia:

Welcome back! We communicated at length in your previous thread from Feb 24- Oct 1, 2020. I just read through our communication back then. If I have it right, you are married now for just over 10 years and have a 3-year-old child.

Today, you shared, best I understand, that Dona, your best friend from childhood, whose parents helped you and treated you well, recently ostracized you from the group of friends on social media because you didn’t visit her or her parents, in-person, for years (since Covid-19) even though you live in the same town.

“I feel not good of that.. because I think I was wrong because didn’t visit them… I am surprised she said bad thing on group about me… What should I do Anita..? Is that relationship makes conditions should be have a routine meet? Is that Dona have a toxic issues also?“- I am sorry that you were ostracized from the group of friends.

It is possible that Dona has toxic issues. Lots of people do. But I understand why she’d be troubled by the fact that you didn’t visit her, and particularly her parents (who were good to you) even though you live in the same town.

I wonder what bad things she said about you..?

“And is that problem on me? I think I have some isolation issues also and I’m introvert“-I wonder if you didn’t visit Dona or her parents because of some form of social anxiety (being nervous to be with people in-person), and on top of it, anxiety born during Covid-19, when being around people in-person was considered physically dangerous?

“And what should I do with her parents? I still feel guilty  because their kindness is really valuable for me. I don’t know either how to repay them..“- did her parents or Dona accuse you of not being grateful to them? What kind of communication have you had with her parents in the last few years and recently?

anita

Dear Paradoxy:

I am the one adding the boldface & italic feature selectively to the quotes in this post): “My father is a pro in speaking the truth in such a logical way that he is able to prove everyone wrong. It is not mere convincing, he is able to use evidence and logic in such a clear form that you cannot argue with logic... he is actually PROVING that his stance is right. If it was mere persuasion, people would still be able to argue with him. But he shuts everyone up with pure logic. It’s like he can PROVE that 2+2=4 instead of 5 and nobody will go against it cause they know he is right…

“The inconsistencies occur because the lifestyle I grew up in is more complex… too complex for me to explain… I am able to argue back against the advice given because… I expected solutions that I have not already thought of but I keep getting answers that I am already aware of“-

– are you aware of the topic of the use of logic vs the abuse of logic? Here is one book that addresses this topic: “How to Win Every Argument: The Use and Abuse of Logic“. Here is another, “Crimes Against Logic..“, and another, “The Thinker’s Guide to Fallacies: The Art of Mental Trickery and Manipulation“.

From the third: “The word ‘fallacy’ derives from two Latin words, fallax (‘deceptive’) and fallere (‘to deceive’). This is an important concept in human life because much human thinking deceives itself while deceiving others. The human mind has no natural guide to the truth, nor does it naturally love the truth. What the human mind loves is itself, what serves it, what flatters it, what gives it what it wants, and what strikes down and destroys whatever ‘threatens’ it… When we look closely at human decisions and human behavior, we can easily see that what counts in human life is not who is right, but who is winning. Those who possess power in the form of wealth, property, and weaponry are those who decide what truths will be trumpeted around the world and what truths will be ridiculed, silenced, or suppressed…

“The human mind… achieves insights and fabricates prejudices. Both useful truths and harmful misconceptions are its intermixed products. It can as easily believe what is false as what is true… It can love and hate. It can be kind and cruel. It can advance knowledge or error. It can be intellectually humble or intellectually arrogant. It can be empathic or narrow-minded. It can be open or closed. It can achieve a permanent state of expanding knowledge or a deadening state of narrowing ignorance… How can humans create within their own minds such an inconsistent amalgam of the rational and the irrational? The answer is self-deception. In fact, perhaps the most accurate and useful definition of humans is that of
‘the self-deceiving animal.’… Every culture and society sees itself as special and as justified in all of its basic beliefs and practices…

“It is not possible to create an exclusive and exhaustive list of fallacies… It is common for people (in their thinking) to: … fail to notice contradictions... use only the information that supports their view… fail to notice their assumptions.. lack insight into their prejudices…”-

– fascinating, isn’t it?

anita

Dear Ben: I am looking forward to read and reply to you Sat morning (my time, 11 hours from now, approx.)

anita

Dear Lorelei Firefly:

I read your whole post: inspiring! I hope that other members read it as well. Thank you so much for sharing your story, encouraging and inspiring others who struggle.

I want to quote some of what you shared and comment on it: “I started feeling this… Dread every time I had to go to work. It got to the point where I just couldn’t do it anymore. I would cry before work because I knew I had to go in. So I quit. Ended up getting a job I really liked, working at the zoo… it was fun and unique to get to take a trip to the Zoo for free every day. Until the dread started again. This time, though, it started extremely soon… Only 2 weeks in. The dread and stress got too much again so I eventually quit that job too… Then I came across a job that made me feel like it was my calling: Pet play specialist at a pet daycare. Yes, it was as fun as it sounds. All day I got to play with dogs and cats and get paid for it! It was and still is the best job I have ever had… I felt so lucky because I felt that THIS is where the universe was trying to lead me… But I was wrong because after only about 2 weeks, the dread returned… I sat on my bed in my work clothes, and I just couldn’t make my feet go towards the door. I couldn’t get up, I couldn’t move… I never made it to work that day and I never went back. I cried so much that day because what was wrong with me? Everyone I talked to, even my psychiatrist, just wasn’t able to understand…“-

– this is an excellent testimony for anyone with (internal) anxiety, such as is involved in the condition of ADHD, who are looking for an external solution, such as getting just the right job, living in just the right location (city, country), marrying just the right person… and all will be well.

In reality, it takes both internal and external problem solving and work so to function better in life (such as being able to hold on to a job).

Reading your testimony makes me understand better that although my nervous system was indeed damaged by decades-long anxiety, it is not completely damaged, and a good part of it can be helped and improved: some healing can be done.

“My resilience while working has NOTICEABLY improved. Enough to make a difference… There has even been days where I just felt like sitting in my car and crying. But I still went to work“- congratulations, and please keep doing what is working for you, and finding new ways to help yourself, when needed.

Again, thank you, and I hope to read more from you on this topic or any other, anytime, if you feel like posting.

anita

Dear antarkala:

“It was someone in my extended family… It all suddenly stopped once I hit puberty in my 8th grade“- I hope that this someone in your extended family doesn’t get the opportunity to do to others (other pre-pubescent girls, perhaps) what he did to you. If there is something you can do to protect others from him, I hope that you do what needs to be done.

“I never talked about it to anyone before that but it is only these days I am slowly opening up with my closest friends and I am realizing the intensity of what happened day by day. I don’t think I gave it a name of sexual assault until then… it was for at least a year or more“- keep talking about it, bring it further to the light, as slowly as you need it to go about it.

“As I said, my mother does not know. She just in general says I am too sensitive and overreact to things. This especially happens when I tell her how hurting it feels when my dad criticizes me or when I tell her how my father and grandparents are proud of everything my brother does because he is a guy, how they treat me in front of him as if I am nothing, and that I do not feel respected enough or seen enough or encouraged enough“- it is not true that you are too sensitive and that emotionally you over react.  I know that your mother is wrong on this point even though she’s known you for 25 years, and I’ve known you for only 5 days. Your reaction to your early life experiences is proportional to the experiences.

Adults often forget how they felt growing up, how very sensitive they were (all young children are). So, they unrealistically expect children to be less sensitive than they themselves were as children/ adolescents.

“When I tell her I feel a little different from everyone, that I feel things too deeply and sometimes wonder if I have depression and I am unable to do basic things in life and feel very under-confident – she tells me I am overreacting and too sensitive and should just have more will power and try harder to be more disciplined and achieve the things I want in life“- she is right about the benefit of a strong will-power and self-discipline. If she validated your sensitivity (as being proportional/ appropriate to your life-experiences growing up, she would have strengthened your will-power and self-discipline. She means well, and she’s partly right, partly wrong.

“She never said no to therapy though – she said if I wanted to go, she will support me“- a good thing!

“Completely, yes! I am that friend/ confidant of her. She shares everything with me. I started supporting her as I grew up and pushing her to stand up for herself and even stood up against my dad and my grandparents demanding she should be treated better for everything she does for the family. She gradually started doing that… She always tells me she feels blessed to have a daughter like me and she cannot imagine her life without me“- yes, indeed, your mother is blessed to have you as a daughter. I feel empathy for your mother and appreciation for her resilience through the years, as well as for her work as a teacher. I’m sure that she benefited many children over the course of her career.

Unfortunately, there is a problem here (in the paragraph I quoted right above) that needs to be addressed: it’s not a good thing for a child/ adolescent to be placed in, or to be encouraged to fill in the role of an adult. A child needs to be a child while the adults take care of adult things. A parent is supposed to confide with the other parent/ other adults, not with their child.

It is not the child’s job to teach her mother to stand up for herself, it’s the other way around: it’s the mother/ parent’s job to teach the child. So, what happened in your childhood and adolescence was role reversal, in this regard. A child needs to feel safe at home, as in being with parents who know how to take care of themselves (and of the child). When that’s not the case, the child feels anxious.

“I once remember during an argument I threw a glass of water at my mother’s face in front of my whole extended family and to this day I don’t know why I did that and I cannot get that image out of my head“- you were angry at her. It is difficult to be angry at your mother, isn’t it? It made me feel very guilty when I was angry at my mother. Maybe you were angry at her for not taking care of herself, for not standing up for herself…?

“My school teacher once described me as a lady don to my dad and I once remember one of my teachers telling me my walk is too manly“-

– I had to look up “lady don” (online): “This phrase is often used to describe a woman who possesses qualities traditionally associated with masculinity, such as confidence, assertiveness, and a commanding presence”.

Seems to me, antarkala, that your role reversal situation was that of you being your mother’s.. father, teaching her to stand up for herself, to act confidently and assertively, a parenting job traditionally done by the father in the family. Your mother was.. femininely weak, passive (a traditional female role) and you, for the purpose of helping her/ strengthening her, took on the manly traditional role. So much so, that you even walked in a manly way.

This is how much you loved her and needed her to be strong.. not yet strong yourself, you took on that role.

“(I) could never relate to girls having crushes…  The concept of having kids never appealed to me”– this is congruent with your masculine/ manly role taken so to help your mother.

On March 25, you wrote in regard to your boyfriend: “Initially, I did get thoughts like ‘maybe he is not strong enough’… “I don’t think he is manly enough’“- what this is telling me is that you need to..  finally not be The Strong One, to.. finally have someone else be the strong one, so that you can relax.

Is that what it is?

anita

Dear Lorelei Firefly:

“what made me want to reply was actually a reply by another person. Someone named Anita. They mentioned something about intense long term anxiety damaging the nervous system..“-  this is me, the anita you referred to. I would like to attentively read your post and reply tomorrow, Thurs morning (it’s Wed evening here)

anita