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wouldn’t be a mercy if i just ended my life?

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  • #381218
    Murtaza
    Participant

     that you’re not created differently

    i really don’t care how i was created i only know for a fact that the result of me (this person right here) think and act differently from other people

     

    in a way that guarantees misery

    again, acknowledging the result, yes it does guarantees misery

     

    but that you’ve come up with a belief system which tells you you’re a victim of bad programming

    you missed the point, part of my programming (that guarantees misery) is to do that, its all part of the programming, im just aware of such programming

     

     When it’s much more likely that you are a victim of bad upbringing

    its the same thing, only programming is a more wide word, my upbringing and genes and environment all make me this person right here, whatever i did or do, whatever i thought about or gonna think, whatever beliefs and values i had and gonna have, all go back (when we ask enough why) to the same rabbit hole, the same uncontrollable things, genes and environment, i simply know the facts, aware of them

     

    It is based on the truth of life as you experienced it

    so? that’s enough proof to me, experience is the best observation

     

    For the entire 2 years the child just feels and absorbs like a sponge

    so lets say that a sponge was made (bad genes and upbringing),  can’t you even acknowledge such sponge can be miserable? for all his life?

     

    Such child starts thinking that the entire world is a hostile and dangerous place. He/she bases his conclusions on his personal experience, which he sees as the entire truth

    you should live in iraq for a change, and say that this conclusions isn’t based on the country and house i live in

     

    So when you say, it’s the truth – yes, it’s your truth

    truth is relative, really try living in my mind, without any joy of anything, without a motivation to change, with only few goals (easy way/being not human), then you can advice me and i can take such advice in account, if my little sister advised me about something, i will take her advice seriously, because she have what i have (part of it)

     

    And it started first in your bones and tissues, not in your mind. It started with negative bodily and emotional experiences, and only after that you made a conclusion, with your rational mind, about yourself and the world

    doesn’t matter, the truth is, i enjoy very few things, i am not passionate about anything, my goals are fucked, my desire are fucked, my beliefs are fucked, my will to live none existing, and im basically waiting for death, hopefully i will do it, but its hard sadly

     

     Luckily, it’s possible to change those early emotional/bodily imprints, so that they don’t define our adult lives. That’s what healing is all about

    yes its possible, do i want to ? no, why ? read above, i promised myself two things, one is that i do everything by my rules and way, two is that the only trying im gonna do to improve anything would be death, otherwise im staying like this, and im aware of the combination here (learned helplessness/fear) but i don’t care, i might as well just do it, out of mercy, and then a norime come say to me “permanent solution to temporary problem” sure, your problems are temporary, i really don’t care who judge my life, cause they are all wrong, the only one who can judge it is me

     

    i gotta say, you remind me of something i lost, people, norimes.

    #381226
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    If I may say so, you are brilliant. What I am clear about is that in no way do I feel intellectually superior to you and it tickles my mind to think that at one point I guess, I thought I was.. that I could change your thinking because mine was superior to yours, that I knew better. I laugh at the idea, at this moment. At this time I am typing just as the thoughts and feelings flow out, not editing anything.

    My purpose posting to you is no longer to change you, nor is it my purpose to make you like me by writing what I think you would like to read. Also, I am not sure that you want to read from me because you didn’t address me in your recent posts. So, if you want to read from me in the future, address me by name, will you?

    My purpose in posting to you right now is .. well, I enjoy it, it’s fun for me this morning to entertain your thoughts in your recent post and respond to them (I correct some of the grammar and punctuation when I quote you because it helps me to process your thoughts better):

    “I really don’t care how I was created, I only know for a fact that the result of me (this person right here) thinks and acts differently from other people. Yes, it does guarantee misery. Part of my programming (that guarantees misery) is to do that, it’s all part of the programming, I’m just aware of such programming. Programming is a wider word: my upbringing and genes and environment, all make me this person right here, whatever I do, whatever I think, whatever beliefs and values I have- all go back (when we ask enough why) to the same rabbit hole, the same uncontrollable things: genes and environment. I simply know the facts, aware of them. You should live in Iraq for a change, and say that these conclusions aren’t based on the country and house I live in”.

    “Try living in my mind, without any joy of anything, without a motivation to change, with only few goals (easy way/being not human), then you can advise me, and I can take such advice in account. If my little sister advised me about something, I will take her advice seriously. I’m basically waiting for death.. I promised myself two things: one is that I do everything by my rules and my way, two: that the only trying I’m going to do to so to improve anything would be death- otherwise I’m staying like this.. Then a normie says to me ‘permanent solution to temporary problem’ sure, your problems are temporary, I really don’t care who judges my life, cause they are all wrong, the only one who can judge it is me”.

    My thoughts: part of me hopes that no one but you is reading this part of my post, but I know others will read it as well. I wish no one else reads it because it is quite dark, pessimistic and people like optimism.. no one wants to face the dark truth. The saying that death is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, or temporary problems is half true: death is permanent but the problems humanity faces were never temporary and they are getting worse. It’s not only in Iraq: the U.S. is moving toward autocracy, led by the likes of an evil, truly narcissistic man and his fans- it’s in the neighborhood where I live, in the taproom I told you about. Last summer, in the midst of the pandemic and civil unrest in the U.S., for a few days the sky was covered by smoke coming from massive wild fires, no sun, no blue sky- it had the feeling of the-end-of-the-world.

    It was not just a feeling: taking into account that our planet is becoming more and more uninhabitable, unfriendly to human (and other) life, the climate change and the U.S. moving toward authoritarianism, to be led by people who deny climate change and will not do anything to slow it down.. is there a reasonable way to deny where we are going, what we are approaching???

    I’ve known this for a long time and I think a lot of people know this, but naturally we deny because we don’t want.. or we can’t hold in awareness this truth, not for too  long. People who know how bad it is, scientists who have access to the public- they try to be optimistic because they don’t want millions of people to panic.. and people will turn against a truth teller if they get scared enough.

    I am not rushing to die, like you seem to be, at times, wanting to make it sooner than later because I still find life interesting- notice, not necessarily joyful.. hardly ever (I do feel pretty good though as I type this), but interesting often feels good enough!

    See the exclamation mark right above- I was going to erase it, feeling wrong about it, but remembered that I am not editing. I always hated the word Happy and an “!” suggests Happy. I use it in some posts but I feel more authentic with you.

    I hope you are reading this post patiently because it is long and has a lot in it. More in regard to what I quoted from you: programming by the environment can be as powerful as programming by genetics. As a matter of fact, the environment, such as the experience in childhood, changes our genes. The two: nature (genes) and nurture (the environment) are not separate entities, they interact with each other. I understand you not caring which of the two is responsible for what part of you because they are both powerful and both indeed – unfortunately, I wish it was not so- almost guarantee misery in that humanity is in such deep, deep trouble. We are close to the end result of irresponsible, corrupt and evil politicians and those others in power over the masses of people.

    You wrote: “I’m just aware of such programming.. I simply know the facts, aware of them”- like I wrote before, people can’t hold such awareness for too long, the end-of-the-world awareness. You’ve been holding maybe the .. end-of-Murtaza’s-world in awareness for a long time. How strange, to think and talk about one own’s death- no greater denial than the personal reality of (100% guaranteed) death. This person now typing these words with a brain able to imagine the most beautiful sceneries and magical happenings, all within my brain: colors and images.. and sometimes, remembering the hopes and dreams and desires of childhood, early childhood when all seemed possible.. all this ending in death, all this magic, hope and desire of long-gone past.. it’s hard to grasp.

    I promised myself.. that I do everything by my rules and my way“- talking about all that is uncontrollable in our lives, the rabbit hole you mentioned, this sentence I just italicized is very powerful, meaning it feels powerful to me. I like it. I want to do the same thing myself.. I mean.. not to live by your rules and your way, but by my own.

    anita

    #381235
    TeaK
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza,

    I was trying to point out how our reality and our truth is created, because it means it’s not set in stone, but can be changed. But if you prefer to stay in your reality, that’s your choice, you have the right to do so.

    truth is relative, really try living in my mind, without any joy of anything, without a motivation to change, with only few goals (easy way/being not human), , then you can advice me and i can take such advice in account,

    I understand you don’t have either joy or motivation to change. I’ve tried to explain why you might lack the motivation to change – because it protects you from pain that you may face when dealing with past trauma. I’ve explained that your lack of motivation to change is a defense mechanism. But I also respect that you want to stay in it, at least for the time being.

    Moreover, it seems you’re quite passionate about staying in it:

    i promised myself two things, one is that i do everything by my rules and way, two is that the only trying im gonna do to improve anything would be death,

    So when you say you’re not passionate about anything, not true: you are passionate about staying in your protective shell. Which I respect, although it’s a pity.

    i gotta say, you remind me of something i lost, people, norimes.

    Yes, people cannot enter your protective shell… but that’s the price to pay…

     

    #381260
    Murtaza
    Participant

    What I am clear about is that in no way do I feel intellectually superior to you

    you are though, your post and the information you know, your emotional intelligence, at least from what i have seen, you are a better person then i will ever be, and that’s the truth, though im not comparing, since we have different lives and different minds, i actually never compare myself to anyone, because it will always be unfair and wrong, i have a really low emotional intelligence, i really think intelligence doesn’t matter, since it wouldn’t make the person happy, i laugh when i want to cry, i laugh when i feel bothered, i don’t even know how to deal with anxiety, i ignore it, try to re sure myeslf, doesn’t work, the only thing that works is sleep, otherwise the pain in my stomach never goes away, i have a really low self esteem, and i really don’t know how to make it higher, emotion is like a mystery to me, i need steps, order, to know what to do, when i read online about regulating emotion i just say “what on earth do i do?” i actually would appreciate any kind of advice regarding this subject

     

    I could change your thinking because mine was superior to yours

    if by superior you mean its better for the person then yes yours superior indeed, i actually wish i had your brain and your emotion,

     

     that I knew better

    in life? definitely, in my life? i don’t think so

     

    I am not sure that you want to read from me because you didn’t address me in your recent posts

    of course i do, i just didn’t want to bother you anymore, with pointless posts, you already gave me what i came here for, i felt if im gonna address you, its better be for something important, and i realized my last few replays were pointless and bit repetitive, you said “i quit”, actually i quit too, i just got tired of saying the same things with different words over and over again, of explaining, of talking, although this is the only place to talk to people for me, when the conversation actually worth it,

     

    death is permanent but the problems humanity faces were never temporary and they are getting worse

    the way i see it is like this A. you live, experience both good and bad B. you die, not experiencing anything not even guilt or regret (so you won’t exist to lose the good), in that equation (and here im assuming its 50/50 for good and bad, which is kinda rare) your best bet would be death, unless its something like 80 good/ 20 bad, now in a case where its the opposite, wouldn’t be a mercy, a morally good thing to actually kill the person ? in your past replays you avoided such question respectfully (not disrespectfully) and i took it as yes, because if you would disagree you would provide an answer, this actually was my main post, and i understand why you avoided such question, don’t worry i won’t mention it again, and ignore this section of my replay freely

     

     It’s not only in Iraq: the U.S. is moving toward autocracy, led by the likes of an evil

    i wish my problems were those, something i can blame the country for, then i can just live in some place else

     

    is there a reasonable way to deny where we are going, what we are approaching???

    there is both good and bad, the thing is, the future is truly unknown, we might discover aliens, we might leave the planet, anything could happen really, we even might discover a way to make our life longer

     

    because I still find life interesting- notice, not necessarily joyful

    i actually don’t see anything interesting, i rememer when i wanted to suicide, the only thing i thought im gonna miss, is all the music left undiscovered, all the great albums and songs, that i might like

     

    We are close to the end result of irresponsible, corrupt and evil politicians and those others in power over the masses of people.

    im gonna sound evil, but i like to see the world burn

     

     all this ending in death, all this magic, hope and desire of long-gone past.. it’s hard to grasp.

    what magic? hope? yikes, also you forgot the “all the pain im gonna miss, all the guilt and fears and anxiety and emptiness that im not gonna experience, finally i wouldn’t feel so bad all the time, finally a rest”

     

    I want to do the same thing myself.. I mean.. not to live by your rules and your way, but by my own

    you made me laugh, though im glad we on the same page in this thing

    #381265
    Murtaza
    Participant

    Yes, people cannot enter your protective shell… but that’s the price to pay

    for the sake of just knowing, what would be the price to heal? how can i heal ? what method/things i should do? and do they work actually or just for some people ?

    #381266
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    When I said that I quit earlier, I meant that I quit discussing what does not interest me and/ or when I don’t see the use for the discussion. But I do want to read from you and reply to you any time you post- I will simply skip a topic that I don’t want to reply to. It is possible that I skip a topic that you bring up not because I don’t want to address it, but because I didn’t notice it, or got caught up in another topic- in which case, repeat the topic in a future post.

    As to the mercy killing topic that you brought up: if a person’s life is 80% bad and 20% good, “wouldn’t it be a mercy, a morally good thing to actually kill the person?”- the practice of voluntary euthanasia/ physician assisted suicide is legal in many places in the world, and it is about a certified medical doctor prescribing a lethal dose of drugs to a person who is suffering, and the purpose is mercy. One of the taproom regulars received such a prescription for his wife when she suffered from cancer, but she died before he filled that prescription. Assisted suicide is legal in parts of Europe, the U.S., Australia, and in Canada. People who want a physician-assisted suicide must meet certain criteria, including: having a terminal illness, proving they are of sound mind, voluntarily and repeatedly expressing their wish to die, and taking the specified, lethal dose of drugs by their own hand. I know this does not answer your specific question, but that’s as close as I get to answering it.

    “I have a really low emotional intelligence.. I laugh when I want to cry, I laugh when I feel bothered, I don’t even know how to deal with anxiety, I ignore it, try to reassure myself- doesn’t work, the only thing that works is sleep.. I have a really low self esteem, and I really don’t know how to make it higher, emotion is like a mystery to me, I need steps, order, to know what to do, when I read online about regulating emotion, I just say ‘what on earth do I do?’ I actually would appreciate any kind of advice regarding this subject”-

    – You asked for advice, so here it is: first thing for you to do is to stop trying to find a solution to suffering, stop looking for a way out- for the rest of 2021. For the rest of this year, give zero thought to ending your suffering, completely remove your attention from this topic. Do this today,  let me know how it feels for you, and we’ll take it from there (one step at a time).

    anita

    #381275
    Peter
    Participant

    You asked for advice, so here it is: first thing for you to do is to stop trying to find a solution to suffering, stop looking for a way out- for the rest of 2021. For the rest of this year, give zero thought to ending your suffering, completely remove your attention from this topic. Do this today,  let me know how it feels for you, and we’ll take it from there (one step at a time).

    For what its worth I think that’s good advice from Anita.

    There was a time in my life when I felt similar to what you talk about.  Like you I got discouraged when people  suggested I be more positive. The ‘think positive’ advice, as a defensive pessimist I wasn’t built that way and that wasn’t going to change. I was not going to be able to change my thinking by replacing it with ‘positive thinking’. Then it occurred to me. What if I just left the space blank. That to my surprise I was able to do. I changed the stories I was constantly repeating to myself with no story. A kind of mindfulness I guess thought didn’t know it at the time. When the negative stories came, I didn’t try to change them but more important in time I found I didn’t have to dwell on them. Its difficult to describe.

    I shared some of T.S Eliot’s pomes before. I repeat this to myself when I find myself filling the space of my self talk unskillfully

    I said to my soul, be still and wait without hope, for hope would be hope for the wrong thing”  – I discovered as you mentioned that like toxic positivity, hope is a double edged sword, to easily done unskillfully.  Better not to hope then hope unskillfully.  It is important to say that this is not hopelessness.

    wait without love, for love would be love of the wrong thing;” I was very naïve and didn’t have a great relationship with the ‘idea of Love’. Not having to fill a time of waiting with unskillful stories of ‘Love’ turned out to be very freeing.

    there is yet faith, but the faith and the love are all in the waiting. That the  waiting becomes the faith and love??? I love that.  Challenged me to re-evaluate my relationship with faith and love. *

    Wait without thought, for you are not ready for thought:” How very true for me at the time. Wait without filling the space with stories, negative or positive.  I live in my head so was very surprised to discover it was possible. Those moments when I let thoughts go…

    So the darkness shall be the light, and the stillness the dancing.” The problem of opposites. A change in perspective, the possibility that one can be detached and engaged, still while dancing! Find that the way out of our suffering isn’t the light but first the darkness, isn’t up but going down. A experience discovered in the waiting..

    * Belief is no adequate substitute for inner experience, and where this is absent even a strong faith which came miraculously as a gift of grace may depart equally miraculously. People call faith the true religious experience, but they do not stop to consider that actually it is a secondary phenomenon arising from the fact that something happened to us in the first place which instilled pistis into us—that is, trust and loyalty. – Jung

    Waiting becomes trust becomes a experience one can lean into.

    “If you think you imagine yourself taking the position of esthetic stasis, you’ll understand about withdrawing fear and desire for what happens, and about samsara being nirvana, the still point in the mist of the turning world. That’s all there is to it. Then the world becomes a display of things from which you are disengaged, and yet, voluntarily, you can become engaged “joyous participation in the sorrows of the world.” It is very different from being compulsively linked.”

    Still

    “We would rather be ruined than changed
    We would rather die in our dread
    Than climb the cross of the moment
    And let our illusions die.”
    ― W H Auden

    But then what our our illusions? Choice? Skillful or unskillful choice?

    #381281
    Murtaza
    Participant

    first thing for you to do is to stop trying to find a solution to suffering, stop looking for a way out- for the rest of 2021. For the rest of this year, give zero thought to ending your suffering, completely remove your attention from this topic. Do this today,  let me know how it feels for you, and we’ll take it from there

    im not trying to find a solution, i already know what it is, and if you mean i should forget about it, i really can’t, when i know that its possible, as you said its legal in some countries, and i think its one of the best moves for me, im not only thinking about the present, but the future, i simply know that all this life would be meaningless if i go through it, if i had the choice to end it, i really should, another thing that we humans have a someone kind of a core element, we all want to stay out of pain, and seek pleasure, if by your replay you mean i shouldn’t stay out of pain, without a reward ? i really don’t think this is possible

     

    you said that you enjoy replaying to me, in this post, you don’t sound like you are enjoying yourself

    #381282
    Murtaza
    Participant

     When the negative stories came, I didn’t try to change them but more important in time I found I didn’t have to dwell on them. Its difficult to describe

    in my case i don’t label a thought as negative or positive, that’s an outside judgment, i only ask wither its true or not, i really don’t think you can leave your thinking to blank, you can only be aware of your “bad thoughts” and not believe in them

     

    hope is a double edged sword

    i really don’t like false hope, again i really don’t care about hope or hopelessness, i only care if this hope its true or not, is it true that i might change in the future ? yes, though there is a lot of things that stay with me, false hope (or dreamy thinking) is what most people do things for, a some kind of illusion, i saw that people deprive motivation from such things, i lived in a fantasy world for a long time, but when i saw reality, i saw nothing worth living, and i still don’t, at least in the past the false hope and the dreamy thinking gave me enough reason to think its worth it

     

    #381284
    TeaK
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza,

    i laugh when i want to cry, i laugh when i feel bothered

    If you laugh when you feel bothered, or you laugh when you feel sad, it could be because when you expressed “negative” emotions such as anger or sadness in your childhood, they were unacceptable to your parents, and you might have been punished or faced some other repercussions. You couldn’t express your negative emotions freely, therefore you chose to suppress them and instead cover them up with an “acceptable” emotion, such as laughter, feigning to be happy, or indifferent, or not bothered.

    i have a really low emotional intelligence… emotion is like a mystery to me

    In order to have emotional intelligence, we first need to know how we feel, so that we could recognize how the other person feels and e.g. have empathy for them. If you needed to suppress your own emotions and got disconnected from them – for the reasons I mentioned above – it can easily lead to lack of emotional intelligence.

    i don’t even know how to deal with anxiety, i ignore it, try to re sure myeslf, doesn’t work, the only thing that works is sleep, otherwise the pain in my stomach never goes away, 

    The pain in your stomach can be from your anxiety, and if I understood well, you’re anxious most of the time when you’re awake. Anxiety as a default program can be caused by not having received proper soothing and comfort as a baby and child. For example, if you were left alone to cry in your crib, and nobody came to pick you up, that would be one reason. Or if you were punished for crying, for example.

    i have a really low self esteem,

    If you were criticized and condemned often as a child, that could have caused it. Any kind of parental rejection, or even lack of care and attention, leads the child to conclude that there’s something wrong with them, even fundamentally wrong. That they are unlovable and unworthy.

    for the sake of just knowing, what would be the price to heal? how can i heal ? what method/things i should do? and do they work actually or just for some people ?

    We as children have certain core emotional needs – such as to be loved, nurtured, accepted, appreciated, validated, to feel special to our parents, etc. If those core needs weren’t met and instead we were emotionally wounded – that’s where our adult emotional problems and anxiety stem from. In order to heal, we’d need to meet those unmet core emotional needs, and the best to do it is in therapy.

    You would have to get in touch with your suppressed emotions, but first realize that they are acceptable, that you are allowed to have them. And then you’d need to work in therapy to release them, and to receive what you haven’t received in childhood – love,  compassion, understanding, validation etc. If you’d like to know some more, I’d be happy to answer.

     

    #381285
    Murtaza
    Participant

    and the best to do it is in therapy

    not available, and if you gonna suggest online, i don’t have the money for it

     

    and to receive what you haven’t received in childhood – love,  compassion, understanding, validation

    is this step requires people ? if so then forget it

     

    If you’d like to know some more, I’d be happy to answer.

    yes more, without the need of therapy nor people, just me and as clear as you can be (meaning when you say accept anxiety, i want you to tell me what exactly do i say and do)

    #381292
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza:

    “you said that you enjoy replying to me, in this post, you don’t sound like you are enjoying yourself”-

    – On Wednesday morning, June 9, I wrote to you: “My purpose in posting to you right now is .. well, I enjoy it, it’s fun for me this morning to entertain your thoughts..”- notice the words I italicized: they qualify the time when I enjoyed myself, morning of June 9.  Fast forward to Thursday morning, June 10, I was not enjoying myself. Recently, I injured my hand and when it hurts- I get depressed, when it doesn’t hurt, I feel hopeful/ better. As I am typing now, both of my hands are in braces.

    Feelings change, they don’t stay the same. I enjoyed talking to you Wednesday, I didn’t enjoy it much Thursday, I am not enjoying myself right now.. but I like you and love you just the same.

    Your feelings change too, you have good days and bad days, and sometimes you feel content, May 24: “luckily right now I’m on my good days, when I used to talk to you I had mostly bad days.. when I’m on a good day I don’t feel the need to talk to people or post stuff, I always appear online very pessimistic, I am very pessimistic but there is a good side too, a side I can’t show unless you see me in real life…  right now I’m just not suffering much, so it doesn’t come to my mind..  right now I could say that I’m content with myself”-

    – see the words I italicized: “right now”- same words I used June 9 when I enjoyed writing to you. Those right now moments when we don’t suffer, or when we suffer less, make us desire life. This desire for life is hidden when we are depressed, but it is not gone (not for most people, most of the time).

    Here are more of your right now good feelings: “I already have, a little sister, that loves me, and I love her too.. you even like me, and I feel so warm..  I also like wine..  its a really good movie, watching movies made me desire to be in a taproom…there are a lot of things I’m grateful for having in this life.. my little sister, not only we understand each other, but know most of our qualities, we love each other, I like how she look at me, waking up and not having any responsibility, eating my favorite breakfast, slowly and at peace, while listening to piano music,  smoking in the roof, while listening to my favourite songs, thinking about life, and just taking my time..”- love, feeling so warm, wine, favorite breakfast, good movies, music, taking your time on the roof.

    I wrote to you in my last post: “stop trying to find a solution to suffering, stop looking for a way out”, and you answered: “I’m not trying to find a solution, I already know what it is”.

    “I already know what it is”, but you question it: the question is in the title of your thread: “wouldn’t be a mercy if I just ended my life?”- there is a question mark at the end, making it a question, not an affirmative statement. There is a hidden desire to live in this title, it is in the questioning: “wouldn’t.. if..  ?”

    I do understand your pain and misery. I no longer feel pain the way I used to, but I did feel the depth of misery for way too long. I do not underestimate your pain. I am pointing out to your good right now moments that fuel your inborn desire to live, a desire that is a core characteristic in all that is alive: bacteria, protozoa, fungi, algae, plants, animals, anita, Murtaza.

    anita

    • This reply was modified 3 months, 2 weeks ago by anita.
    #381297
    Peter
    Participant

    hope is a double edged sword

    i really don’t like false hope, again i really don’t care about hope or hopelessness, i only care if this hope its true or not, is it true that i might change in the future ? yes, though there is a lot of things that stay with me, false hope (or dreamy thinking) is what most people do things for, a some kind of illusion, i saw that people deprive motivation from such things, i lived in a fantasy world for a long time, but when i saw reality, i saw nothing worth living, and i still don’t, at least in the past the false hope and the dreamy thinking gave me enough reason to think its worth it.

    I think we agree here though I would not label hope as being something that is true or not true. Hope for me is a skill a person can work on, it’s paying attention, keeping ones eyes open for possibility and then acting on it.  One should not be defined by how one defines a specific hope or goal. Its more of a direction, open to pivot when required. In Buddhist speak its developing a detachment from a specific outcome while engaged.

    I also spent a great deal of time in a fantasy world of hoping for something to magically change and or pretending that it had. Lots of if only this or that, lots of shoulds and unfairs with little action.   Hope with eyes closed.
    Taking time not to hope, as I was hoping for the wrong things, without falling into a trap of indifference and hopelessness created space for me find some peace in the moment.  I have learned to practice hope with care

    in my case i don’t label a thought as negative or positive, that’s an outside judgment

    It can be but it can also be a judgment that comes from ones inner dialog and it can be difficult to separate the two.  Your posts suggest to me that both are present but I could be wrong.

    im not trying to find a solution, i already know what it is

    The advice of taking time not not dwell on ones solution and or sufferings still holds.

    #381302
    TeaK
    Participant

    Dear Murtaza,

    and to receive what you haven’t received in childhood – love,  compassion, understanding, validation

    is this step requires people ? if so then forget it

    🙂 I see you’re not too keen to work with a therapist, and not necessarily just because you don’t have money… I’ll give you some suggestions on what you can do on your own, but I’d like to say first that the core wounding happens in a relationship, therefore healing happens in the context of a relationship too. In our childhood, we were wounded by inadequate, abusive, judgmental, emotionally immature parents. We can heal that trauma with the help of someone who is loving, compassionate, understanding, who will give us unconditional positive regard, who won’t judge us, who will accept us as we are… and that’s a good therapist. It’s much harder (or almost impossible) to do it alone, to pull ourselves by our own bootstraps…

    But what I can suggest for starters is to watch a youtube channel called “Therapy in a nutshell”, which offers very educational and practical videos on how to deal with anxiety, depression, how to deal with emotions, etc. The same therapist also offers more in-depth online courses on her website, and of them on dealing with stress and anxiety is accessible for free.

    If you’d like to share some more about your childhood, perhaps we here can help you too, at least a little.

     

    #381303
    Peter
    Participant

    I’d like to add on to what TeaK Mentioned – I very much agree that a good Therapist would be helpful in the healing of past. They can help you give to yourself what others should have given you.  

    “Sometimes you have to find a way to to give yourself what someone else should have given you”.

    In Jung’s path to Individuation the first task is coming to terms with the mother and father complex. Your parents may have influenced how you relate to the mother and father architype however this is not about one parents. This is coming to terms with your own ability to nurture and protect (healthy boundaries) and provide for yourself. Individuation requires that at some point one takes ownership of becoming their own ‘mother‘ and ‘father‘. Our life experience with our parents and other family  may have given a good or bad examples, and influenced our own ability to care for ourselves but it does not define it. Even so we must take ownership.

    It’s not easy, by the age of 5 most of use have determined how we are we will respond to life. How we will nurture and protect ourselves.  That is what TeaK is getting at. If we want to move past that 5 year old response to life you need to ‘talk to him.

    Last thought. Some mistake the call to ‘love others as oneself ‘ as a command. I view it as the reality in how we love and that if we can’t love ourselves we are going to find it difficult to love others. How you love yourself will be reflected in how you love others and what they intern reflect back to you. (Why relationships are crucibles of self discovery (becoming). The good the bad and the ugly will show themselves).

    You can’t ‘fix’ what others failed to give you but you can start learning to love yourself in more skillful ways.  A part of that will be accepting the things you cannot change about yourself and focusing on what you can.

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