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I’m addicted to nostalgic feelings and it only makes me feel worse, I guess.

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  • #387115
    TeaK
    Participant

    Dear miyoid,

    good to hear from you again! I am glad you feel a bit more empowered to reject the advances of people whom you don’t like and choose those who you better resonate with:

    When I’m able to reject, when I can understand whether or not I’m interested, this gives me a bit of power since normally I consider myself as someone who cannot choose. I realized again, that I can choose.

    I am also glad you have broken up with your ex boyfriend and are seeing someone new, who seems promising:

    And the reason why I let this flirt happen is that this boy actually started to give me some reasons to trust. … My gut is telling me that he’s very sincere.

    Since I did admit I was feeling unsafe and bad, he tried to support me and tried to understand.

    As for your crying, right after you’ve experienced a deeper connection and had a fruitful conversation with the new guy – I believe it’s your abandonment trauma re-activated again. When you start feeling a hope for connection, for a loving and nurturing relationship, the trauma of having been abandoned by the people love you love gets triggered. Your subconscious mind jumps immediately to the unfortunate outcome: I will be abandoned. And this makes you cry inconsolably.

    I don’t think you’ve shared before that your mother actually left you after the divorce to go live with her brothers, while you stayed with your father. (You did say she abandoned you physically, but now you explained how it happened). Your father was narcissistic and didn’t really want to care for you, so he left you at his friends while he went to his hobbies. Which means he didn’t want to spend his free time with you, maybe even his weekends?

    This is quite devastating for a child. First, your mother abandoned you, and then your father too. You were left at some strangers’ place, to play with their child, who wasn’t even your friend – I can imagine the terror of that. No wonder you started crying as soon as the first distraction had worn off – because the pain of having been abandoned was so big. Nobody wanted you, because these people of course didn’t want to deal with a crying child the whole day. So you felt not only abandoned, but also unwanted. Not just by your parents, but other people as well…. by everybody…. This I believe is the core wound of yours…

    And this wound used to get triggered whenever your ex wanted to leave you, or you thought of leaving him. The pain of being alone was just so unbearable for you, that you’d rather stayed, even in a very unhealthy relationship.

    In this new relationship, try to be aware of this dynamic and this wound which is telling you “I will be abandoned”. You feel unsafe because of the prospect of being abandoned. If you could soothe your inner child, telling her you won’t abandon her, perhaps you could reduce the anxiety you are feeling…

     

    #387247
    anita
    Participant

    How are you miyoid.. please post again.

    anita

    #388462
    anita
    Participant

    A month after my last inquiry: I hope you are okay, miyoid.. are you?

    anita

    #389212
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    On October 4, a month and 25 days ago, you wrote: “at that silence, I felt so miserable…  feeling that weird, ugly feeling deep down. I don’t know if it was anxiety, I am not sure. But in those moments, I cannot help but cry and the most memorable feeling would be feeling unsafe… these mental breakdowns make me feel so vulnerable that I miss the last person I was able to be comfortable crying in front of. It was my ex-boyfriend. Sometimes I just want to call him and ugly cry, and I know that he would try his best in terms of understanding and helping. I guess I was able to express how confused I am”-

    – Something about that ex-boyfriend of yours, who I thought was a terrible boyfriend to you, something about his attending to you,  made you feel better when you felt that “weird, ugly feeling”? Better than anyone has made you feel in a long time, and maybe for as long as forever?

    I am sorry that you were not helped here, by posting here. I hope that the psychiatrist you’ve been seeing back in October is helping him, and that deep inside you are a bit less lonely, a bit more able to choose, a bit stronger.

    anita

     

    #389215
    miyoid
    Participant

    Dear Anita,

    It feels weird since I felt like opening up tinybuddha and reading the topics, and I’ve seen that you’ve replied to this topic 8 hrs ago.

    I know that I can tell more, in time, if he wants to listen“- ask him if he wants to listen, if he is patient and can wait and be gentle with you, not pushy, not demanding.

    I feel like he has lots of stuff to open up to me, maybe more traumas than I have. He has been an understanding person even if he acted a bit weird sometimes when I act cold, and then we both apologized for our behaviours. I feel like he is the most adult relationship I’ve ever had. I can be more open, still, I have the fear of abandonment and I feel anxious when I don’t get an answer for like 5 hours. But I know that’s my problem and he doesn’t make me feel insecure about losing anything. He has been giving me signs, telling stuff, or reminding me that he loves me during the week which makes me feel safe. Sometimes a few times in a day, sometimes a few times in a week. I can feel and observe how my thoughts and anxiety can differ accordingly with his words and I also see that it happens within my mind. I don’t know how stable he is with his emotions. I tend to be very unstable with mine, and he is like me in so many aspects. But my fear of abandonment actually prevents me from being unstable regarding the love or affection I feel towards somebody since my fear doesn’t let me be free or be myself, I guess. Or maybe I’m just loyal and I see it like this. However, fear of abandonment preventing me from being unstable in relationships and making me loyal is the most rational thought I can find in this pond of thoughts. It makes sense to me.

    Your subconscious mind jumps immediately to the unfortunate outcome: I will be abandoned. And this makes you cry inconsolably.

    Yes, this is maybe the most powerful self-sabotage I have in my mind. And I try to distract myself from that, just like in my childhood. I distinctly remember that whenever I wasn’t able to distract myself with the computer, with a game, or something interesting, I was suddenly depressed and suffocated. I couldn’t help myself but cry in those times. Then school started and I learned to press those emotions a bit. They only broke out rarely, when something I couldn’t resist happened. Like a little fight where my emotions got triggered and at the end, I couldn’t help myself but cry because my necklace was broken. I wasn’t sad at the necklace, it didn’t mean anything. I was just highly affected by the incident and I couldn’t hold myself. But I told everyone that it was the necklace and it had a meaning to me. I was in 4th grade then.

    I don’t think you’ve shared before that your mother actually left you after the divorce to go live with her brothers, while you stayed with your father. (You did say she abandoned you physically, but now you explained how it happened).

    This abandonment was a bit vague, that’s why I still have a hard time understanding it. I cannot recall how many months it took, but first, she left us for a while to go live with her brothers. I must’ve spent at least 2 months or maybe more time with my dad. Then I guess they’ve seen that I wasn’t able to endure, my mom made my uncle come and get me so that I can be with them in that city. After some time, we were back in our hometown and my mom left my mom officially so I kept living with my mom. I have never thought this period has given me some damage till 2018. Only after that year, I’ve started to understand I was experiencing the same emotions when something bad happens or when I’m faced with abandonment.

    Your father was narcissistic and didn’t really want to care for you, so he left you at his friends while he went to his hobbies. Which means he didn’t want to spend his free time with you, maybe even his weekends?

    He is actually very emotional. He even feeds off of emotions, sad ones. But he is very bad at empathy and expressing his emotions. He wasn’t able to connect with me on an emotional level rather than the intellectual stuff he tried to impose upon me. I’m very grateful for that intellectual stuff, he actually contributed a lot to the person I am today. But I can also see how he affected me and gave me damage. I’m guessing, thanks to him, I have a very hard time trusting people, and just like him, I always have doubts about people. I always think about the worst-case scenarios and even after the tiniest tip that people gave away, I always think that they might harm me.

    He was around when my sister was a child and a teen, so he affected my sister way more than he did to me. She acts exactly like a narcissist now. For my father and my sister, there are two types of people. The ones that they own, and the ones that they don’t own. My mom and me, since we’re family, they have always owned us, and they didn’t care about our families. They only got what they could get from us, they got their nutrition as much as they could get and we were nothing at the end of the day. For the people they do not own, they are charming. I’ve had so many children at my school during my primary school that hated me since he was my father. They thought that this was an amazing thing and they even used to envy that. But they didn’t know the whole story, they didn’t know how he behaved at home and the weird thing is, I was lost in this contradiction as well. I didn’t realize what was happening, I was just lost.

    I also got lost explaining how he is, but yes, his understanding of time was having me read books or having me study, that was all. He was my teacher, nothing more. I have no memories of hugging him in a way that would make me feel safe. And I didn’t know that I needed that then, I was just doing what I was taught. If I had known that, I would just teach him how to do it. But I’ve always been so introverted near him. I didn’t have the courage to ask something like “can I play with the computer” let alone show affection. But I know that he didn’t know how to do it either. So I cannot feel any anger or grudge towards him, but I have my regrets even though I know I’ve done my best. It’s weird how people can have regrets for something they didn’t do, maybe that’s empathy or self-sabotage, I’m not sure.

    – Something about that ex-boyfriend of yours, who I thought was a terrible boyfriend to you, something about his attending to you,  made you feel better when you felt that “weird, ugly feeling”? Better than anyone has made you feel in a long time, and maybe for as long as forever?

    Yes, I would say so. He was the most understanding person when he was the good version of himself. But at other times, he made me feel really bad too. I know it was really unhealthy now and I know it was the good thing to do, even if I wasn’t the person who broke it off. He was powerful enough to do it. I still feel weird about him, I sometimes miss him and see him in my dreams. It’s a weird feeling, I’m not sure if I’ve mentioned that here before but I feel similar emotions towards my mother. I feel lots of guilt. I feel bad because of the hard things they have to or had to endure. Both of them made me feel bad but both of them didn’t do it on purpose. I know their hearts, so I cannot feel any bad feelings towards them, only the good ones. So it’s very hard for me to forget him. But I know that this is the right thing, to move on.

    I am sorry that you were not helped here, by posting here. I hope that the psychiatrist you’ve been seeing back in October is helping him, and that deep inside you are a bit less lonely, a bit more able to choose, a bit stronger.

    Don’t be sorry, just being understood is very valuable and I don’t think I’m not being helped. I’m trying and observing, writing here everything makes me observe even better and you pointed out things that I wouldn’t be able to find or interpret myself. I’ve been seeing the psychiatrist approximately every other month, online. It’s not in-depth yet, it’s going very slow. But I feel like I shouldn’t expect too much, I’m giving it time, she needs to know me first as well. As for him, I guess he hasn’t been able to find “the doctor” yet from what I’ve heard but my fingers are crossed. I sincerely want him to be happy.

    Other than that, things are going well for me. Mundane challenges, my job, stuff I try to enjoy. I try to read more, understand more. I don’t know what else I want from life but I guess I’m working on the security first. Both in terms of emotions and finance.

    #389225
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    So good to read from you first thing this Tuesday morning (my time), and such a long and detailed post! First, I want to summarize what you shared on Oct 4 and today, Nov 30, in my own words, adding quotes from you because you say it best:

    On October 4, you posted after an absence from your thread of 2 months and 10 days. You shared that during this absence, you visited your father in your hometown, had a mental breakdown there, stayed at your step father’s empty house for 3 days, had fun there, “accidently had a fling“, then another guy flirted with you and you were “able to reject” him, which made you feel “a bit of power“, being able to choose: “I consider myself as someone who cannot choose… I can choose… I’m learning to choose for me“). You started a relationship with a “very sincere” new guy, “My guy“, as you referred to him.

    Almost 2 months later, November 30, you shared that your guy has “maybe more traumas” than you have, that “he has been an understanding person“, and that this relationship is “the most adult relationship” you’ve ever had. You “can be more open” with him, and you still fear abandonment. But you know that this fear has to do with your childhood and not with your guy’s behavior. He has been reminding you that he loves you, “sometimes a few times a day, sometimes a few times in a week“.

    On Oct 4 and Nov 30, you shared this about your emotional experience as a child, an emotional experience that you keep re-experiencing as a young adult: when you were able to distract yourself with a computer or with a friend who interested you, you were okay, but the moment you lost your interest and were not able to distract yourself “with the computer, with a game, or something interesting“, right when you were not focused on something that could distract you, you felt “suddenly depressed and suffocated“, “a deep longing I couldn’t stand but cry“, “so miserable“, feeling “that weird, ugly feeling deep down… feeling unsafe and bad…so vulnerable“, having “these mental breakdowns“, and you “cried a lot“. You shared: “almost always, after some distraction hours with other people, I accidentally found a moment to feel like myself again and I started crying”.

    I want to understand that feeling, that suffocating, “weird, ugly feeling deep down”, and I think I know this particular feeling: I was maybe 10, I was dropped at my aunt’s house, a few hours away from my mother, to stay there for a few days without my mother. There was food and children and I was treated well, but I remember a moment when the smell of the food became overwhelmingly unpleasant, and I felt intense repulsion and panic, as if the smell was going to kill me. I remember being surprised about it, because I never experienced this before. I remember not understanding what was happening or why. I remember panicked, walking out of my aunt’s house and standing as far away from it as possible so to escape the smell, but the smell was still very strong. I don’t remember what happened next, but it probably qualifies as a mental breakdown. And as a result of that mental breakdown, inconsolable crying I imagine, my aunt contacted my uncle as soon as possible. He was the only one with a vehicle, a scooter with a sidecar, and he gave me a ride in that sidecar all the way back to my mother.  I remember how anxious I felt, how impatient I was to be back with my mother. When he stopped for gas, my anxiety went up, when he was back on the road. I felt a relief, I could breathe again because I was getting closer and closer to my mother.

    Can you relate to this?

    I hope that you don’t mind that I explore my experience above a bit further, on your thread. My little research may help you as well as helping me:

    calm clinic. com/ anxiety/ symptoms/ sensory problems, reads:  “Anxiety can affect your body in fairly unusual ways. While you may be aware that anxiety can cause your heart rate to increase and your body to sweat, you may not be aware that anxiety can have a much broader impact on all of your senses. In this article, we’ll look at a small sample of some of the sensory problems caused by anxiety, and discuss what you can do to control these experiences… From vision to touch, anxiety can affect you in nearly every way… Every one of your senses can be affected by anxiety in different ways. Anxiety can also lead you to develop more long-standing issues, where you start to experience unusual physical symptoms that don’t generally fall under the category of anxiety. Let’s take a look at each of the five senses individually and discuss some of the most common anxiety symptoms that fall under each category…

    Touch.. Sensory abnormalities related to touch are common, although often the person suffering from them doesn’t realize that it’s a sensory problem. Anxiety can cause numbness and tingling, especially in the limbs… burning sensations on their skin… hot or cold sensations in their body… Many people also develop an increased sensitivity to pain and discomfort, and others experience a positive touch in a negative way, such as when you hold hands with someone…

    “Hearing…  There is some evidence that anxiety is associated with auditory hallucinations (such as hearing voices), although these are fairly uncommon, according to a 2016 paper on the topic… anxiety can… make it more difficult to pay attention to what’s going on around you… you fail to hear something.. . It can also make the noises you hear around you seem harsher and more grating.

    “Vision… Vision is often affected by anxiety. The adrenaline released by anxiety dilates the pupils, and when the pupils are dilated you may experience any number of symptoms: * Brighter lights and light flashes. * Blurry vision. *Tunnel vision…

    “Taste…  There is some evidence…  that stress changes the sensitivity of taste buds… Anxiety may also cause you to become more sensitive to certain types of tastes.

    “Smell… Anxiety and emotion more generally do seem to affect the way in which a person perceives smells (in terms of the intensity of the smell and how quickly that smell is noticed)… Furthermore, anxiety can make people more sensitive to bad smells. They may focus on them more or notice them more often. That gives the impression that there are more negative smells, when in reality the person is simply noticing them”-

    – this makes it clear to me why, as a child and onward (not as much now), I was so very, very sensitive to physical discomfort such as wearing clothes that were not loose enough, temperatures that were too high, the sensation of sweating. Any and every physical discomfort, so it seems, bothered me so much. Also, sounds sounded so loud and so disturbing, the sun’s light and other lights felt too bright, and touch often felt threatening, and so on.

    About your anxiety, you wrote on Jan 11, 2021: “the anxiety starts from the center of my chest and then it expands. And I keep feeding it, expands more and more. I have to learn not to feed it“. I am more aware today, because of your thread and my research above, just how powerful anxiety is, how much it affects us in so many ways. I wonder if there is anything at all about us that is not greatly affected by severe anxiety. I think that it is right for you and for me to notice when our anxiety goes up, then take a few deep breaths. If we are sitting, get up and walk around, distract for a while (instead of continuing to sit with the anxiety, breathing shallowly, feeding our anxiety with negative over-thinking). Also, I believe that when we are anxious for too long (an excitation of our nervous system), our brains/ bodies collapse into depression (a quieting/ deadening of that prolonged neural excitation). Treating and managing the anxiety should take care of the depression as well, I figure.

    As I reviewed your posts on this thread, I realize how indeed (!!!) breaking up with your ex-boyfriend was indeed the right thing for you to do (“I know it was the good thing to do, even if I wasn’t the person who broke it off…I know that this is the right thing, to move on“): his behavior fueled your anxiety and kept it elevated. Your current boyfriend, on the other hand, even though he suffered childhood traumas,  he does not punish you for his traumas by mistreating you.

    Two more things: (1) As a child and onward, you distracted yourself in front of the computer. Not having had a computer growing up, I distracted myself with extensive daydreaming, often while listening to music from the radio, (2) When I read this in your recent post: “For my father and my sister, there are two types of people. The ones that they own, and the ones that they don’t own…. For the people they do not own, they are charming…  I was lost in this contradiction as well. I didn’t realize what was happening, I was just lost“, I realized that I never read a more accurate depiction of what I experienced with my mother: she owned me, so she told me that I was “a big zero” and often treated me accordingly. She didn’t own other people, so she flattered them, and glorified them: oh-how-great-thou-are, paraphrased, is what she told those she did not own, treating them as her superiors. School peers and other people used to tell me how wonderful my mother was and how lucky I was. Like you, I too was lost and confused by this contradiction, not understanding it. In your most recent post, you helped me understand: thank you!

    anita

    #389249
    miyoid
    Participant

    I didn’t realize I referred to him as “My guy”, I actually opened up my previous post and checked, that was true. I don’t know if it was a mistake but it’s not a usual thing for me to say about a new person. I’m very surprised.

    I consider myself as someone who cannot choose… I can choose… I’m learning to choose for me

    Dear Anita, I’ve missed a huge thing in my post yesterday. These quotes made me realize it. I’m actually trying to choose in time, that’s very correct. I felt more like myself when I was able to persuade my ex-boyfriend into the fact that we could try. Before we have started our relationship, he actually had a mental breakdown as well. And after that day, I kind of persuaded him that we could try it, try to be happy together. And then we have started the relationship. I remember how hard that day was and also I felt like I was the decisive person, I chose him. Even though persuading someone into something like this was a big mistake, I felt like I was slowly learning to choose. Two years passed, I’ve rejected some people, learned to choose more, but something bigger happened last month. We were seeing each other with this boy and acting like girlfriend and boyfriend. But I’ve got some measureless criticize from some people, which was annoying a lot. Someone who I just met and saw me like a sister actually made a comment about him saying that he was just interested in superficial things and he was just using me. He made that comment without knowing him at all, just out of 2 mins of introduction. Then someone from my circle also said to me to stay hesitant since this will be the things I’ve experienced in the past, it’ll take my time, it’ll take lots of effort but he’ll be gone. I could see how subjective these comments were, but I was affected. All in all, I tend to think of the worst-case scenario. I stopped telling details about my own business to these people, started to set boundaries. However, I got upset, since I also started to think that he might actually be using me, or he might be superficial even though he was acting very emotional.

    I couldn’t hold these emotions in for long, after a few days, I started to reveal my insecurities to this boy. It wasn’t very obvious, very small revealings, a few times. He tried to handle it in a good way, and my insecurities didn’t stop. And maybe after 1-2 weeks, when he wanted to meet again, I said that this invitation looked a bit superficial suddenly. I said that I tend to be emotional and I was feeling emotionally involved. Then I asked if we can make this thing a relationship or not. It was one hell of a hard communication for me, I waited anxiously but was very excited, I have never experienced that kind of a burst before. He wanted to meet, we sat at a park, didn’t speak for like 20 mins, and then he said that he loved me. And then that was it, I had expressed what I wanted, I took the risk of losing it, and then it happened. Such power, I didn’t know how good it could make me feel before. So, since we were talking about choosing, there you go. A huge thing for me, I can say that I’m proud of myself since I behave in the effect of abandonment issues a lot, maybe with the excitement and ignorance, I was able to take this risk. Although I was lucky, I don’t know how I would be if I was rejected.

    He told me that he was very scared since he also experienced some bad toxic relationships and he actually told everyone that he wouldn’t be in a relationship again. But then he thought about it and made up his mind, maybe hesitantly, I don’t know. Sometimes, I still get scared of the possibility of him thinking about this again and changing his mind.

    As for the mental breakdown you’ve experienced, I felt lots of sympathy towards you reading it. It wasn’t possible for me to read it without crying. Although I’m surprised how sharp your memory is, it feels very detailed, the emotions especially. Maybe I will remember more as I explore.

    I don’t mind at all, your words always show me more stuff that I’d like to explore. In fact, I’ll be mentioning a thought thanks to this?

    Many people also develop an increased sensitivity to pain and discomfort, and others experience a positive touch in a negative way, such as when you hold hands with someone…

    Not with the physical touch, but I have an increased sensitivity to an emotional touch such as compassion. And this actually makes it harder for me to open up to people, especially when it comes to face-to-face communication. Whenever I open up a feeling that I feel vulnerable with, and whenever someone looks or behaves compassionately towards me since they try to understand or they sympathize with me, I burst into tears. This thing existed since I was a child and because of it, I couldn’t open up to people, especially elders. I’m guessing I should think about this habit of mine more and some stuff would come out of it. Feels similar to the increased sensitivity you’ve mentioned.

    As for the owning, flattering to be able to own others, I see that it can be highly related to narcissist tendencies. Because of my father and sister, I have been reading about these a lot and I’ll be reading more and more. Because I feel like I should understand more, and understanding will also help me get rid of those tendencies for myself as well. Even though I know I’m not narcissistic, at least I don’t feel like it, I realize some behaviors of mine that can be interpreted as tendencies towards there, so I’m also trying to understand those at the moment. But I’m guessing this is not a major issue at all, at least for now. Maybe you would be able to relate to this subject as well. The more I read and watch, the more I can relate and it feels better. I realize that I’m not the person they try to make me see since they’re always bringing up the worst in the people that they own, which is also me.

    Thank you for your amazing communication, it feeds me a lot.

    #389279
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    “I consider myself as someone who cannot choose… I can choose… I’m learning to choose for me”– this is a huge progress in your mind and life: to be someone who can choose!

    Even though it was a mistake to get back together with your ex-boyfriend, the fact that you chose to try, “kind of persuaded him that we could try it, try to be happy together“-this meant that you were a chooser, or as you put it: “I was the decisive person, I chose him“.

    I felt like I was slowly learning to choose. Two years passed, I’ve rejected some people, learned to choose more“- the more regularly you choose, the more practice you get at choosing, the better you’ll be at it, and the better mental health!

    You shared that it annoyed and upset you when someone told you about a guy (without knowing the guy!) that “he was just interested in superficial things, and he was just using me“, and you “started to think that he might actually be using me, or he might be superficial even though he was acting very emotional“-

    – I remember when I was just starting to choose (after living life like a broken ship lost in sea: not choosing my own way, but letting the waves choose for me by taking me any which way), it upset me a lot too, when people told me what they thought was going on and it wasn’t what I thought was going on.  I was still too unsure about my ability to understand reality correctly and choose accordingly, so, their different understanding, however wrong, threatened my confidence in my own understanding.

    Then I asked if we can make this thing a relationship or not…  I had expressed what I wanted, I took the risk of losing it, and then it happened. Such power, I didn’t know how good it could make me feel before. So, since we were talking about choosing, there you go. A huge thing for me, I can say that I’m proud of myself“- I am proud of you too and I am excited for you! It is such power, a personal power that makes a huge difference in one’s life! Back to my imagery of the broken, lost ship at sea: discovering the power to choose is like having an engine and a wheel installed in the ship, and having the ability to direct my own course through the stormy sea (a way better course than being pushed around by the waves, falling and getting hurt).

    As for the mental breakdown you’ve experienced, I felt lots of sympathy towards you reading it. It wasn’t possible for me to read it without crying. Although I’m surprised how sharp your memory is, it feels very detailed, the emotions especially. Maybe I will remember more as I explore“- thank you! I happen to remember that one time I described, but overall: I remember very, very little of my childhood.

    Feel free to remember and explore more here, on your thread.

    Whenever I open up a feeling that I feel vulnerable with, and whenever someone looks or behaves compassionately towards me since they try to understand or they sympathize with me, I burst into tears. This thing existed since I was a child…. Feels similar to the increased sensitivity you’ve mentioned“- an increased emotional sensitivity: others’ empathy feels too intense, and the intensity bursts into tears. This over-sensitivity can lessen with time, just as my over-sensitivity to noise and bright lights lessened in the last few years.

    As for the owning, flattering to be able to own others, I see that it can be highly related to narcissist tendencies…“- It is only recently that I thought of my mother as having Narcissistic features. I realized that in the way she treated me, she was Everything and I was Nothing, which is a strong Narcissistic feature. Connecting this to the topic of choosing: she took away from me the ability to choose by rendering me emotionally disabled/ paralyzed- too scared, too ashamed, too guilty to choose.

    Thank you for your amazing communication, it feeds me a lot“- you are welcome. Our communication is feeding me too, so thank you!

    anita

    #389945
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    I hope that you are doing well, and that you are continuing to make progress in being a chooser and directing your own life!

    You mentioned long ago, in your very first post, on June 7, 2019, that you have “the anxious attachment style with partners” and that you fear abandonment. I suggested to you long ago- not at all as a professional, which I am not- that the mental health diagnostic label separation anxiety disorder in adults fits you. I still believe that you indeed display the anxious attachment style and that you have suffered from separation anxiety as a child, and as an adult. Yesterday I came across the dependent personality disorder (DPD) diagnostic label that I think fits you perfectly. Maybe it will help you to consider this diagnosis and seek an evaluation from a professional.

    My best unprofessional understanding of the term personality disorder is that it is patterns of cognition (thinking), emotional/ physical experiences, and behaviors, that are pervasive and enduring maladaptive patterns, meaning they are harmful. These patterns start in late adolescence or early adulthood, and can last a lifetime unless significant, long-term healing takes place.

    * I was diagnosed (by a professional) with borderline personality disorder, and I no longer fit the diagnosis after about 6 years of healing. I also suffered for many years from features of DPD: the very distressing distrust in my ability to make choices (In my case, I distrusted my ability to make choices as small as which ice-cream flavor I should choose), and from subordination and passivity (see below).

    Paraphrasing my understanding of a personality disorder: a person suffers from a personality disorder when the person regularly and repeatedly thinks and behaves in ways that are harming the person. The person often feels very badly, lots of anxiety and depression, but he/she does not understand much about what is happening and why: he/she lacks adequate insight, if any- which is a hallmark of personality disorders.

    I will quote from Wikipedia on the topic of DPD (including wiki’s quotes from the American DSM-5, and the WHO’s ICD-10) italicizing the print, and I will put quotes of what you shared in bold print.  My comments will be in standard print.

    About choosing: “People who have dependent personality disorder are overdependent on other people when it comes to making decisions. They cannot make a decision on their own as they need constant approval… excessive amount of advice and reassurance from others… they do not have the confidence to trust their decisions“- “I consider myself as someone who cannot choose… I don’t choose people, they choose me. And I stay in their life as long as they continue choosing“.

    About abandonment/ separation anxiety: “These individuals display a fear of separation and cannot stand being alone…(feel) uncomfortable or helpless when alone…Urgently seeks another relationship as a source of care and support when a close relationship ends… Preoccupation with fears of being abandoned by a person with whom one has a close relationship…When alone, they experience feelings of isolation and loneliness due to their overwhelming dependence on other people”

    – “I pick whomever that I can get affection from… my anxiety appears when I don’t get that affection. I always worry about losing that affection I guess, or that person…Between the relationships, there was always suffering, mental breakdowns. I simply didn’t want to continue my life in those moments“.

    About distrust in professional abilities: “(Many have) difficulty initiating projects or doing things on their own (because of a lack of self confidence in judgment or abilities rather than a lack of motivation or energy)“- “I am a person who has many hobbies, interests in life. I am simply a jack of all trades, master of none… I’m stuck in between projects or stuff like that, and I cannot ever feel satisfied with what I did… I realized that all this stuff I thought I loved, I just love the outcome. For example, I thought I loved drawing, designing, handling business, communication, interpreting, video-editing, reading, languages. But I’ve realized, I don’t like the process of doing those… I just wanted outcomes, not processes“.

    About being assertive/ making reasonable demands: “Unwillingness to make even reasonable demands on the people one depends on“- “I still have a hard time demanding. Although, most of the time I don’t know what I need or deserve. Therefore, I cannot demand much”.

    About subordination and passivity: “Subordination of one’s own needs to those of others…  and undue compliance with their wishesPeople with DPD tend to show passive and clingy behavior“.

    About childhood: “People with a history of neglect and an abusive upbringing are more susceptible to develop DPD“- “I’ve had a childhood where I simply didn’t receive any love from my dad and mom’s love was a bit unpredictable, exists and then disappears… emotionally and physically abandoned by both of my parents several times… I thought I was never ‘loved’ and when I finally get the love I need, I’ll get better… my childhood was 90% depressed…  I was just neglected a lot“.

    One of Theodore Millon’s DPD 5 Sub-types is termed “Restlessly perturbed” and is described as: “disconcerted and fretful; feels dread and foreboding; apprehensively vulnerable to abandonment; lonely unless near supportive figures“- I think this sub-type fits you in real life, doesn’t it?

    Treatment: “People who have DPD are generally treated with psychotherapy. The main goal of this therapy is to make the individual more independent and help them form healthy relationships with the people around them. This is done by improving their self-esteem and confidence. Medication can be used to treat patients who suffer from depression or anxiety because of their DPD, but this does not treat the core problems caused by DPD“.

    I read elsewhere that one of the treatment goals of a personality disorder is the goal of “preventing further deterioration”, which I can understand because through the decades between the start of my BPD and the time I was diagnosed with it, my mind and my life deteriorated. I think of it as a ball of mud (dysfunction) rolling down a hill, gathering more and more mud as it rolls down, becoming bigger and bigger.

    Other treatment goals: “regaining an adaptive equilibrium, alleviating symptoms, restoring lost skills, and fostering improved adaptive capacity”- (1) learning skills such as choosing and asserting oneself, (2) changing maladaptive/harmful thinking and behaviors into adaptive/ helpful thinking and behavior, and (3) feeling better, stable- as a result.

    anita

    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by anita.
    #390244
    Nick
    Participant

    <p class=”p1″>If you’ve ever felt uncertain about the things that you’ve done, or the path that you’re on, or the thoughts that you have…Then this is something that is really going to help.</p>
    <p class=”p1″>P.S. Your archetype isn’t the end all and be all of who you are… But. It definitely speak volumes about the true you!</p>
    <p class=”p1″><b>https://bit.ly/3H0fUn0</b></p&gt;
    -Nicky

    #390257
    anita
    Participant

    M E R R Y    C H R I S T M A S, miyoid!

    anita

    #390372
    miyoid
    Participant

    Dear Nick, I couldn’t understand what you’ve meant and I’m eager to learn!

    Dear Anita, thanks for this comprehensive message which again, fed me a lot. Merry Christmas to you too!

    All the things you wrote make sense. I’ll be sharing this with the psychiatrist I’m seeing, which will be 2 months later. In the meantime, I felt like I can work on these key points myself. I’m realizing everyday that I can get better at some subjects. It made sense when you also used the same key points, like confidence. I can see how insecure I can get in my relationships and how much of a compromise I am able to give in order to avoid conflict or maybe in order to avoid another abandonment. And I’m simply afraid of attracting too much attention by wearing the stuff I want or doing make up. I tend to not step ahead to feel better, and wear better, and look better. Of course I always take care of the basic stuff, maybe more than lots of people. I care about that a lot, in a weird way maybe. I never go out with unplucked brows, I always have them ready, even though I have to pluck them like two times a week. But when it comes to make-up, maybe I never feel like I have the confidence for it. Slowly trying to get over that these days, maybe it has been a lot, like two years, but it’s a slow process. Although I like those stuff on other people, this problem is just about having them myself.

    Other treatment goals: “regaining an adaptive equilibrium, alleviating symptoms, restoring lost skills, and fostering improved adaptive capacity”- (1) learning skills such as choosing and asserting oneself, (2) changing maladaptive/harmful thinking and behaviors into adaptive/ helpful thinking and behavior, and (3) feeling better, stable- as a result.

    I’m not really sure if this is what I have, but I clearly have lots of symptoms of it. Therefore, working on myself for two months till my next appointment and talking about this at that appointment seems logical. I don’t want to live a life which I mostly fear of things, and fall behind just because I’m scared of attention or more specifically, the wrong type of attention since I mostly fear of physical attention rather than a mental one. Although it sometimes prevents me from expressing myself further as well. I wouldn’t say that I’m shy, or insecure to share. But I would say that it has effects on me. Sometimes I find myself listening and feeling bad when somebody is speaking about something that they don’t know and I don’t really interrupt. Rarely, I do that, in a weird way, or not. But then, I question my ego.

    Especially these last weeks, I stumbled upon some circumstances where the person I’m talking with has this attitude that I can destroy in just one second. Sometimes, I just didn’t do that. And the other times, I felt my ego a lot, rising. I just obeyed that, and gave some kind of an answer where I put myself ahead. But then, I realized that wasn’t the right thing to do, immediately. I really like feeding my ego, though. However, it’s like, I would like to be able to do it the right way. I would prefer to be in a good position when I do that, I would rather have people saw my knowledge or skills naturally instead of me expressing them. Maybe I’m that much of an egoist! Kidding. But maybe I am! But that can be another type of confrontation, confronting people about the stuff you do, and maybe I am also avoiding that.

    #390422
    anita
    Participant

    Dear miyoid:

    You are welcome and thank you for wishing me a Merry Christmas. Here, it’s been a very, very white Christmas, the snow is very thick, and the temperatures are very low, so I can’t get out in the car (it would take a truck), and so, I am stuck, plus lost power, the internet (got those back, for now), and can’t take a shower because the water pump froze. So, it’s a white and difficult Christmas so far.

    I wouldn’t say that I’m shy, or insecure to share“- I don’t understand this sentence. Would you like to rewrite it more clearly and expand on it a bit?

    I question my ego… I felt my ego a lot, rising. I just obeyed that…  I really like feeding my ego, though… Maybe I’m that much of an egoist! Kidding. But maybe I am!“- it could partly be my lack of sleep, but I don’t understand your references to ego either. Maybe you can, if you will, clearly explain to me what you mean by ego, and what your personal ego is like.

    anita

    #390546
    anita
    Participant

    Happy New Year, miyoid, may the new year be a Year of Choosing and Confidence for you!

    anita

    #391300
    miyoid
    Participant

    Hi dear Anita,

    I feel like I don’t post here quite often for the last 2-3 months. This is both because I am a bit busy, and also when I have the time, I sometimes pretend myself from coming here since it requires lots of thinking. In my every post, I try to keep it deep since we have a deep conversation here. This happened a few times in the past months, I was feeling okay and coming here would mean that I would read my posts again and feel a bit worse. Maybe I should learn how to keep it simple sometimes, without looking into it pessimistic. I’ll try to keep myself optimistic this time.

    I’m sorry about the conditions you had over the Christmas. I hope that you wouldn’t have those conditions again, I am not used to cold weather at all, I’ve grown up in a relatively hot climate and I’m still living in that region. Therefore, in the weathers I feel frozen to the narrow, you wouldn’t feel a thing. Even after those hard conditions, you’re posting here, which means a lot. How can you do that? Maybe we’ve developed a connection, and you are actually answering and helping lots of people which I find amazing and also hard, devoted.

    I wouldn’t say that I’m shy, or insecure to share

    I was thinking what do I do and what I don’t do over these months, actually this was something I should’ve gotten into thinking way before. However, I was distracted with my other stuff so I guess I’ve always postponed this. I am not a shy person, I don’t feel shy. But writing this actually reminds me of my childhood. I was a shy child, growing up, I was not extrovert at all. I’ve got my education till high school at a school where my father was a teacher. This affected me a lot in terms of expressing myself. Not everyone liked me and I was holding the burden of ‘representing my father’ and something I did had the possibility to embarrass him. I don’t know how did this thought had a place in my mind, though. My father might not be responsible from this. After I started high school at a different school, my environment wasn’t THAT successful, since it was a different school full with slightly less successful student which made me sparkle there. I was more confident, even though I felt ugly then. Slowly I started to be myself, act like myself. I was a slightly weird person, and I also started to embrace that in those days. The people liked me because they had fun around me, I was ignoring lots of things at school and focusing on what was funny. However, I still see that shy-affect from my childhood sometimes. Especially when somebody speaks shamelessly about something they don’t know much about. And that makes me think that I don’t feed my ego much, however, I sometimes think that I might have a toxic ego just like my father and sister. I sometimes feel superior to my peers, and that actually creates some kind of a suffering. Since I feel superior intellectually or ethically, I can feel like I deserved better than somebody who is not as intellectual or as ethic regarding behaviors or even thoughts. And when that person has more than I do, then the suffering I mentioned plays role. I actually don’t suffer if we have the same amount of happiness or success, but when that person has more, I feel worthless.

    This makes me think that we should keep this thing in balance. If I feed my ego enough, then that example person is feeding his or her ego more than they should be. But if they’re doing it in balance, then I’m not feeding myself enough. But rationally, I think that most of the people I seem to be bothered by feed themselves and their ego more than they should be. Would you agree to that?

    Thank you for your nice words, I hope that this new year would bring you more happiness than you’ve ever experienced, I hope that you would have an amazing year and also more and more to come!

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