February 11, 2021 at 4:24 pm #374508
Well he cheated on me, he flirted with that girl and that girl came into our house knowing that I exist. I was at the office every single day so he managed to do this. He says that he was only trying to ‘feel something’. It didn’t work and I just tried to get some attention. He says that he was not sincere at all. Although he is on another medication and he was asleep the whole time. I sneaked into his phone after he slept just to send myself the number of the old psychologist of his, and then I snapped. I read everything and then woke him up. He couldn’t do anything much and tried to make me sleep as well, trying to delay the talk for later when he is not under influence of some medications.
I honestly don’t know what to do, I feel sad about him and me. If I want him to move out, then I’ll be feeling upset about him living in someplace worse, crashing at a sofa somewhere or smt like that. I will be missing him too much, I sometimes saw him like a caregiver to me, he behaved like this. But other than that, I’ll be a complete wreck tomorrow at my shift since it’s way past my bedtime and he sleeps very well, I guess. It’s because of the medications, though.
I don’t know, I cannot even tell this to my friends. I don’t know what to do. I feel like I must look for some self-respect. My fears, abandonment issues are all freaking out and fighting with the self-respect. I even got a box Valentine’s Day gift for him today and planned this dinner thing in my head. I feel, Idk, burnt out. I feel empty, shocked, I’ve been cheated on before. Several several times, but the thing is, I feel bad because he was able to care for her. I guess he just played her, so that might not be a real intimacy at all. I have absolutely no idea what to do at this point, I would chose to just stay in bed and sleep for days and not decide for a while. But I have to get up in 3 hours and try to make my eyes look better because of all the swelling crying will cause.February 11, 2021 at 4:39 pm #374509
He tried to support me every time, even when I didn’t need it. He is still trying to do so while he is under influence. I’m not sure how will I be able to let go of this. I desperately need this support to stay alive.February 11, 2021 at 8:54 pm #374511
I will be able to read and reply to you in about 12 hours from now.
anitaFebruary 11, 2021 at 10:08 pm #374514
I also feel like I’m in denial as well. I wish this never happened cause I’m not sure how to make a radical decision. His behaviors are just some trials to feel alive. He wants to be dead almost every second. I’m sure when he wakes up (I won’t be home ofc) he’ll remember what happened at night and he’ll want to kim himself. I doubt he’ll do that. But I know he’ll feel terrible for making me cry again. Also I’ve never felt dumbed because of being cheated on before, this is the first time I feel dumbed.February 12, 2021 at 8:24 am #374526
A little background: you’ve been living with your boyfriend for a year. At one time, while living together, he looked into your computer records and found some photos and messages between you and ex boyfriends, and he started to obsess about those photos and messages, feeling tormented.
In August 2020, he wanted to break up with you “because he is sick of himself for harming me emotionally”. in December 2020, he wanted to break up with you again because “he’s harming me, himself, physical objects as well”.
On December 30, 2020, he was “considering having an affair or flirting with another person just to stay alive”. He told you that he “wants to be by my side but he also needs stuff to try to feel alive. He is sure that he still loves me. But considers all the stuff I did with my ex-boyfriends (such as camping…) as ‘living’. And he thinks that he didn’t do any of those in the past, so he feels left-alone”.
Less than two months later, Feb 10 or 11, 2021, you found out that he cheated on you, “he flirted with that girl and that girl came into our house.. I was at the office.. He says that he was only trying to ‘feel something’. It didn’t work.. he was not sincere at all”, and you cried a lot, just as you cried every time he wanted to break up with you (“I have to get up in 3 hours and try to make my eyes look better because of all the swelling crying will cause”, Feb 11).
In December last year, you wrote that he mentioned that he might have Borderline Personality Disorder, that he read about it and it fit. You then read about it and compared the symptoms you read about with his behavior. You wrote that “a single word can change his mood enormously”, that he “doesn’t know what he wants.. he questions that so much that he decides he just doesn’t want to exist.. dwelling on that indecisiveness”, that he is “very much” acts impulsively, self-harms and has suicidal feelings. Previously you shared that while living with you, he tried to commit suicide/ made suicidal gestures repeatedly, was hospitalized following one of those attempts, and that he is been put on various psychiatric drugs.
Your very recent thoughts and feelings: “I don’t know what to do… My fears, abandonment issues are all freaking out and fighting with the self-respect.. I feel, idk, burnt out.. empty, shocked.. I desperately need this support to stay alive”, and you figure that “his behaviors are just some trials to feel alive. He wants to be dead almost every second. I’m sure when he wakes up.. he’ll want to kill himself. I doubt he’ll do that. But I know he’ll feel terrible for making me cry again”.
My current thoughts and feelings:
(1) He is angry at you from time to time for having had relationships with other men before him. He obsesses about it, seeing images of you with this or that man as if they were happening now. I am guessing that he wanted to get even with you by being with another woman now, to .. kind of balance the unfairness of you being with another man with him being with another woman.
(2) I am guessing that in addition to being angry at you, he also feels guilty for hurting you, feeling responsible for you crying a lot. And then.. maybe he gets angry at you for feeling responsible for your pain.
(3) He is far from being mentally healthy. No woman can have a healthy relationship with a man who “wants to be dead almost every second”, a man who is very impulsive and suicidal.
(4) On Oct 2020, you started this thread choosing the title: “I’m addicted to nostalgic feelings and it only makes me feel worse, I guess”. In your original post, you shared about the nature of the nostalgic feelings: “a longing I may say. I thought that was the feeling of loneliness, yearning for a sincere love or affection“.
In June 2019, you wrote regarding the boyfriends in your life: “I pick whomever that I can get affection from. I crave affection, not the person… my anxiety appears when I don’t get that affection”.
Today, I am suggesting to you that you are addicted to getting affection from a boyfriend. It doesn’t matter who the boyfriend is. When you are in a relationship, and the boyfriend expresses affection for you- you feel relatively okay. But when you are separated from a boyfriend’s affection (he withdraws from you emotionally)- you feel very bad.
When a boyfriend breaks up with you- you go through severe withdrawal symptoms: “Between the relationships, there was always suffering, mental breakdowns. I simply didn’t want to continue my life in those moments” (June 2019).
No wonder then that you never took the initiative to end a relationship before, no matter how bad the relationship was and no matter how bad your current relationship is. Like I suggested before, and you agreed: you suffer from severe separation anxiety. You are afraid of being separated from your drug= a boyfriend, afraid of the withdrawal symptoms that follow separation.
You wrote yesterday that you “desperately need this support to stay alive”, referring to your boyfriend’s support/ his affection. You desperately need your drug.. to stay alive. That’s how a drug addict who is separated from his drug feels.. desperately needing it to stay alive, and therefore, he/ she will do anything to get another dose of that drug.
Is this how you feel?
anitaFebruary 13, 2021 at 9:06 am #374610
It sounds like me, yes. I can actually look for some addiction relief methods as well. Yesterday, I got off from work and he did shopping for the house like we were going to live together. Then we talked, and talked for hours, till we sleep. I told him that we could decide for us slowly. I also showed him some of my messages from friends about him. One friend actually suggested that I could give an ultimatom saying ‘whether you get a decent therapy, maybe including a rehab or you’ll be losing me’. He liked this idea and told me that he never wants to lose me at all. And he suggested this ultimatom:
“whether this goes on and i’ll get a therapy and also a new house, or not..”
This ultimatom was doable for him I guess. He saw these conditions applicable since he was faced with the concept of ‘losing me’. However, I was the little girl from my childhood. I kept thinking about how I’ll be missing him, how it will be terrible to see his room empty, how it will be terrible to come home after work and not eat dinner with him. He actually taught me so many things about love, in the end. That’s why this is so different from my other relationships. He was like a caregiver, like I said. He is, when not influenced by any episodes or neurosis, someone capable of loving people. He can grasp that our souls matter more than any other thing. He cares for the people for who they are, such a loving person. And maybe that’s the reason why he was so damaged. I would sincerely wish that everybody in this world became like him. Then, it would be possible to trust everyone. It might sound weird for me to say these stuff for someone that cheated on me but I really mean these. And I feel like there won’t be anybody else like him again, I feel like I won’t be able to trust anybody. I can clearly see how men act and how cruel and selfish people are especially in today’s world.
So right now, he is thinking to handle the last finals he has for a few days, the most. And then he’ll stay at his friends’ just to not waste any time and be done with this separation thing. He genuinely still loves me and he is not bad right now. But he believes that a neurosis will happen again and when that happens, he won’t be upsetting me anymore. So he’ll stay at some friends’ house, then go back to his hometown for a while and then maybe he’ll find a house when he comes back. But this upsets me, because he’s willing to do all these kinds of stuff, including having some financial problems as well to give me a break. This breaks my heart and I cannot imagine how will I be when he does and leaves, being uncomfortable at some sofa he doesn’t like and this feeling is really familiar. I’m feeling really guilty for someone that loves me. I’m feeling really guilty for something they did, just because their sincere love towards me.
I guess it was like 9 years ago, when I was in 7-8th grade. I was in summer break and my mom used to work for really long hours. I was spending my whole time on the computer and didn’t move much then. She used to get up in the morning, go outside and get me some breakfast stuff, like little newly cooked pastry from the same place and get back home. She used to go outside after giving me the pastry and then she’ll head to work. This cycle repeated for 2-3 months and I don’t remember how I felt during those days. I guess I ignored how I felt and focused on the computer. But now, every time I remember this, I burst into tears, I cannot help myself. I feel so guilty for letting her do this, every single day. I mean I had my own legs you know, I could’ve have go outside with her and then I can get back home after we stop at that pastry shop.
I might be getting upset about this specific thing but looking at the big picture, I was actually feeling guilty towards all the things she had to go through alone. Even if I was with her, I was just a kid. I couldn’t help her that much. And I had my own selfish moments as well. I still feel guilty about the computer she bought for me on my 14th birthday. She couldn’t made enough money but still, she was doing the thing that my dad didn’t do. She was actually spending that little money she earned for us, for us. She tried to make me happy. She actually bought me some furniture, a bed, a desk a closet and I remember it was a bit rushed, so I couldn’t think it through. I couldn’t block her so she bought this enormous gift for me. It was really nice for a week, I was really excited, but then I started to feel guilty again. I wish this didn’t happen, I wish she didn’t spend all this money for this, i thought. And I was even embarrassed of it, of the furniture i had. Years passed, I went to another city for university and those furniture kept waiting for me. I didn’t use them, so I found someone on the internet and sold all the furniture for like 350 dollars and gave the money to my mom. She was in need of some money then, so it was a nice move. I had a relief by doing this.
So this feeling kind of haunts me. I feel the same thing with him. I feel so guilty because of all the love that is directed towards me. I feel like I cannot love them in the same way and that makes me really upset.
I’m really curious about what these stuff would make you think.
February 13, 2021 at 10:16 am #374615
- This reply was modified 2 weeks, 3 days ago by miyoid.
Regarding your boyfriend- seems to me that he is a decent, good person but very troubled. I think that he got more troubled after he moved in with you than he was before moving in with you. He has been repeatedly feeling guilty for hurting/ upsetting you, and that guilt has been harming his mental health for about a year.
Regarding the ultimatum of him losing you if he doesn’t get therapy- I don’t think that he is in any danger of losing you because of your severe separation anxiety: no matter what he does or does not do, you will choose to be with him.
Your severe separation anxiety has been hurting not only you, but it has been hurting him too: it’s been keeping him a prisoner of guilt, wanting to move out but afraid you will be too upset living without him.
“this upsets me, because he’s willing to do all these kinds of stuff, including having some financial problems as well to give me a break”- he wants to give you a break from being hurt and upset, and he wants to give himself a break from feeling guilty for upsetting you. He prefers to pay more money to live elsewhere and/ or to be “uncomfortable at some sofa he doesn’t like”- because guilt is very painful and freedom from guilt is a breath of fresh air!
Regarding your mother- you spent a lot of time in front of the computer when your mother worked long hours because the computer was a distraction for you, a way to not feel so terribly lonely and anxious. You feel guilty for your mother going out and bringing you a pastry while you were at the computer, “I had my own legs”, you wrote- yes, you had legs, but you also had severe anxiety that required the distraction that the computer provided.
“I was actually feeling guilty towards all the things she had to go through alone”- you were very much alone yourself, terribly alone. Have empathy for yourself for having been alone and anxious for so long.
“I had my own selfish moments as well”- as a child, you would have done anything and everything for your mother, but she (and other adults) severely neglected/ abandoned you, so you did your best to not care, to emotionally withdraw from your mother- so to not feel even more hurt every time she left you alone.
She bought you things, pastry, food, a computer, furniture.. she was financially generous to you, but she didn’t give you what you desperately needed way more than any material item and all material items put together- her time, her loving attention, the feeling of safety being with her.
anitaFebruary 18, 2021 at 11:49 am #374815
I suggested to you in my recent post (and earlier) that you suffer from severe separation anxiety (starting in the context of you as a child, with your mother, and currently, as a young adult with your boyfriend). TeaK, a member, posted today for the first time a reply in another thread, Stuck in letting go and worries. She explained attachment theory so well that I asked her if I can quote from her reply for you, hoping that it can help you understand the concept better. She agreed, so here is the quote:
“I don’t know if you’re familiar with the attachment theory, which talks about different attachment i.e. bonding styles between the parent and the child, which then affect our adult relationships as well. If we had secure attachment with our parents, we won’t be that clingy and needy, and will be able to give the other person room to breathe, so to speak, and allow them to have their own interests and hobbies, which might not always involve us.
If we didn’t have secure attachment, there are two scenarios: 1) we will either become very clingy and anxious, constantly fearing that we’ll be left alone, or 2) we become afraid of intimacy and closeness, and want to be left alone, especially when the other party is clingy and insisting on intimacy. The first is the so-called anxious attachment style, which would be yours, and the second is the avoidant attachment style, which seems to be your ex boyfriend’s style.
I too was the anxious party and literally thought I would die when my boyfriend threatened to leave me. I felt like I was falling into the ground and disappearing. I thought I won’t be able to survive without him…
Fortunately, I could work through my fear in therapy, and realized that when I am obsessing about him, it’s the small child inside of me scared of being abandoned. I realized I won’t die without him, and it made things easier. From then on, I wasn’t clinging on to him so much, wasn’t controlling his every step, I could allow him room to breathe. And the result was that he didn’t feel threatened any more and spontaneously got closer to me. As I stopped clinging on to him, he stopped resisting and running away. Now we’re married”.
anitaFebruary 19, 2021 at 5:12 pm #374960robbieParticipant
Dear miyoid, Not to be dramatic, I had a horrible/violent childhood. I do think back, now and then, but I find due to circumstances it does more harm than good. The fact that you go back to a time that was special, you were loved etc., there’s nothing wrong with that at all. From what I’ve learned (through Buddhism among other things) is we shouldn’t reside there nor in the future. The only thing we have is today, right now. Once I learned that lesson and retooled my thoughts, I felt a whole lot better about everything. I forgave my mom years ago (dad always said she did the best she could) and rarely think of those times. Same with the future. I’m not in very good health (Primary Progressive MS). I cannot go down that road either as I will spin out of control. I hoped what I’ve said makes sense, lol. More importantly, I hope I’ve helped you in at least a tiny way.February 20, 2021 at 12:33 am #374972TeaKParticipant
I’ve just recently joined the forum and anita made me aware of this thread, so I’ve read through most of the conversation, including the excellent remarks made by anita.
It does appear your core wound is that of emotional abandonment, of not receiving enough love and care as a child. What is important to understand here is that the child always blames itself for not having its need met – it never blames the parents.
You too are blaming yourself, you said “I wish I could’ve make their lives better”. You also said you don’t think you’re worthy of e.g. enjoying a nice holiday with your family. This is a typical reaction of a wounded child, who believes that if only she would change, the parents would finally give her love and attention. Probably a part of you believes you’re undeserving of love, because again, you blame yourself for not having your emotional needs met.
I would like to tell you that there is nothing wrong with you and it’s not your fault that you weren’t taken care of properly. Also, you need to understand that your needs were justified – we all need care, attention and affection to develop properly. Without it, we suffer and wither, like flowers without sunshine and water. A part of your healing is in understanding that you did need love and affection, that it was justified, and that you didn’t expect anything out of the ordinary.
Regarding your boyfriend, you say he was like a caregiver to you and is capable of loving people (when he’s mentally stable). You said “He cares for the people for who they are, such a loving person.” From your words it seems that he was willing to listen to you, and this means a lot to you, because having someone to simply listen to us and witness, without judgment, is huge. It’s one of our core emotional needs. And probably this is what you were missing from your parents. You said your mother didn’t really care about your problems, she minimized them. She wasn’t seeing you for who you really are. Your boyfriend filled that gap. At least this is my understanding of your interaction.
But as you’ve described, he can provide support to you very rarely, due to his mental instability. So he’s there but not really there. As anita said, it seems like a re-creation of your childhood wound, with the difference that at least he’s there for you sometimes. But many times his behavior hurts you pretty badly, e.g. you never know what he’ll do next, if he’ll cheat on you, or act out in other ways.
You may justify it that it’s not his fault and that he doesn’t mean harm, but even so, in his current condition he isn’t capable of truly loving you. There might be some elements of love, like him being honest about the urge to cheat, or having the decency to move out after he’s cheated on you. But the bottom line is that he cannot stop himself from acting in hurtful ways. Even if he’s aware that he’s hurting you. His mental illness is stronger.
And it’s not your fault that he’s acting like that – it’s his mental illness. So don’t make the mistake of blaming yourself. It’s not your fault and you cannot really help him. He would need professional help.
What you would need is to get in touch and embrace your wounded inner child – that little girl that never got the love and attention she deserved – and be a good parent to her now. As you would water and care for a beautiful, fragile flower, or as if you would care for a precious puppy, you now need to care for your inner child. You can have a doll or a similar fluffy toy as a representative of your inner child, and you talk to it, you put it in your arms, hold it in your lap, you protect it and care for it. Whenever you feel afraid and anxious, you talk to your inner child and console her. You give her the care and attention you haven’t received as a child.
But it’s important to even acknowledge that your little girl exists within you, that she has legitimate needs for love and affection, and that it’s not her fault that she didn’t get those needs met. Now it’s time to compensate and give her the love and care she never properly received. You can do it alone or with the help of a professional, but that’s the path to healing, I believe.February 20, 2021 at 6:51 am #374976
* Dear TeaK: I wanted to jump in here so to express to you what an incredible high quality reply you submitted above, for miyoid (and replies to other members in other threads). I am very impressed by your intelligence, knowledge, creativity, wisdom, gentleness, empathy, kindness, writing skills and talent. Your participation in the forums, in this thread and in any other thread you choose to respond to, is greatly appreciated.
I hope you are okay, and please do not miss TeaK’s post.
anitaFebruary 20, 2021 at 11:33 am #374988TeaKParticipant
Thank you dear anita for your kind words.February 23, 2021 at 3:47 am #375092
Dear Anita and TeaK,
Thank you so much for your kind and detailed advices. I will be reading again at home and I’ll try to implement these. I’ve read last posts at the office and it was hard for me to not cry during those moments. If someone is understanding me, showing me empathy or showing me kindness about these deep topics, I burst into tears, I cannot help it. Although I show ultimate attention to not cry in front of others, and that does not include my boyfriend. He is the only person right now that listens, cares that much and can stand my crying. Therefore, It will be really hard for me to get used to live without him or be without him even for a week. He completed his finals and planned his trip to his hometown. He’ll be gone this Thursday and I don’t know how much he’ll stay. I encouraged him to not hurry, stay calm and decide for the moving thing later. I don’t want him to feel all alone but he feels that way, I suppose. He doesn’t see her hometown as a place to live, stay. He doesn’t feel home in our current home, I guess. But I have a feeling that he’ll miss our home and realize that it was like home, after he has left it and I feel sorry for that already.
During the Valentine’s Day, he bought some flowers and a little gift. I had bought a gift box as well. We’ve spent our day like we were still valentines. He was a bit stable, then. Days went by and we were good, we were separate, but we were together. I even thought it can be good again and we can keep going. I still have doubts. I’m ready to forgive him, I might’ve already done. He, on the other hand, would never forgive himself.
Today, he feels bad again. He texts me saying he doesn’t want to exist at all, again. I can get professional help as long as I have this exhausting job. I even got an appointment for the next month, an online therapy. But it seems like there are not any psychiatrist or psychologist good enough to help him. I don’t know what can be done, he doesn’t know as well. Being abandoned by one of the best and the most expensive psychiatrists around here, he feels helpless, I guess.
I’ll have to keep going by waking up everyday, running to the office, working for hours and hours, getting back home exhausted, sleep for a couple of hours and do the same thing over and over. That would be the case whether he stays or leaves.February 23, 2021 at 6:35 am #375094
Although trying to run from the possibility of pain seems a little childish and that’s what I’ve been doing. I guess I’ll have to accept the things as they are and try to get better with my own help, not anybody else’s.February 23, 2021 at 7:20 am #375099
You are welcome, good to read back from you!
Ten days ago, you wrote about this man: “He actually taught me so many things about love.. He was like a caregiver… someone capable of loving people. He can grasp that our souls matter more than any other thing. He cares for the people for who they are, such a loving person”.
Today you wrote about him: “He completed his finals.. he feels bad again. He texts me saying he doesn’t want to exist at all, again”-
– He has enough self-control and self-discipline, enough mental health, to study and take his final exams. But he does not have enough self-control/ discipline to not tell you, once again, that “he doesn’t want to exist at all”?
“such a loving person” who cares, a caregiver, does not threaten to kill himself again and again, shaking the soul of the woman he supposedly loves, a woman he knows to be attached to him.
If to him, your soul matters more than any other thing, why has he repeatedly hurt your soul, and did today as well? If he loves you, if he cares… he would say to himself something like: I feel like I don’t want to exist, but I will not text miyoid to work and make her feel bad. She works so hard, for so many hours, I don’t want to worry and exhaust her further. I will keep my feeling to myself, at least until she comes back home.